Seperate from Gods love...

[17th Angel]

Seperate from Gods love... Don't have to love god to be on his side?

Romans:8:38 For I am convinced that neither death nor life nor angels nor governments nor things now here nor things to come nor powers 39 nor height nor depth nor any other creation will be able to separate us from God’s love that is in Christ Jesus our Lord....

So... Paul here is convinced... in all of these things? For us?

Matthew:22:35 And one of them, versed in the Law, asked, testing him: 36 “Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?” 37 He said to him: “‘You must love Jehovah your God with your whole heart and with your whole soul and with your whole mind.’ 38 This is the greatest and first commandment...

Ok but you have to give the same back?

John:15:12 This is my commandment, that YOU love one another just as I have loved YOU.

Now I am not being evil or driven by hatred... Or whatever give it a label you see fit... But, I personally cannot love that which I have no concept of, I mean, where is god? How can I love that which isn't present? Sure, heck I can say "I love god!! woooh!" But, I would be lying... I do not love god... You have to build on relationships to be able to love someone... Example my father was never around he was always getting drunk instead of being with his family... His lack of presence meant I had no chance to build a relationship with a ghost... Hence I could not love him... So, I think that is a bum wrap.... That I have to love that which isn't there.....

But then we get this message from the bible.....

1 Peter:4:8 Above all things, have intense love for one another, because love covers a multitude of sins.

Above all things? So not loving god, but doing what I am doing is cool? I notice in the Ten commandments... It mentions nothing about loving god... Sure it says worship... But it doesn't say love....

 

[path_of_one]

I'm a panentheist, so I doubt my answer is the standard commentary.

But I would put forth...

In loving each other, we are loving God. In recognizing the Divine in all beings, we are loving God. In loving the Earth, we are loving God. And we come into relationship with God in this way; as we seek, God answers us. As we knock, God opens the door. The more we use the Love and Light within us to connect to that Love and Light in all beings, the more our measure of this Spirit increases, and the more we experience God.

The more we are the hands and feet of Christ for others, and the more we recognize that we serve Christ through serving others... the more we know Christ, the more real He becomes to us.

I think a lot of the interpretation depends on if you think love is a feeling or an action. I believe love is an action first and foremost.

 

[17th Angel]

In loving each other, we are loving God. In recognizing the Divine in all beings, we are loving God. In loving the Earth, we are loving God. And we come into relationship with God in this way; as we seek, God answers us.

Thank you for the post, I like your thoughts however one thing I have to follow up with another question....

How does he answer??

 

[path_of_one]

How does he answer??

Me, or in general?

 

[17th Angel]

Both.

 

[path_of_one]

I'll give it a shot...

Biblically, He seems to answer in a lot of ways. Burning bushes, angels, swallowing people up in whales, giving them stone tablets. Personally, none of these things happen to me. I don't worry about the Bible's integrity- I don't deny all this stuff in the Bible. But I just recognize that so far, none of this is going on in my life.

Now, that said, I figure God answers every person differently, depending on their personality and what they'll accept, and their culture, and so forth. I happen to be a kind of mystical person. So I get lots of visions and dreams and such.

One way that God answers me or engages with me is through visions or dreams. When I was 10, I actually had my first dream in which I was in the presence of the Transcendent God. It was pretty mind-blowing and it definitely shaped the way I thought about God. Over time, God seems to reveal bits and pieces to me- whatever, I suppose, I need at the time to keep me from thinking I have any clue what God is. It has given me glimpses I believe I could not have generated on my own of God- it is an ongoing experience. The most recent one was even more mind-blowing than the one when I was 10 and is tough to explain, but essentially involved all beings as part of one song that was God. I really hope I get more. These meet-ups with God only happen once every 5 years or so.

Gaia and Jesus seem to be more frequently in meditative visions, from which I get more specific visions about me and my life. I sort of accept that my visions and dreams, though not always comprehensible, are informing my mind and shaping me just as my regular consciousness does. So it's a way of communicating with God without my needing to pick it apart.

