Spiritual Side to Islam ?

i have taken this to an islamic forum, and so far had some insightful and kind responses a world of difference to what I got here :(
 
c0de said:
(lol) apparently, you are the only one here who does... rite?

... with your extensive eye for all things "spiritual".
Click to expand...

i should know more about it than someone who has never been a muslim, does that offend you ?
 
GlorytoGod said:
i have taken this to an islamic forum, and so far had some insightful and kind responses a world of difference to what I got here :(
Click to expand...
You already disregarded all the opinions on this thread that were offered to you in kindness.
 
sorry if i have offended you Code.

but actually yes most of the responses to my questions were unkind and unhelpful and frankly rather upsetting which seems to be the style on this forum, Neti's post was useful I did not understand Thomas's post.
 
GlorytoGod said:
sorry if i have offended you Code.

but actually yes most of the responses to my questions were unkind and unhelpful and frankly rather upsetting which seems to be the style on this forum, Neti's post was useful I did not understand Thomas's post.
Click to expand...
I don't believe it to be the style of the forum, but the folks here do tend to respond in kind. Read your original post...read it as a person who respects Islam, change the word Islam to Christianity if you must.

It could be the nature of your original post which turned folks off. I know it did me. From what you are saying now, we read it wrong.

Thomas provided a list of quite spiritual Muslims, to me the indication was if one were to read their works, one would see how others receive spiritual insight from Islam.
 
GlorytoGod said:
sorry if i have offended you Code.

but actually yes most of the responses to my questions were unkind and unhelpful and frankly rather upsetting...
Click to expand...

Poor baby.

Hates to be upset.

But loves to upset others.
 
GlorytoGod said:
sorry if i have offended you Code.
Click to expand...

Accepted. :)


but actually yes most of the responses to my questions were unkind and unhelpful and frankly rather upsetting which seems to be the style on this forum, Neti's post was useful I did not understand Thomas's post.
Click to expand...

The quest to locate spirituality in anything is a personal one G2G. So asking other people the question which you posed in this thread, is kind of besides the point, is it not?

In closing, I apologize if my words to you were harsh, and I am glad that you found comments from other people on another forum more helpful.
 
c0de said:
Accepted. :)
Click to expand...

great

The quest to locate spirituality in anything is a personal one G2G. So asking other people the question which you posed in this thread, is kind of besides the point, is it not?
Click to expand...
well lets close the forum then :rolleyes:

seriously though how do you cope with all the laws and rules ?

for example if you are a guy which I think you are, do you sit down to pee and when you are done do you leave the toilet with the correct foot first, or do you not even go that far with all the rules ?

i am not taking the piss, no pun intended
 
GlorytoGod said:
well lets close the forum then :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

I can write an entire essay trying to answer your questions G2G, but it wont help you unless you make a concerted effort to understand Islam (the Quran) yourself.

seriously though how do you cope with all the laws and rules ?
Click to expand...
You focus on the ones contained in the Quran, and dont worry about the mullahs in the mosque.


for example if you are a guy which I think you are, do you sit down to pee and when you are done do you leave the toilet with the correct foot first, or do you not even go that far with all the rules ?
Click to expand...
Are these rules in the Quran? (no)

So why are you so bothered by them?
 
c0de said:
I can write an entire essay trying to answer your questions G2G, but it wont help you unless you make a concerted effort to understand Islam (the Quran) yourself.

You focus on the ones contained in the Quran, and dont worry about the mullahs in the mosque.


Are these rules in the Quran? (no)

So why are you so bothered by them?
Click to expand...

because its Islam and thats what I was taught when converted.

as i understand it there are 5 pillars in islam, it is not just the quran,
 
GlorytoGod said:
for example if you are a guy which I think you are, do you sit down to pee...
Click to expand...

OMG, I am so glad somebody's finally brought this issue up. I'm a guy, and I sit down to pee. I think it's high time we changed the lazy habit of men standing while they urinate.

There's this little issue of "splashing" that seems to go ignored by most men. Hellooo... I don't need your droplets of pee flying around the bathroom, depositing upon the seat, walls and floor.

Be civilized! Sit that butt down and evacuate with some dignity!
 
GlorytoGod said:
Is there a spiritual side to Islam ?

I am only aware of lots and lots of rules but deeper than that is there anymore to it than that ?
Click to expand...


Hello, GlorytoGod,

If you are really interested in knowing the spiritual side of Islam, and what is the wisdom between "rules", it would be my all pleasure.
 
One way to look at the 'rules' is a guide to mindfulness.

Mysticism or spirituality is not the totality of religion, nor is everyone a spiritualist or a mystic in the common sense. The purpose of religion to to connect to God, and one way of keeping that connection open is in being mindful of the Divine in everything one does.

