The spirit

[Aerist]

in the words of the Western magical tradtion, Excalibur in the hands of King Arthur. .........

Defining "personality" is a really good question. I am not, personally ;D , going to attempt to define it. Instead, here is a pretty comprehensive definition from my favourite spiritual system of development:
Guides to Enlightenment

I don't know why you would think it a necessity, it patently doesn't. But then it depends on your 'system'.
Which western magical tradition?

Hi, Mmmmmm.
"Excalibur". I just like that metaphor. It is one of Dion Fortune's, I think.

"Personality." Having gone on a long walk, I would further define "personality" - along with spirit, soul, enlightenment, and magic, as whatever it is defined as by the valid spiritual development system you have committed yourself to. That's what is important. If you have committed and practised whatever spiritual exercises your system dictates for a few years you will have little trouble translating these words from the way they are used by other systems.

"It patently doesn't." Well, Thomas, you've get me there - I don't know every Western system. Indeed, my favourite system appears to suggest that therapy can be avoided by some people, and it does warn against assuming the medical profession have the answers (who doesn't). Guides to Enlightenment However it is my experience and observation that those who have engaged with therapy seem to have less problems with the inevitable spiritual crises than those who have not.

Dion Fortune, when she was Violet Firth, was one of the first female psychoanalysts in the UK. When Israel Regardie was running the Golden Dawn he insisted that people have 40 hours of therapy before they apply for admission.

I had ten years of it before I was through. I crawled my talk.

 

[Aerist]

The short answer is the ego is the master of deception when it comes to self-delusion. So the idea that 'one can do it oneself' is patently ridiculous.

Yet one has to do it on oneself - who else is going to. I quite like this formulation: Starborne - Quotes, Pictures, Poetry and Insight

Such work should only be done under the guidance of another. And, I would suggest, advising those who you don't know to 'go for it' is unwise, indeed it's reckless.

Well, it depends. For a start, there is therapy. Humanistic therapies can allow access to the first major transformation of consciousness. Jung would have said quite a bit further than that. And that is just one way.

Secondly, when one has developed one's intuition by spiritual practices, then one receives guidance from within to suitable means of further progression.

My own belief/faith is that such work is always guided, of course.

 

[Thomas]

Yet one has to do it on oneself

Yes, but under instruction was my point.

 

[radarmark]

Both Aerist and Thomas. "Under guidance" or "instruction" mean that one should have a mentor (prferably within one's tradition), corret? At least that is how I read the last two posts.

 

[Thomas]

Both Serist and Thomas. "Under guidance" or "instruction" mean that one should have a mentor (prferably within one's tradition), corret? At least that is how I read the last two posts.

From my pov, yes. But then I'm just reiterating what appears to be a universal axiom of the Great Traditions.

 

[Paladin]

From my pov, yes. But then I'm just reiterating what appears to be a universal axiom of the Great Traditions.

Indeed, it seems that we need each other to progress. Even monastics benefit from relationships with others on their path. The fact that the Sanga is one of the three precious gems says a lot.
It is interesting to see what kinds of models of personality and ego are used by different traditions because it could dispel quite a bit of confusion to understand how someone like Aerist, for example, views things.

 

[Thomas]

Indeed, it seems that we need each other to progress. Even monastics benefit from relationships with others on their path. The fact that the Sanga is one of the three precious gems says a lot.

Indeed. 'No man is an island' — we are a collective, and religion must reflect that through and through. That's why we tend to reject the neoPlatonic 'escape of the alone to the Alone'.

It is interesting to see what kinds of models of personality and ego are used by different traditions because it could dispel quite a bit of confusion to understand how someone like Aerist, for example, views things.

Absolutely.

 

[Aerist]

it could dispel quite a bit of confusion to understand how someone like Aerist, for example, views things.

My personality is essentially pragmatic, so if it/I feels guided to a particular course of action I don't have to understand it in detail to work with it. For those who are into NLP, I have a kinesthetic convincer strategy, so if it feels right in my body, that's usually good enough for me (although I do possess some common sense). I could also add that Myers-Briggs has me boxed up as an INFJ, and that my habitual haunt on the Enneagram is the 6 space, if that is helpful.

This answer seems to me to raise more questions than it gives answers, which is probably as it should be. My personality isn't anything unusual or special.

 

[Paladin]

My personality is essentially pragmatic, so if it/I feels guided to a particular course of action I don't have to understand it in detail to work with it. For those who are into NLP, I have a kinesthetic convincer strategy, so if it feels right in my body, that's usually good enough for me (although I do possess some common sense). I could also add that Myers-Briggs has me boxed up as an INFJ, and that my habitual haunt on the Enneagram is the 6 space, if that is helpful.