I think the biggest way I feel the love of God, though, aside from it emanating from loved ones in my life, is through Nature. I intensely feel the love of God through Nature. Gaia, or the Earth Mother, is sort of like an angel to me. I have a hard time explaining this. The Earth, for me, is like a living Spirit that I can interact with, experience, talk to (and yeah, I get stuff back- I'm odd like that). I think Nature is the Bible of my own ancestors. So I get Jesus and the Christian Bible in one hand, and the Book of Nature in the other. I think God wrote both, and both are love letters of a sort to us. It's just that the Christian Bible is harder for me to interpret, because someone already got the message first and wrote it down and now I have to strip away my cultural conditioning and assumptions to try to "get it" for myself. The Holy Spirit helps. The Earth, though, is just there for me to be the first one to get that message. It's an age-old message, and I feel connected to all my ancestors in communing with Gaia, with the stars, with the moon. Somehow, I also feel, very much (so much I often laugh or cry), the love of God.

For me, being out in the woods or really looking closely at a flower or riding my horse-- it's like these things are a direct connection to God for me. I feel such overwhelming joy and beauty, peace and reverence, gratitude... I feel so fortunate and so beloved that God created all this and saw it fit to think up me and put me in the midst of all this wonder.

I don't know if that makes sense for others. It's kind of hard to explain how much I feel God's love. So often, it makes me feel like I'd just explode if I felt any more loved. Somehow, for me there is just no real gap between gratitude for life, for the Earth, for all beings and feeling that God is answering me.

Maybe it depends on the kind of answers one seeks. I don't really ask specific questions, and if I do, they are of the "what is Your will, what is the Path of Best Harmony, please reveal to me my weaknesses and problems" variety. Whether I am unlocking my own awareness in meditation or contemplative prayer, or speaking to God, I think the answer is the same and arising from the same Divine place. God is in me, answering me through the visions and dreams I receive. I suppose I have asked the Earth a myriad of things, but that's different, since she has her own sense of being-ness, so to speak. She is, like us, a being. The Transcendent God seems more like Being-ness itself. Mmmm... hard to explain and perhaps I should not go so much into the weeds. I think I'm probably bringing in too much of my Paganism given the question being formatted in a Christian manner. But I just can't help it-- in my meditative visions, Jesus and Gaia are together with me. They aren't antithetical.

It's worth saying, though, that I don't really ask many questions of God. So what I mean is that I knock on God's door, so to speak, and God opens the door (He answers). I'd liken it to how little kids will reach their arms upwards to say "hold me." I (literally at times) throw my arms open wide and wait for the Divine embrace, which I feel as a sense of love that is so powerful that it often makes my body shake with energy, makes me cry or laugh, makes me feel a sense of alive-ness that is deeply moving. I guess a sort of ecstasy. The longer I've lived in communion with God, and the more dedicated I am about putting aside the time to do this, to get out into Nature, the more often I exist in a sort of toned-down ecstasy. Like being hugged all the time.

I should really edit this, since it's rambled on and on, but I'm not in an editing sort of mood. So I'll just leave it, though it's not a mainstream Christian perspective. Hopefully you will find some nuggets of usefulness in there.

 

[lunamoth]

John 14: 15"If you love me, you will obey what I command.

John:15:12 This is my commandment, that YOU love one another just as I have loved YOU.

So, I think you and Path are on the right track in that loving one another we are loving God. While I always think of the greatest commandment when I read the word 'obey,' really the ten commandments are about our relationships with each other. The commandments about worshiping God and keeping the Sabbath also point, IMO, to a self-centering that is not selfish, not aimed at our egos or our 'things.'


When we love one another we are participating in a cycle of Love the source of which is God. Thomas has written some very nice posts about this and the Trinity.

 

[Eclectic Mystic]

Alex, if you can think of all the attributes that God would have for which you would be grateful, then isn't it only natural that you would also seek more so to have those attributes yourself?

 

[China Cat Sunflower]

You know what's funny? Jesus is a socialist. The whole Bible preaches labor zionism. But it's hard to do that and still support the neo-imperialist predatory capitalism it took to make Christianity the political force it is, or Israel the political reality it is today. If there's any measure of self-loathing inherent in the post-modern Judeo-Christianity paradigm it's due to the paradoxical nature of the justification of those two things.

Chris

 

[mee]

Re: Seperate from Gods love... Don't have to love god to be on his side?