Islam is often translated as 'submission to the will of God' which doesn't go down to well in ego-orientated societies that tends to put 'me' as the priority ... other and equally viable translations of Islam are, as I understand them, submission to the will of God, which leads to obedience to the will of God, which leads to purity of being with regard for what God wills for man, and peace with God when we are in conformity with what He wills for us.

The Big Lesson for us all is to put God's will before our own, in the loving acceptance that what God wills for us is nothing but our own eternal good (often seen as opposed to our own temporal well-being, freedom and autonomy) and the rewards of God are greater than we could ever imagine for ourselves...

... so the faithful Moslem who, for example, goes to the toilet as instructed does so in the belief that the yoke of discipline is not a burden, and as such signifies a healthy spirituality, even if that spirituality is something beyond the individual's power of comprehension.

That is not to say one should suspend every critical faculty and never ask why ... but rather opts for the wise and prudent decision in assuming that there is a viable and valid reason for why one should shoulder the yoke, a reason not always visible in all its immediate implications.

Every tradition tells the follower that he or she should inquire, seek and question ... but often a refusal to answer is not because there isn't one, but that the disciple has to learn where the question comes from. One never outgrows humility.

A story from my own tradition, the Paradise of the Desert Fathers, but it's from a place the Sufi would recognise instantly:
When blessed Antony was praying in his cell, a voice spoke to him, saying, "Antony, you have not yet come to the measure of the the tanner who is in Alexandria." When he heard this, the old man arose and took his stick and hurried into the city. When he had found the tanner...he said to him, "Tell me about your work, for today I have left the desert and come here to see you."

He replied, "I am not aware that I have done anything good. When I get up in the morning, before I sit down to work, I say that the whole of this city, small and great, will go into the Kingdom of God because of their good deeds, while I alone will go into eternal punishment because of my evil deeds. Every evening I repeat the same words and believe them in my heart."

When blessed Antony heard this he said, "My son, you sit in your own house and work well, and you have the peace of the Kingdom of God; but I spend all my time in solitude with no distractions, and I have not come near the measure of such words."
Click to expand...
Now, supposing the one thing we were instructed, on entry into a spiritual discipline, was to pray every day in the certain knowledge that everyone will get to heaven but us ... how welcome would that be?

Thomas
 
GlorytoGod said:
because its Islam and thats what I was taught when converted.
Click to expand...
Of course Islam and the forms of expression are rather varied, just like Christianity.

The way you highlight what you evidently believe to be a rigid rule orientation would seem to suggest that you want to portray Islam as inherently legalistic. You have not actually shown this to be the case.

As Wil has suggested, your OP question may not come across as a question. As I see it, it might come across more as a position statement. To me it actually sounded like a typical attempt to use argument by implication. Whenever I see that kind of thing, I tend to suspect that the goal is to promote the Western hoax of Islam without spiritual inspiration or Sharia without love of G-d.

Jesus and Sufis would likely tell you that the spiritual and the legalistic aspects of a religion can be separated. Based on previous discussions on this forum, I think most people here get it. I also notice general agreement among people here that legalism or a legalistic/compulsive approach to religion is not always a property of a religion; it can be more a historical development, a sectarian development, or a quality of individual practitioners' way of doing religion. Faith and the expressions of faith are different things.

Anyway, here's a pdf file that gives you a good sense for how Islam has been evolving in Indonesia - the country with the worlds largest Muslim population. It's called Sufism and the Indonesian Islamic Revival. It explains how ritual can become a rule-bound formality, which is a potential problem in any religion.

http://www.indopubs.com/indosufism.pdf
 
Thomas said:
... so the faithful Moslem who, for example, goes to the toilet as instructed does so in the belief that the yoke of discipline is not a burden...
Click to expand...
I was thinking the same thing. But I'm not at all sure that outward practices or the observance of rules signify religiosity. Consider the "rule" to pray 5 times a day. I would think very religious people might say to themselves: why limit it to only 5 times?
 
please note this is in the Islamic section of the forum, now no offense I but I am only really interested in an islamic perspective here :eek:

now i realize that my post was quite blunt but its from own experience of islam and attending mosques, interestingly i asked the same question on an islamic forum and they seemed to understand exactly where i was coming from on this matter and were not harsh and judgmental at all unlike here :eek:

i am glad that i started this topic since it has been very illuminating not in terms of answering my question because I suppose that there are not really many if any practicing muslims posting on this site to answer it but it has been illuminating as to the modus operandi of this forum.

So i would like to thank those who have made a positive contribution in attempting to answer my question, and for the rest of you well I can I either curse you or bless you and this case I will follow what I think Jesus would do and bless you, so I pray that you will let God in that there would be less of you and more of him, and that your minds and hearts would be illuminated with love kindness peace and understanding :)

And now I will drop out from this thread.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top