Thinking too much about issues of faith

[Gatekeeper]

Does anyone else ever feel like they think "too" much about issues of faith? Maybe it would be best for me to just be? Maybe to find peace I need to stop trying to know? Trying to understand this crazy life can be mentally exhausting, and I'm too darned tired to care anymore about things I don't think matter in the grand scheme of life anyway. My core beliefs, and my spirituality isn't exactly complicated, but when I think too much on an issue, my ponderings tend to end up to be more "complicated" than I would like, if not completely incoherent. <sigh>

 

[Paladin]

Yep. Thoughts tend to just go on in a stream without really getting us anywhere really. Most of the contemplative practices of religion attempt to quiet the mind, though it takes practice. A lot of practice. A whole lot of practice.
Christianity has a very long history of silent prayer, have you ever read Merton?

 

[Quahom1]

Does anyone else ever feel like they think "too" much about issues of faith? Maybe it would be best for me to just be? Maybe to find peace I need to stop trying to know? Trying to understand this crazy life can be mentally exhausting, and I'm too darned tired to care anymore about things I don't think matter in the grand scheme of life anyway. My core beliefs, and my spirituality isn't exactly complicated, but when I think too much on an issue, my ponderings tend to end up to be more "complicated" than I would like, if not completely incoherent. <sigh>

How can one think TOO MUCH about God, my friend? God is hope, love and faith...

I think we think too little about "faith", and more about work, or vacation, or money, or kids teeth and braces (do you know what they cost nowadays????) lol, see my point? We get so easily distracted...

As my Pastor pointed out: "Magnify God, not our problems"...

what do you think?..

 

[Paladin]

I know Janz really loves this guy: Centering Prayer

 

[Gatekeeper]

Yep. Thoughts tend to just go on in a stream without really getting us anywhere really. Most of the contemplative practices of religion attempt to quiet the mind, though it takes practice. A lot of practice. A whole lot of practice.
Christianity has a very long history of silent prayer, have you ever read Merton?

I've never even heard of Merton. I have what some might call an "Unquiet Mind", or at least that is what Kay Redfield Jamison calls it. I find it difficult to quiet my thoughts for even a moment. It can be trying at best.

I did attempt meditation for a few month's, but found the practice extremely difficult. My mind would race from one thought to the next, rapidly increasing till my head seemed to spin into a whirlwind of vague and fleeting images. Odd I know, but it is my experience.

 

[Gatekeeper]

How can one think TOO MUCH about God, my friend? God is hope, love and faith...

I think we think too little about "faith", and more about work, or vacation, or money, or kids teeth and braces (do you know what they cost nowadays????) lol, see my point? We get so easily distracted...

As my Pastor pointed out: "Magnify God, not our problems"...

what do you think?..

I think faith, hope, and love are the gist of my beliefs and spirituality. The devil is in the details of wading through the muck of doctrinal matters, biblical concepts, and personal philosophical ponderings. I don't tend to get too awful distracted by issues of life. It is what it is. I don't get overly concerned with what tends to distract most others. My distractions stem from the uncertainty of knowing, and in the pursuit of the all too elusive "truth" of God. I think I was trying to say that I want to focus on what I have faith in, my hopes, and loving others as opposed to digging too deep.

 

[Paladin]

I've never even heard of Merton. I have what some might call an "Unquiet Mind", or at least that is what Kay Redfield Jamison calls it. I find it difficult to quiet my thoughts for even a moment. It can be trying at best.

I did attempt meditation for a few month's, but found the practice extremely difficult. My mind would race from one thought to the next, rapidly increasing till my head seemed to spin into a whirlwind of vague and fleeting images. Odd I know, but it is my experience.

Nope, not odd at all, as a matter of fact it is quite normal even for people who have practiced for years. It is the act of bringing the attention back that is the real practice, the fact that it wanders is just what a mind does. Studies show that even ADD afflicted kids benefit from mindfulness training. As a Christian I think you might like to read Thomas Merton, I really love reading his works.