Romans:8:38 For I am convinced that neither death nor life nor angels nor governments nor things now here nor things to come nor powers 39 nor height nor depth nor any other creation will be able to separate us from God’s love that is in Christ Jesus our Lord....

So... Paul here is convinced... in all of these things? For us?

Matthew:22:35 And one of them, versed in the Law, asked, testing him: 36 “Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?” 37 He said to him: “‘You must love Jehovah your God with your whole heart and with your whole soul and with your whole mind.’ 38 This is the greatest and first commandment...

Ok but you have to give the same back?

John:15:12 This is my commandment, that YOU love one another just as I have loved YOU.

Now I am not being evil or driven by hatred... Or whatever give it a label you see fit... But, I personally cannot love that which I have no concept of, I mean, where is god? How can I love that which isn't present? Sure, heck I can say "I love god!! woooh!" But, I would be lying... I do not love god... You have to build on relationships to be able to love someone... Example my father was never around he was always getting drunk instead of being with his family... His lack of presence meant I had no chance to build a relationship with a ghost... Hence I could not love him... So, I think that is a bum wrap.... That I have to love that which isn't there.....

But then we get this message from the bible.....

1 Peter:4:8 Above all things, have intense love for one another, because love covers a multitude of sins.

Above all things? So not loving god, but doing what I am doing is cool? I notice in the Ten commandments... It mentions nothing about loving god... Sure it says worship... But it doesn't say love....

EXAMPLE
i would think that even if you did not have any contact with your father , if he had left you a book all about him it would have given you a better understanding of him.

Jehovah has left us the bible so we can find out what sort of God he is , it is like a letter from God .
and not only that, he has given us the creation and given us many things , one of those things is Jesus, and Jehovah did say listen to him.

and Jesus said this JOHN 17;3

This means everlasting life, their taking in knowledge of you, the only true God, and of the one whom you sent forth, Jesus Christ.


ITS ALL IN THE BIBLE

 

[path_of_one]

You know what's funny? Jesus is a socialist. The whole Bible preaches labor zionism. But it's hard to do that and still support the neo-imperialist predatory capitalism it took to make Christianity the political force it is, or Israel the political reality it is today. If there's any measure of self-loathing inherent in the post-modern Judeo-Christianity paradigm it's due to the paradoxical nature of the justification of those two things.

Chris

We can't really help what was in the past. What is hard for me, right now, as a practicing follower of Christ is that my society is not socialist at all and I do think Jesus was a socialist. Virtually nothing he says is compatible with capitalism, materialism, and consumerism. His teachings also are not compatible with nationalism. If I followed them to the extreme, I'd be wandering around without shelter or possessions.

But I figure that He would recognize that a whole society of people who do that doesn't work. Someone has to go to work and have the cash to pay for the disciples' lodging, you know?

That said, I have never been able to understand how most American Christians reconcile Jesus' very radical messages about equality, humility, poverty, and brotherhood with ordinary United States society. I am frustrated at every turn in my attempts to do so. I just figure the struggle is worth it, and for some reason, I am unable to ignore the significant gap between Jesus' teachings and my society's dominant culture. It's just too glaringly obvious.

 

[17th Angel]

Alex, if you can think of all the attributes that God would have for which you would be grateful, then isn't it only natural that you would also seek more so to have those attributes yourself?

There is a thing called individuality... I'm a sucker for it.... Sure yes, there are traits I guess... That the creator god of all has been written to have... And I also believe many of them I already have... But how does that get me a relationship? Even if I change myself 100% to be every trait or attempt to be every trait he has? I only see that makes me a mirror image or reflection I don't see how that gets me to him?

John 14: 15"If you love me, you will obey what I command.

John:15:12 This is my commandment, that YOU love one another just as I have loved YOU.

So, I think you and Path are on the right track in that loving one another we are loving God. While I always think of the greatest commandment when I read the word 'obey,' really the ten commandments are about our relationships with each other. The commandments about worshiping God and keeping the Sabbath also point, IMO, to a self-centering that is not selfish, not aimed at our egos or our 'things.'


When we love one another we are participating in a cycle of Love the source of which is God. Thomas has written some very nice posts about this and the Trinity.

Nice post... Intereting way to put it thanks.

