Aramaic Lord's Prayer

wil

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I'm wanting to learn the Lord's Prayer in Aramaic.

Anyone know good references?

Anyone know of anyone who is versed in this and can help?

What do you or they think of this version (written, interp and audio)
 
Well, Wil, can't offer you the pure, unadulterated Aramaic, but you might be interested in Neil Douglas-Klotz's book, "The Hidden Gospel: Decoding the Spiritual Message of the Aramaic Jesus," which I have. In it, he goes into the potential translative meanings of the prayer from Aramaic. earl
 
Dug in some boxes today, found Meier; from vol. II, p. 239, Fitzmeyer's reconstruction:

abba, yithqaddash shem-akh, teyteh malkuwth-akh,
Father, be-sanctified name-thy, come kingdom-thy,

lachma-na di mishteya hab la-nah yowma denah,
bread-our that suffices (?) to-us daily give,

uw-shebuq la-nah chowbay-na ke-di shebaqna le-chayyabay-na
and-forgive to-us debts-our like-as forgive-we to-debtors-our

we-al ta'eylinna-na le-nisyon
and-don't make-come-us to-testing

This is based on the assumption that Luke's (shorter) version is more original, so it omits many familiar phrases from Matthew's (longer) version. Others have theorized however that the difference between the gospels here represents that Jesus didn't lead in prayer only once, and did not always use the exact same words: that is, that Jesus was not teaching a set prayer, so much as a style of prayer, remembering to pray for God's will first rather than your own, to ask for yourself no more than you need right now, to ask for nothing you would not give yourself, and to acknowledge your own shortcomings. All of this of course has parallels in Jewish prayers, in both Hebrew and Aramaic, from the period.
 
Namaste and thanx all,

How about the audio recording, I'm looking to hear and learn the pronunciations.

Also anyone read Setting a Trap for G!d, Rocco Erico's translation and discussion of the prayer.

And yes Bobx I agree, it isn't somthing that is supposed to be wrote...not teach us what to pray but how to pray...
 
This is the prayer as used in the Syriac Liturgy. Syriac is an Aramaic language--that there were and are several Aramaic languages, not a single language called "Aramaic".

Abun d-bashmayo
nithqadash shmokh
tithe malkuthokh
nehwe sebyonokh
aykano d-bashmayo oph bar`o
hab lan lahmo d-sunqonan yowmono
washbuq lan hawbayn wahtohayn
aykano doph hnan shbaqan l-hayobayn
lo ta`lan l-nesyuno
elo paso lan men bisho

metul d-dylokh hi malkutho
whaylo wteshbuhto
l`olam `olmin
Amin
 
Well, Wil, can't offer you the pure, unadulterated Aramaic, but you might be interested in Neil Douglas-Klotz's book, "The Hidden Gospel: Decoding the Spiritual Message of the Aramaic Jesus," which I have. In it, he goes into the potential translative meanings of the prayer from Aramaic. earl

Earl,

I have the audio version of Neil Douglas-Klotz's analysis of the Aramaic Lord's Prayer. A friend sent it to me several years ago, and I like it very much. I think it's about time to listen to it again and see what I get out of it now.

--Linda
 
gosh, dogbrain, if you read that out in my synagogue nobody would blink an eyelid, especially with that accent!

b'shalom

bananabrain

BB,

Well, DUH! Jesus was Jewish, after all. And he spoke Aramaic, which I assume was his native language and the one he used more often than any other. So of course nobody would bat an eye--what else would you expect? :)

--Linda
 
This is the prayer as used in the Syriac Liturgy. Syriac is an Aramaic language--that there were and are several Aramaic languages, not a single language called "Aramaic".

Abun d-bashmayo
nithqadash shmokh
tithe malkuthokh
nehwe sebyonokh
aykano d-bashmayo oph bar`o
hab lan lahmo d-sunqonan yowmono
washbuq lan hawbayn wahtohayn
aykano doph hnan shbaqan l-hayobayn
lo ta`lan l-nesyuno
elo paso lan men bisho

metul d-dylokh hi malkutho
whaylo wteshbuhto
l`olam `olmin
Amin

gosh, dogbrain, if you read that out in my synagogue nobody would blink an eyelid, especially with that accent!

b'shalom

bananabrain

Earl,

I have the audio version of Neil Douglas-Klotz's analysis of the Aramaic Lord's Prayer. A friend sent it to me several years ago, and I like it very much. I think it's about time to listen to it again and see what I get out of it now.

--Linda
this is the one I've been listening to to learn, thoughts?

http://worldvisionportal.org/sound/aramaicprayer.wav
 
BB,

Well, DUH! Jesus was Jewish, after all. And he spoke Aramaic, which I assume was his native language and the one he used more often than any other. So of course nobody would bat an eye--what else would you expect? :)

--Linda

It's all well and good to say such things, but people who insist upon an "Aramaic" Lord's prayer really don't know what is available. A "real" version in the Levantine Aramaic spoken during or around the reign of Augustus simply does not exist, at all. It has never been found. Every single Aramaic version currently available is actually a translation into Aramaic from another language. To make matters more complex, there is more than one thing that can be called "Aramaic". There were even notable distinctions that could be made between Galilean Aramaic and Jerusalem Aramaic.

However, as I stated before, there are no available "original Aramaic" versions of the Lord's Prayer. Instead, all available versions with any reputable verifiability trace back to Greek New Testament texts. Thus, any "true" meaning to be derived from them is just as likely to merely be an (often modern) interpretive overlay inserted into the "Aramaic version" produced by a given author as anything else.

The closest thing we have to a verifiable "original" is the Syriac (Aramaic) version used in some Eastern Liturgical and Scriptural traditions, and even this is a translation from Greek.
 
Here is something to consider when looking over these new Aramaic "versions":

The Aramaic Blog: O Father-Mother Birther of the Cosmos?!

To quote: "What do all of these "Translations" have in common? They exploit (whether intentionally or unintentionally) the unfortunate fact that the general public knows little to nothing about the language. From a scholarly standpoint, these translations have about as much in common as actual Svenska has to the cute and inane babblings of a certain loveable Muppet."
 
Namaste Dogbrain,

Reading your syriac translation and some of the other pages...it is indicated that the whole glory forever ending was added later.... thoughts? What date is your Syriac supposed to be from? (it did say the addition was litugical)
 
The doxology seems to have its first appearance in the Didache (ca AD150).
 
Earl..I really do like Neil Douglas Klotz and his teachings. I believe he is now in Edinburgh, Scotland. see Edinburgh Institute for Advanced Learning

I can not help you with Aramaic, but I am a Scot Highlander (part Irish) and spoke Gaelic in childhood. Here is the Gaelic version of the Lord's Prayer.

Ár nAthair atá ar neamh, go naofar d’aimn, go dtaga do ríocht, go ndéantar do thoill ar an talamh mar a dhéantar ar neamh. Ar n-arán laethúil tabhair dúinn inniu, agus maith dúinn ár bhfiacha, mar a mhaithimidne dár bhféichiúna féin, agus ná lig sinn I gcathú, ach saor sinn ó oic.

Amergin
 
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