 

[Gatekeeper]

Nope, not odd at all, as a matter of fact it is quite normal even for people who have practiced for years. It is the act of bringing the attention back that is the real practice, the fact that it wanders is just what a mind does. Studies show that even ADD afflicted kids benefit from mindfulness training. As a Christian I think you might like to read Thomas Merton, I really love reading his works.

Any work in-particular? Like I said, I'm not familiar with him, so I have no idea where to start. At this point, I'm up to read anything helpful, so thanks for the suggestion. I would like a good starting point, though.

 

[Paladin]

I think his book "Seeds" would be best, but with Merton you could start anywhere. Merton was a trappist monk who was a great teacher and prolific writer. If you go to amazon you will find nearly all his popular writings.

 

[Gatekeeper]

I think his book "Seeds" would be best, but with Merton you could start anywhere. Merton was a trappist monk who was a great teacher and prolific writer. If you go to amazon you will find nearly all his popular writings.

I'll definitely check "Seeds" out sometime. Thank you! Have you ever read anything by Tich Naht Hahn. I read a book by him a few years ago that was quite refreshing, but I can't remember the name. My cuz lent the book to me when I was doing some research on Buddhism (If I recall correctly). I don't remember too much about it, but I do remember it resonating. I think it had something to do with connecting Christianity and Buddhism, but I'm not sure.

My memory is awful!

 

[Snoopy]

...Living Buddha, Living Christ by Thích Nhất Hạnh?

I would also recommend Merton. The Pocket Thomas Merton does exactly what it says on the tin. (just an alternative toe in the water there Paladin )

 

[Snoopy]

We all have a 'monkey mind', racing from branch to branch GK. That' WHY one meditates, whatever the 'tradition'.

 

[NiceCupOfTea]

if I think to much about it I find that all the doctrine and theology does not really add up at least the theology and doctrine that I have been exposed to.

i read this in a book the other day

if you want God and you chase God, God will be just out of your reach. If you stop and drop every concept of God, you are enfolded in the living presence of God.

trying to find the truth through thought is a bit like a dog chasing it tail.

 

[wil]

Does anyone else ever feel like they think "too" much about issues of faith? Maybe it would be best for me to just be?

Yes, we are human beings....the now...great place to be...hmmm only place to be...our body is always in the now, it is our mind that chooses to be in the past or in the future....

Yes, focus on your faith...not the issues and nuance.

I did attempt meditation for a few month's, but found the practice extremely difficult. My mind would race from one thought to the next, rapidly increasing till my head seemed to spin into a whirlwind of vague and fleeting images. Odd I know, but it is my experience.

Not odd, fairly normal actually. Contemplate how long it took you to learn to walk, or talk, contemplate how long it would take you to learn to juggle five balls...give meditation at least that much time....and don't worry about the thoughts, thank them, and allow them on their way...and the accentuated sounds and itches....observe and let go....

you learn to meditate the same way you get to Carnegie Hall

I think faith, hope, and love are the gist of my beliefs and spirituality.... I think I was trying to say that I want to focus on what I have faith in, my hopes, and loving others as opposed to digging too deep.

I think that is a good path as well.

We all have a 'monkey mind', racing from branch to branch GK. That' WHY one meditates, whatever the 'tradition'.

Yessir.

trying to find the truth through thought is a bit like a dog chasing it tail.

very nice.

 

[Paladin]

I'll definitely check "Seeds" out sometime. Thank you! Have you ever read anything by Tich Naht Hahn. I read a book by him a few years ago that was quite refreshing, but I can't remember the name. My cuz lent the book to me when I was doing some research on Buddhism (If I recall correctly). I don't remember too much about it, but I do remember it resonating. I think it had something to do with connecting Christianity and Buddhism, but I'm not sure.

My memory is awful!