This answer seems to me to raise more questions than it gives answers, which is probably as it should be. My personality isn't anything unusual or special.

That is helpful to know, thank you for sharing that. I like the MBTI, though admittedly it is a poor predictor of behavior, (Which my doctoral candidate daughter likes to keep telling me) but in my experience it is an excellent tool for conflict management. In the field of psychology, personality is an interesting study because of the biopsychosocial aspects of its development. My personal favorite is the "big five" model.

 

[Aerist]

My personal favorite is the "big five" model.

I hadn't come across that one, actually, but it looks valid. Thanks for the introduction.

Behaviour is ephemeral and context-sensitive, my interest is more in motivation. My personal favourite is the enneagram, because of it's links to the "passion" of the personality type, and the use that knowledge is in spiritual development. Also, it matches very well with somatotype and demeanour, to the extent that I used to be able to fool people that I was clairvoyant.

Obviously MBTI has been so correlated with careers it is the natural choice for careers counselling.

And I do like spiral dynamics, although have little practical use for it. Pragmatism again, I notice.

 

[Paladin]

I hadn't come across that one, actually, but it looks valid. Thanks for the introduction.

Behaviour is ephemeral and context-sensitive, my interest is more in motivation. My personal favourite is the enneagram, because of it's links to the "passion" of the personality type, and the use that knowledge is in spiritual development. Also, it matches very well with somatotype and demeanour, to the extent that I used to be able to fool people that I was clairvoyant.

Obviously MBTI has been so correlated with careers it is the natural choice for careers counselling.

And I do like spiral dynamics, although have little practical use for it. Pragmatism again, I notice.

Completely agree about behavior, since that is really the main focus of psychology, and I spent quite a bit of time during my undergrad years on motivation, so I can see how that would be a compelling line of inquiry. I never understood how Dr. Graves work on spiral dynamics seemed to be overshadowed by Maslow's work. Personally I find it to be interesting, especially in a cross-cultural context.

 

[Aerist]

I never understood how Dr. Graves work on spiral dynamics seemed to be overshadowed by Maslow's work. Personally I find it to be interesting, especially in a cross-cultural context.

Indeed. I do wish those dealing with the Arab Spring would read it.

I believe Clare Graves was for some reason - illness springs to mind - unable to present his papers himself - in fact by a quirk of fate his friend Abe Mazlow presented the work on Spiral Dynamics on his behalf, which might be the reason that Mazlow's work overshadowed it. And not in a spiritual sense!

 

[Paladin]

Indeed. I do wish those dealing with the Arab Spring would read it.

I believe Clare Graves was for some reason - illness springs to mind - unable to present his papers himself - in fact by a quirk of fate his friend Abe Mazlow presented the work on Spiral Dynamics on his behalf, which might be the reason that Mazlow's work overshadowed it. And not in a spiritual sense!

I've been wishing since the start of the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq that our government would read spiral dynamics. Never heard that story about Maslow before, that is really interesting. I'll bet my friends at the University would love to read that story! By the way, I also consistently test as an INFJ as well, and in the past year discovered I am what is called a "Highly Sensitive Person" (Aron 1996).
Self Test
I found out through my research on sensory sensitivity about Aron's work and found that it explains quite a bit about my own behavior.

 

[Aerist]

Never heard that story about Maslow before, that is really interesting.

I'm afraid I can find no reference to it at all. I apologise for raising your hopes, but it seems too unreliable to quote.

"Highly Sensitive Person" (Aron 1996).

Well, I scored over the required 14 point, too. It was interesting to notice that some of the questions have gone from a No to a Yes over the years of meditation and development, particularly to do with picking up on others' moods and atmosphere, while some have gone from a Yes to a No, such as being startled by loud noises, and getting easily ruffled by agendas. As I have become more non-attached to my body and personality, I have had to pay particular attention to the effects of mood and atmosphere on it/them in order to avoid overload and malfunction. Brother Ass with earplugs, in fact.

 

[donnann]

Um, no, just questions as usual. Are the spirit and the soul different things?

All things are consciousness consisting of different parts. The white light spirit is pure consciousness that is intelligence. The soul is consciousness that is multicolored lights but is emotion. Everyone knows what the body is. The black light spirit is consciousness that is pure sexual consciousness. If all of these were to line up with your body you would transform into a being that is literally pure love and be in resurrected condition.
So you can say all parts are not exactly the same just like your skin isn't the same as your internal organs but are compatible to make up the whole being. Your whole body to include internal organs are like a skin for your spirit and soul.