I'll give it a shot...

Biblically, He seems to answer in a lot of ways. Burning bushes, angels, swallowing people up in whales, giving them stone tablets. Personally, none of these things happen to me. I don't worry about the Bible's integrity- I don't deny all this stuff in the Bible. But I just recognize that so far, none of this is going on in my life.

I see no bushes on fire, or whales consuming me or angels descending to me.... These are claims from a book. Indeed not in your life either... Hands up who has witnessed any of this?

Now, that said, I figure God answers every person differently, depending on their personality and what they'll accept, and their culture, and so forth. I happen to be a kind of mystical person. So I get lots of visions and dreams and such.

So to me, what my personality would accept and need would be for him to come to me. (I know it sounds big headed demanding of a god lol but you must understand it I guess could be in fear? Or I just need him to say hey... It's cool brah I am freaking here for you.) Then I could grow in a real relationship there he is wow... My head humbly bows and I fall to my knees in pure awe.... I want it too much I guess.... Faith (I know some will go and disagree with me here lol naturally) But it seems so easy for you guys... I want to believe and I want a relationship.... I read the bible and it makes me feel such a monster and so inadequate.... Constantly driving home to have faith to believe in the book.... But I don't feel deep down I do... But I wish to lol I am a fruitloop I guess....

One way that God answers me or engages with me is through visions or dreams. When I was 10, I actually had my first dream in which I was in the presence of the Transcendent God. It was pretty mind-blowing and it definitely shaped the way I thought about God. Over time, God seems to reveal bits and pieces to me- whatever, I suppose, I need at the time to keep me from thinking I have any clue what God is. It has given me glimpses I believe I could not have generated on my own of God- it is an ongoing experience. The most recent one was even more mind-blowing than the one when I was 10 and is tough to explain, but essentially involved all beings as part of one song that was God. I really hope I get more. These meet-ups with God only happen once every 5 years or so..

For you that is totally cool I am glad it happnes that way for you. But how can we be so sure that this dream isn't what we want to hear? Like example... Your mind humouring your thoughts?....

I think the biggest way I feel the love of God, though, aside from it emanating from loved ones in my life, is through Nature. I intensely feel the love of God through Nature. Gaia, or the Earth Mother, is sort of like an angel to me. I have a hard time explaining this. The Earth, for me, is like a living Spirit that I can interact with, experience, talk to (and yeah, I get stuff back- I'm odd like that). I think Nature is the Bible of my own ancestors. So I get Jesus and the Christian Bible in one hand, and the Book of Nature in the other. I think God wrote both, and both are love letters of a sort to us. It's just that the Christian Bible is harder for me to interpret, because someone already got the message first and wrote it down and now I have to strip away my cultural conditioning and assumptions to try to "get it" for myself. The Holy Spirit helps. The Earth, though, is just there for me to be the first one to get that message. It's an age-old message, and I feel connected to all my ancestors in communing with Gaia, with the stars, with the moon. Somehow, I also feel, very much (so much I often laugh or cry), the love of God.

It's late I may be misreading misunderstanding but "the love of god" keeps coming up? But no "My love for god"? I dunno I maybe getting way to wrapped up in this..... Sorry I don't mean to question you're ways and belief... I hope I haven't insulted... :/

ITS ALL IN THE BIBLE

So you believe you can gain a relationship just through a book? Nah, it don't work like that... At least for me and the way I understand the human mind that is.... I go write a book, no one will gain a relationship though that with me... Relationships are phyisical.... I don't mean going and humping his leg... I mean there he is in my presence there I am in his presence... We interact... We gain the trust and respect and flourish in a relationship... A note isn't enough... I am not being funny, trust me, I WANT to be able to have a relationship with an all powerful, all knowing creator of all... In all honesty who the heck wouldn't? Awesome, specially when in need of a favour lol...

Also says in the bible and in your paperwork... The more you read the more you will want to scream and shout and let it alllll out and do more and love god more... I've read the bible and This isn't happening for me?.....

 

[path_of_one]

For you that is totally cool I am glad it happnes that way for you. But how can we be so sure that this dream isn't what we want to hear? Like example... Your mind humouring your thoughts?....

