Corona and you!

[wil]

Boris, Trump and Bolsonaro gleefully bragging about how good they handle things while basically killing their own voters by their actions and inactions. Idiots fudging figures and hiding facts to make themselves look good at the price of the lives of their citizens.

 

[Aupmanyav]

The figures in US, UK and Europe are just too frightening to ponder on.

 

[wil]

And the numbers are getting fudged...governors of states directing their coroners to record Covid deaths on complication (pnemonia, asthma, heart disease, CPD)

 

[RJM]

Imperceptibly slight loosening here, after PMs speech last night, but schools still closed for next weeks/months and people-dependent firms like where I am unlikely to open for months. Perhaps not until October.

Public transport 2m social distancing makes it unlikely to expect any busses in my area for whatever ... weeks ... months.

The place I work employs more than 100 people. The lockdown was to protect the health service from overloading: they've had time to get sorted out -- so why is the economy being destroyed?

The lockdowns were not to prevent deaths per se. They were to flatten the peak and cushion the health services from overload. Deaths are not a significant factor to continue to justify shutting down everything. Restaurants, shops, travel and transport firms are going to go out of business. Airlines are shedding thousands of jobs.

Even in the UK where the death rate is amongst the highest, it is 0.05 of population. The majority recover and have no lasting damage. Deaths are mostly amongst the very elderly who have multiple other health conditions. But flu is just as dangerous to that section of the population.

But there's nothing to be done except to wait and let God take over completely.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Here Prime Minister Modi will have two sessions of the State Chief Ministers (not all Chief Ministers belong to his party). The opposition leaders will try to ask Modi to continue with lock-down, but Modi is smart enough to know that industry needs to be re-started. So most probably, he will leave the decision on Chief Ministers. In two states ruled by Modi's party, the situation is bad (Gujarat and Madhya Pradesh), so they will probably still have stricter regulations. All transport will perhaps be started with the distancing regulations. Complete observance of regulations is impossible here.

Active cases: 44,355, Deaths: 2215

 

[RJM]

And the numbers are getting fudged...governors of states directing their coroners to record Covid deaths on complication (pnemonia, asthma, heart disease, CPD)

 

[Thomas]

Elon Musk ... the world view of narcissists is something to behold, isn't it?

 

[Thomas]

3:20 minutes in ... let's clear up the data ... in Muskworld, people with COVID-19 who are over 65 and die, would be put down to old age. In Muskworld, it turns out COVID-19 is fine, really. No big deal, certainly not enough to stop me making money ...

 

[RJM]

I don't see it like that. My question is whether the death rate (of 475 per million) justifies ruining the economy -- especially as those who recover have no lasting health effects? It's a hard-nosed unsentimental question.

 

[RJM]

I would certainly prefer the risk of my own death from covid than ruining the future for my daughter. At 67 I'm on my way out anyway, essentially. Perhaps not quite so soon. But she has her life before her.

 

[RJM]

Imo the lockdown was to flatten the peak while the NHS got time to prepare: to avoid doctors stepping around people dying in corridors, oxygen running out, etc.

People understood and were happy to comply for a while. I see no reason to destroy the airways and hotels and other visitor dependent businesses like the place where I work, which cannot survive until October.

The Gvt is paying 80% wages for 3 months -- at huge cost to the overall economy. But something like an airline has lots of other permanent overhead costs too and it is only until the end of June. Businesses like the place I work are unlikely to be allowed to open until October. It won't still be around by then. Thousands of people are permanently losing lose their jobs and businesses.

So ...

 

[Cino]

3:20 minutes in ... let's clear up the data ... in Muskworld, people with COVID-19 who are over 65 and die, would be put down to old age. In Muskworld, it turns out COVID-19 is fine, really. No big deal, certainly not enough to stop me making money ...

To be fair to Musk, the world must look very different when viewed from your lair in a hollowed-out volcano. Remember what he said about public transport?

It's a pain in the ass. That's why everyone doesn't like it. And there's like a bunch of random strangers, one of who might be a serial killer, OK, great.

We shouldn't be too harsh on him or his warped perception of reality. Years of working closely with Peter Thiel does terrible things to a man's psyche...

 

[RJM]

To be fair to Musk, the world must look very different when viewed from your lair in a hollowed-out volcano. Remember what he said about public transport?



We shouldn't be too harsh on him or his warped perception of reality. Years of working closely with Peter Thiel does terrible things to a man's psyche...

I'm not Musk's greatest fan but if you hear him out, he is saying that perhaps the large percentage of US deaths attributed to covid are not caused by covid. Meantime hospitals are only a-third occupied and doctors are being furlonged because low occupancy means they can't be paid.

Is he lying?

Anyway, I've said my piece.

 

[Cino]

I'm not Musk's greatest fan but if you hear him out, he is saying that perhaps the large percentage of US deaths attributed to covid are not caused by covid. Meantime hospitals are only a-third occupied and doctors are being furlonged because low occupancy means they can't be paid.

Is he lying?

Anyway, I've said my piece.

He's not lying outright, no, just being deeply disingenuous. By his logic, nobody ever dies of cancer either, as the death certificates of cancer victims usually state some kind of organ failure.

Like I said, it must be terribly hard for him to adopt the myopic perspective of us poor people.

 

[RJM]

Are you certain? He's articulating. Does being the owner of Tesla and SpaceX give Musk's personal opinions extra weight? If not, why should his position not allow him to state his view?

One more thing: although I find the covid war metaphors tedious and unoriginal, I believe it justifies extending them to question whether any compotent general would not lose 5 lives to save 9995?

 

[RJM]

He's not lying outright, no, just being deeply disingenuous

US doctors are not being furlonged due to lack of work caused by low hospital occupancy?

 

[Cino]

I'm not convinced that there are only two ways forward, soch as "either we drop all the precautions or everything goes to hell".

I'm always wary of such over-simplifications.

And as in any agenda, there are costs. I get suspicious when people want me to bear the cost of their agenda.

Especially if someone so deeply in denial about his own mortality as Musk (he wants to upload himself into some AI system to avoid death) expects others to sacrifice their lives so his economic ventures are not endangered.

 

[Cino]

US doctors are not being furlonged...?

... Because public health service is considered a profit-turning venture. That's why they are fired if they have too few patients. Only Musk doesn't mention that.

By the same logic, school teachers should not be paid because they don't turn a profit.

 

[RJM]

Especially if someone so deeply in denial about his own mortality as Musk (he wants to upload himself into some AI system to avoid death) expects others to sacrifice their lives so his economic ventures are not endangered.

That's ad hominem has nothing to do with Musk's argument.

Because public health service is considered a profit-turning venture. That's why they are fired.

Nevertheless that is the way it is happening. Unless Musk is lying, US hospitals are a-third empty.

 

[wil]

As we ride the rollercoaster of covid...

We find the ride goes thru a haunted house amplified by the pundits naysayers and crackpots.

I agree RJ, I've had a great life and would gladly move on to save descendants from decades of issues..but I would not impose that decision on others.