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Hi Senor Cat. Just to add one small point, on the subject of ideal Islam, which always gravitates toward evocation of the "golden age": what Westerners value about that great Muslim era and what Muslims value are not necessarily the same; in fact, they're often at variance. We often are...

Hi Dawud. It’s very difficult to find a balanced view on this pivotal era. One tends to be celebratory of one side or the other, and to overstate the case. The above quote is certainly celebratory of the Muslim side. While it’s true that during the period of its cultural ascendancy, especially...

Hey, Cat! I noticed Brian strayed somewhat from your “no pragmatism” rule by setting the question in the golden age of Islam (9th to 11th centuries), and pointing out that in that historical context Islam does relatively well. Of course, by implication to remove this particular stage of Islam...

Netti, Netti, Netti, if only there were some resemblance between your views and the implications of the name you’ve chosen for these forums. I've displayed enormous restraint so far in simply trying to get you to move a few degrees of your dogmatism, to get you to dismount from your hobbyhorse...

Well, I’m glad you ended with a happy face! But please do present whatever facts you like. Even if I don’t respond, I’m sure I’ll be enjoying them in silence. But again I was never interested in a debate on this. I was only suggesting that in your response to Tao’s full frontal assault on Islam...

Hi BB. on the contrary - it was the shortfall in the moral payments that made the sacrifices so repulsive. to put it another way, it's like cheating on your wife and then expecting flowers and chocolate to heal the relationship. flowers and chocolate are all very well when you're doing all...

Ah, Netti. No more games! Al-Ghazali dates from the 12th century. The closing of the gates of ijtihad dates to around the same time or a little later, depending on your sources. In early modern times (16th century or so) the so-called "gunpowder empires" in the middle east and Asia, including...

[/FONT][/SIZE] Hi Netti. My original purpose as I said was not to enter into a long exchange, but simply to offer a moderating voice. At the same time I don’t want to be evasive, so let me answer several of your points. First of all, I wasn’t saying that Islam is inherently incapable of...

You're a braver man than I am, Gunga Din! I think by rights it should be Muslims who wrestle with the Koran, the Hadith and the problems of abrogation. Unfortunately, that challenge has not been taken up here, to my knowledge, beyond the usual apologetics. So I can understand your wading into...

I'm not sure. I suppose the people in question would consider they're simply carrying out Allah's will. But this is for Muslims to decide. I'm not qualified to say. I can only offer my outside perspective. Shanti.

Hi Seattle. Strangely enough, your quote sets up a form of the dichotomy I was talking about, without even going to the “harder” passages of the Koran or the Hadith. Verse 6.82 provides a moral test for faith, while verse 6.80 invests the ultimate guarantor of both faith and morality in the...

Since I haven’t read these studies I’m going on supposition here, assuming there are few devils in the details. But from what you describe, certainly these kinds of studies are important, but I guess what they lack – and what’s fairly difficult to provide in a definitive way – are control...

Hi Netti Netti. Nice to see you haven’t lost your edge! But you seem to be taking me as far more contrary to your point of view than I in fact am. (Perhaps you’re over-reacting to me because of the either/or debate you’re having with Tao?) I’m firmly in the middle on this. I fully agree on the...

Hi Netti. You’ve brought up some important historical and political considerations especially the relatively recent phenomena of the Wahhabism (the preferred term from the inside is Salafism, referring to Muhammad and his immediate companions), and the Iranian state, which is unique in the...

(continued from above) I don't see how Jesus offers the transformation which you observe. in the case of Jesus, the rule became much, much tougher. I remember one Sufi commentator observing that in reality Christianity is far too austere for volitive man, and that it was better suited to a...

Here I am, neither Franciscan nor Dominican, wrestling with a Thomist, hoping to avoid putting my thigh bone out of joint. Hi Thomas. "Whether sacred doctrine is a matter of argument? I answer that..., As other sciences do not argue in proof of their principles, but argue from their...

Thanks Thomas for this very gentlemanly reply. It may seem sometimes that I love provoking people just for the fun of it, but my provocations really are based in sincere feeling. I genuinely hate leaving behind any harsh feelings, so I’m glad you’ve taken this in stride. Like Dante, we’re...

Hi Not This, How About That, Nor the Other! As I said to Thomas I don’t consider myself properly equipped for a walk in the woods with the Angelic Doctor. But I’d like to respond briefly to what you’re saying here. Part of the pleasure I’ve had on occasionally reading Aquinas is that while he...

"So, as I said, Kalamas: 'Don't go by reports, by legends, by traditions, by scripture, by logical conjecture, by inference, by analogies, by agreement through pondering views, by probability, or by the thought, "This contemplative is our teacher." When you know for yourselves that, "These...

P.S. to Thomas, over. I guess I can’t resist adding just a few more words – always a mistake. Thomas writes: Again, this is not the God of the Abrahamic Tradition. Desire does not exist in God as you suggest it. 'God is simple' is a favourite of the Fathers, God cannot be added to or...