No one can be sure. It isn't a proof for others, it's an experience for me. If it is my mind humoring my thoughts, what difference would it make? I see God as inside me as well as outside, so it's a sort of irrelevant worry for me whether God's love and presence comes from inside or outside.

That said, I seriously doubt the dreams I have had are what most people want to hear. They weren't even entirely what I (at least, the conscious mind me) wanted to hear. It took me some time to process some of them and get comfortable with them.

I think part of the struggle people have with God is that people seek proof rather than just being content with experience. For whatever reason, I could care less about proof. Experiencing God and spiritual ecstasy has always been a positive force in my life and led to good things, so even if it actually was all a farce created by my subconscious or something, I still wouldn't want it any other way since it seems to help me grow, find peace and joy, and most importantly- to love.

It's late I may be misreading misunderstanding but "the love of god" keeps coming up? But no "My love for god"? I dunno I maybe getting way to wrapped up in this..... Sorry I don't mean to question you're ways and belief... I hope I haven't insulted... :/

Not insulted at all- questions are welcome. I was saying how I experience God's presence, or love, as an answer from God. Because you were asking about how I experience the answer. I experience the answer mostly as love.

The Love of God is a two-way street- within me, it flows outward to God, from outside me, it flows back to me. I see the love within myself (of God, of other beings, of Nature, of myself) as coming from the universal source of love- God. So my own love is God's love, too. I love God because God is in me. God is love. I can choose to be an open channel for this love and feel the energy of love pulse back and forth between myself and the Universe, or I can choose to block it, but I find the latter course of action to be pointless.

 

[Quahom1]

There is a thing called individuality... I'm a sucker for it.... Sure yes, there are traits I guess... That the creator god of all has been written to have... And I also believe many of them I already have... But how does that get me a relationship? Even if I change myself 100% to be every trait or attempt to be every trait he has? I only see that makes me a mirror image or reflection I don't see how that gets me to him?




Nice post... Intereting way to put it thanks.




I see no bushes on fire, or whales consuming me or angels descending to me.... These are claims from a book. Indeed not in your life either... Hands up who has witnessed any of this?



So to me, what my personality would accept and need would be for him to come to me. (I know it sounds big headed demanding of a god lol but you must understand it I guess could be in fear? Or I just need him to say hey... It's cool brah I am freaking here for you.) Then I could grow in a real relationship there he is wow... My head humbly bows and I fall to my knees in pure awe.... I want it too much I guess.... Faith (I know some will go and disagree with me here lol naturally) But it seems so easy for you guys... I want to believe and I want a relationship.... I read the bible and it makes me feel such a monster and so inadequate.... Constantly driving home to have faith to believe in the book.... But I don't feel deep down I do... But I wish to lol I am a fruitloop I guess....



For you that is totally cool I am glad it happnes that way for you. But how can we be so sure that this dream isn't what we want to hear? Like example... Your mind humouring your thoughts?....



It's late I may be misreading misunderstanding but "the love of god" keeps coming up? But no "My love for god"? I dunno I maybe getting way to wrapped up in this..... Sorry I don't mean to question you're ways and belief... I hope I haven't insulted... :/



So you believe you can gain a relationship just through a book? Nah, it don't work like that... At least for me and the way I understand the human mind that is.... I go write a book, no one will gain a relationship though that with me... Relationships are phyisical.... I don't mean going and humping his leg... I mean there he is in my presence there I am in his presence... We interact... We gain the trust and respect and flourish in a relationship... A note isn't enough... I am not being funny, trust me, I WANT to be able to have a relationship with an all powerful, all knowing creator of all... In all honesty who the heck wouldn't? Awesome, specially when in need of a favour lol...

Also says in the bible and in your paperwork... The more you read the more you will want to scream and shout and let it alllll out and do more and love god more... I've read the bible and This isn't happening for me?.....

Yet here you are, asking questions and essentially saying (I think) "Let me in". Is that right? He is what happens when a man asks in ernest of God:

Matthew 7:7-8 - Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you. For everyone who asks receives; he who seeks finds; and to him who knocks, the door will be opened. (NIV)
Matthew 6:33 - But seek first his kingdom and his righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well. (NIV)

God is true to his word to us. When one asks of him, he will provide. The question is as we follow his calling is "How can my life count the most for you?" He gave us free will, and will not force usto live for him, but when we trust him, seek him, and seek to live our lives according to his word and his plans for us, he shares the kingdom with us. Not only that, but God gets very personal with us as individuals.