By the way, someone should point out to you how wonderful it is to come to the place of awareness you are in right now. Most people spend their entire lives never really being aware of their own minds.
Although it might seem painful, you are beyond what most people experience, so congratulations!
Oh, and it does get better, as a matter of fact when you begin to explore your own awareness, life becomes deeper, richer. You feel pain more, but you suffer less, and there comes a joy not based on desire or avoidance.
I think this is what is known as the "...peace of God that passeth all understanding"

 

[IowaGuy]

I did attempt meditation for a few month's, but found the practice extremely difficult. My mind would race from one thought to the next, rapidly increasing till my head seemed to spin into a whirlwind of vague and fleeting images.

Gatekeeper - have you ever tried walking meditation? I have been experimenting the last decade with 10 day trips (the longest my wife will let me leave) deep into wilderness areas either via backpacking or canoeing. Cover about 100 miles per trip. I take one each spring & fall. No modern electronic technology (cell phone, watch, etc). I just try to focus on living in the present moment as much as possible without all the distractions that are present in "normal" day-to-day life. This spring while canoeing in Quetico I didn't see anyone else for 7 days straight...

I'm not one for sitting meditation either, but walking or canoeing all day and just trying to focus on my breathing, feelings in my legs/arms, eating when I'm truly hungry (not just because the clock says noon), etc is very calming for my mind.

My mind races as you describe for the first day or two, but by the end of the trip I am in a very peaceful state...

"Walk away quietly in any direction and taste the freedom of the mountaineer. Camp out among the grasses and gentians of glacial meadows, in craggy garden nooks full of nature's darlings. Climb the mountains and get their good tidings, Nature's peace will flow into you as sunshine flows into trees. The winds will blow their own freshness into you and the storms their energy, while cares will drip off like autumn leaves."
- John Muir (1838-1914)​

"Another glorious Sierra day in which one seems to be dissolved and absorbed and sent pulsing onward we know not where. Life seems neither long nor short, and we take no more heed to save time or make haste than do the trees and stars. This is true freedom, a good practical sort of immortality."
- John Muir​

 

[wil]

Gatekeeper - have you ever tried walking meditation? I have been experimenting the last decade with 10 day trips

Length of Vipisanna eh?

That sounds incredible. That level of returning to nature is wonderful. 7 days no human so you pack for the entire 10 days? Do you filter, purfication tablets or UV your water?

 

[luecy7]

trying to find the truth through thought is a bit like a dog chasing it tail.

Trying to find a truth without thought is a bit like an alcoholic chasing a tail (sp?).

Although, I do know some that have seemingly perfected the art of love with their heart, soul, and merlot.

 

[wil]

seemingly perfected the art of love with their heart, soul, and merlot.

Oh I am soo stealing that!

 

[Gatekeeper]

Gatekeeper - have you ever tried walking meditation? I have been experimenting the last decade with 10 day trips (the longest my wife will let me leave) deep into wilderness areas either via backpacking or canoeing. Cover about 100 miles per trip. I take one each spring & fall. No modern electronic technology (cell phone, watch, etc). I just try to focus on living in the present moment as much as possible without all the distractions that are present in "normal" day-to-day life. This spring while canoeing in Quetico I didn't see anyone else for 7 days straight...

I'm not one for sitting meditation either, but walking or canoeing all day and just trying to focus on my breathing, feelings in my legs/arms, eating when I'm truly hungry (not just because the clock says noon), etc is very calming for my mind.

My mind races as you describe for the first day or two, but by the end of the trip I am in a very peaceful state...

"Walk away quietly in any direction and taste the freedom of the mountaineer. Camp out among the grasses and gentians of glacial meadows, in craggy garden nooks full of nature's darlings. Climb the mountains and get their good tidings, Nature's peace will flow into you as sunshine flows into trees. The winds will blow their own freshness into you and the storms their energy, while cares will drip off like autumn leaves."
- John Muir (1838-1914)​

"Another glorious Sierra day in which one seems to be dissolved and absorbed and sent pulsing onward we know not where. Life seems neither long nor short, and we take no more heed to save time or make haste than do the trees and stars. This is true freedom, a good practical sort of immortality."
- John Muir​

Wonderful suggestion, IowaGuy!! I LOVE nature anyway, so I nice retreat from the day to day would be nothing less than refreshing.