One starts seeing the hand of God, everywhere, everyday, in our lives, in the smallest to the greatest of things. And you know what? He takes one right where they are at, no need to get "right" with God first, or put one's life together.

What about doubt? Sure! He'll take it all, doubt, questions, anger, fear, hope.

There was a day, when God became suddenly, quietly and humorously personal in my life. Before that, He was there but we didn't talk much (I didn't talk much), I kept my guard up when it came to God, because I was afraid of him.

Anyway I was watching this dog chase a rabbit around the yard, when all of sudden this rabbit turned tail and started chasing the dog. That big old dog was confused, not knowing what the hell was going on, and started yelping as he ran away from the little bunny.

Before I realized it I was lauging my ass off, and said out loud "God that was funny"...then to me everything got quiet. And I sensed rather than "heard" someone say "you think so?" Again before I realized it I answered out loud "yes, I did".

God's been on my mind ever since that day. And it wasn't a book that brought him to my intimate attention...just a couple of animals, and my letting my guard down for a moment.

He didn't knock me on my ass, or scold me for making mistakes, or put the fear of well, Him, into me. He just made me laugh, then stepped in closer than I'd ever felt him before. It was a good feeling (wonderful actually).

We've been mates ever since.

Q

 

[mee]

I've read the bible and This isn't happening for me?.....

just a thought ,i maybe wrong about this , but maybe you want things on your terms.
putting ourselves under the mighty hand of God works wonders , blessings come after we do that.



applying what the bible teaches us is a step in the right direction .


if we reject its counsel then we are drawing away from the living God. and the bible says draw close to God and he will draw close to us .

if a person draws away the gap will grow ever larger, but the good thing is, the loving God Jehovah will be there ready and waiting if we are willing to draw close again.

Prayer is not an empty ritual, nor is it merely a means by which to gain something.

A major reason for approaching God is to have a close relationship with him.

Our prayers should therefore be directed to Jehovah God.

"Jehovah is near to all those calling upon him," said the psalmist David. (Psalm 145:18)

Jehovah invites us to come into a peaceful relationship with him. (Isaiah 1:18)

Those responding to this invitation agree with the psalmist who said:

"As for me, the drawing near to God is good for me." Why? Because those who draw near to Jehovah God will enjoy true happiness and peace of mind.—Psalm 73:28.

 

[Dondi]

One way that God answers me or engages with me is through visions or dreams. When I was 10, I actually had my first dream in which I was in the presence of the Transcendent God. It was pretty mind-blowing and it definitely shaped the way I thought about God. Over time, God seems to reveal bits and pieces to me- whatever, I suppose, I need at the time to keep me from thinking I have any clue what God is.

What do you think is the 'catalyst' in you having these dreams and visions, path? This happening at such a young age, I must wonder if there was anything leading up to this point that ignited your receptability to engage these things.

 

[Dondi]

So to me, what my personality would accept and need would be for him to come to me. (I know it sounds big headed demanding of a god lol but you must understand it I guess could be in fear? Or I just need him to say hey... It's cool brah I am freaking here for you.) Then I could grow in a real relationship there he is wow... My head humbly bows and I fall to my knees in pure awe.... I want it too much I guess.... Faith (I know some will go and disagree with me here lol naturally) But it seems so easy for you guys... I want to believe and I want a relationship.... I read the bible and it makes me feel such a monster and so inadequate.... Constantly driving home to have faith to believe in the book.... But I don't feel deep down I do... But I wish to lol I am a fruitloop I guess....

You remind me of someone Jesus encountered...

"And one of the scribes came, and having heard them reasoning together, and perceiving that he had answered them well, asked him, Which is the first commandment of all?
And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord:
And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment. And the second is like, namely this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these.
And the scribe said unto him, Well, Master, thou hast said the truth: for there is one God; and there is none other but he:
And to love him with all the heart, and with all the understanding, and with all the soul, and with all the strength, and to love his neighbour as himself, is more than all whole burnt offerings and sacrifices.
And when Jesus saw that he answered discreetly, he said unto him, Thou art not far from the kingdom of God. And no man after that durst ask him any question." - Mark 12:28-34

Man, Alex, I feel you are so close...so close. I really want you to find what you are looking for, I really do, man.

OK, forget about books. Forget about scripture for a time, if that is tripping you up. Conscentrate on yourself. On all that you are this moment. Forget about the past, forget about the future. Conscentrate on the present, the now.

You are not path, you are not Q, you are not Tao, you are not mee, you are not China Cat, Luna, Dondi, or Eclectic.

You are Alex P.

And if God is there, then He/She/It knows you and if there is going to be an encounter between you and God, it is going to happen in the world of Alex P. Just as my encounter with God happens in the world of Dondi, and path in the world of path.

I was 'born again' at age 12, but I didn't really encounter God for another 10 years. But that is because I stop running and I sat there in a quiet place and opened my whole heart, my whole being out to Whoever is There. At the time, I had serious doubts that I would find anything. But there was a breakthrough. I can't explain it and it won't help you any even if I could. The point is that we are individuals, but at the same time I believe we all came from God. That God is as multifaceted as there are individuals. And this is why you don't have to feel like you are disconnected from God because you are just one tiny speck of dust in the universe. He is able to connect to every speck.

You have to lose yourself to find yourself. I'm not talking about giving up everything you are, I mean presenting everything you are, warts and all, to God. Then you will know that He knows who you are, warts and all. Open up....open up, Alex. Get into that closet alone.

 

[path_of_one]

What do you think is the 'catalyst' in you having these dreams and visions, path? This happening at such a young age, I must wonder if there was anything leading up to this point that ignited your receptability to engage these things.

I think there were multiple things going on. I think most kids are born pretty open to God and the Otherworld, and we train them out of it early on. I wasn't trained out of it. Plus, I have a personality that naturally just kind of "walks between worlds." So, I didn't seem to lose as much of the inherent intuition as I grew up.

My mother follows Christ and has always been a mystic-type. I was raised without church (except occasional Lutheran services with my dad), without doctrine. Instead, I was told from the time I was a baby that God is with me, as close as my own heartbeat. My dreams and visions started farther back than I can remember- by about two I was talking about them. About the earliest ones I remember now were about 5 years old. This is also when I remember the first memories from elsewhere. And as a kid, I lived in a world of connections to animals and the spirit-world. I had lots of "imaginary" animals in my care that spoke with me, and one gaurdian. By about Kindergarten/1st grade, I had worked out some ideas of my own about how the Universe operated, based on my feeling of this walking between worlds.

Instead of freaking out or ignoring my ideas and dreams and such, my mother talked with me about it. I was told to pray to God, and to expect that God was responsive. I was taught that Christ was available. I saw first-hand God care for us while we were in poverty, and I learned to be grateful for just living. But I was never told who God was, how to pray, how to think- never got a box of religion to cage me in. Instead, my mother trusted that if I sought after God, God would reveal himself to me as I was meant to know him.

The result was a continuation of the early dreams and memories, which evolved over time- I get continually more information as I get older and (I think) more capable of handling it. Now, the purpose- why I remember things- I have no real idea. Very little seems to be of use in my current life. I'm not sure if working through the emotional baggage all at once is the point, or if this is a precursor to my knowing myself, my history better in a way that will lead to something in this life.

And I think you are spot-on about your advice to Alex. My point about the Biblical ways of God coming to people was not that these things never happen. It was that every person has a unique relationship with God, and God meets each person differently. God meets me differently than he meets my mother, even though we are similar in many ways. That's the amazing and beautiful multi-faceted aspect of God. God doesn't act one-size-fits-all. He meets us individually.

 

[Eclectic Mystic]

Alex, I understand that you responded to my post, but I don't see how your response relates to my post. What does individualism have to do with the price of rice in China?

 

[Quahom1]

Alex, I understand that you responded to my post, but I don't see how your response relates to my post. What does individualism have to do with the price of rice in China?

like the stars in the sky, so is rice in the fields of china...but individualism in the same land, is a rare jewel, so is a single man's relationship with his maker.