Ijaz Ahmad Ahmadi
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When we read the Bible, there are 30 verses that say " Jesus did not die on the cross". we can explain it here. (If God wills)
30 verses of Bible say " Jesus did not die on the Cross".
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yitzak tover
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any god needing blood of an innocent man on a cross in order to forgive sins is unworthy of worship
Ijaz Ahmad Ahmadi
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I will proceed in 10 parts of my topic. please reply or comment after one part.
I – The Sign of Jonah
Now we proceed with our arguments from the Bible itself to show that Jesus did not die on the Cross. We read in the New Testament:
“And when the people were gathered thick together, he (Jesus) began to say, this is an evil generation: they seek a sign: and there shall no sign be given it but the sign of Jonah the prophet. For as Jonah was a sign unto the Ninevites, so shall also the Son of man to this generation”. (Luke 11: 29, 30)
Again:
“But he answered and said unto them; an evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign: and there shall be no sign given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonah: for as Jonah was three days and three nights in the whale’s belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth” (Matthew 12: 39, 40)
Jesus Christ is said here to give a sign to the people of his own time as Jonah, the prophet, had given to the Ninevites? Now what was the sign given by Jonah to the Ninevites? The Bible says:
“Now the Lord had prepared a great fish to swallow up Jonah. And Jonah was in the belly of the fish three days and three nights. Then Jonah prayed unto the Lord his God out of the fish’s belly. And said, l cried by reason of mine affliction unto the Lord, and he heard me; out of the belly of hell cried I, and thou heardest, my voice”. (Jonah 1:17-2; 1,2)
According to this verse is the Bible, Jonah was swallowed up by a big fish where he remained three days and three nights and then came out alive from the belly of the fish. It was a sign given to the Ninevites. Jonah prayed to God for deliverance while in the belly of the fish. The Lord heard his prayer and Jonah came out alive. Jesus says that no sign shall be given to the evil and adulterous generation of his time except that of Jonah.
Now what is the resemblance between the two signs of Jonah and Jesus. It is nothing but going alive into the belly of the fish and the heart of the earth and coming out alive. Both Jonah and Jesus cried by reason of their respective afflictions and prayed to their Lord for deliverance. The prayers of both were heard. If Jesus did not enter the heart of the earth (sepulchre) alive, and come out alive, where is the resemblance of the two signs?
Jesus promised to show only one sign to the generation of his time, but even if that sign be not proved to be true, is there anything also to prove the truth of his claim to be a prophet? Jesus’s reference to the sign of Jonah simply means that he would not die on the cross. Therefore, there is every reason to believe that the swoon theory is not based on a wrong hypothesis.
I – The Sign of Jonah
Now we proceed with our arguments from the Bible itself to show that Jesus did not die on the Cross. We read in the New Testament:
“And when the people were gathered thick together, he (Jesus) began to say, this is an evil generation: they seek a sign: and there shall no sign be given it but the sign of Jonah the prophet. For as Jonah was a sign unto the Ninevites, so shall also the Son of man to this generation”. (Luke 11: 29, 30)
Again:
“But he answered and said unto them; an evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign: and there shall be no sign given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonah: for as Jonah was three days and three nights in the whale’s belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth” (Matthew 12: 39, 40)
Jesus Christ is said here to give a sign to the people of his own time as Jonah, the prophet, had given to the Ninevites? Now what was the sign given by Jonah to the Ninevites? The Bible says:
“Now the Lord had prepared a great fish to swallow up Jonah. And Jonah was in the belly of the fish three days and three nights. Then Jonah prayed unto the Lord his God out of the fish’s belly. And said, l cried by reason of mine affliction unto the Lord, and he heard me; out of the belly of hell cried I, and thou heardest, my voice”. (Jonah 1:17-2; 1,2)
According to this verse is the Bible, Jonah was swallowed up by a big fish where he remained three days and three nights and then came out alive from the belly of the fish. It was a sign given to the Ninevites. Jonah prayed to God for deliverance while in the belly of the fish. The Lord heard his prayer and Jonah came out alive. Jesus says that no sign shall be given to the evil and adulterous generation of his time except that of Jonah.
Now what is the resemblance between the two signs of Jonah and Jesus. It is nothing but going alive into the belly of the fish and the heart of the earth and coming out alive. Both Jonah and Jesus cried by reason of their respective afflictions and prayed to their Lord for deliverance. The prayers of both were heard. If Jesus did not enter the heart of the earth (sepulchre) alive, and come out alive, where is the resemblance of the two signs?
Jesus promised to show only one sign to the generation of his time, but even if that sign be not proved to be true, is there anything also to prove the truth of his claim to be a prophet? Jesus’s reference to the sign of Jonah simply means that he would not die on the cross. Therefore, there is every reason to believe that the swoon theory is not based on a wrong hypothesis.
Well it works the other way too: Jonah was effectively dead, in the belly of the whale, but God restored him back to life. The sign of Jonah was to call the Ninevites to change their ways or face destruction. The Ninevites heard Jonah and repented in sackcloth and ashes, and so God did not destroy them.
Christ descended into hell and then ascended to heaven, thus by his death and resurrection Christ encompassed all creation. But unlike the Ninevites, Christ's warning was not heeded, resulting in the destruction of the Temple by the Romans.*
So -- as always -- there are several levels and interpretations to Jesus's words, imo?
*According to the New Testament
Christ descended into hell and then ascended to heaven, thus by his death and resurrection Christ encompassed all creation. But unlike the Ninevites, Christ's warning was not heeded, resulting in the destruction of the Temple by the Romans.*
So -- as always -- there are several levels and interpretations to Jesus's words, imo?
*According to the New Testament
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This conclusion is quite a stretch, imo. It is certainly open to question ...
The book of Jonah is very short. It takes only a few minutes to read it:
The Book of Jonah
I called to the Lord out of my distress,
and he answered me;
out of the belly of Sheol* I cried,
and you heard my voice
(Jonah 2:1-2)
*Sheol
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sheol
The Book of Jonah
I called to the Lord out of my distress,
and he answered me;
out of the belly of Sheol* I cried,
and you heard my voice
(Jonah 2:1-2)
*Sheol
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sheol
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I look at it this way, Jesus rose from the dead and appeared to disciples in transfigured body. After that, He appeared in another form to two of them as they walked and went into the country. Mark 16:12
Well, in that sense Jesus did not die on the cross, as a number of biblical passages will allude too. However, that in no way means the crucifixion never happened. In fact, I believe that passage in the Quran that reads, they killed him not, nor did they crucify him... means much the same thing. Not that it literally never happened, but that Jesus rose again.
Well, in that sense Jesus did not die on the cross, as a number of biblical passages will allude too. However, that in no way means the crucifixion never happened. In fact, I believe that passage in the Quran that reads, they killed him not, nor did they crucify him... means much the same thing. Not that it literally never happened, but that Jesus rose again.
And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand. I and my Father are one. John 10:28-30
Ijaz Ahmad Ahmadi
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Please read again my previous post and try to reply.
(Now, what is the resemblance between the two signs of Jonah and Jesus? It is nothing but going alive into the belly of the fish and the heart of the earth and coming out alive. Both Jonah and Jesus cried by reason of their respective afflictions and prayed to their Lord for deliverance. The prayers of both were heard. If Jesus did not enter the heart of the earth (sepulcher) alive and come out alive, where is the resemblance of the two signs?)
(Now, what is the resemblance between the two signs of Jonah and Jesus? It is nothing but going alive into the belly of the fish and the heart of the earth and coming out alive. Both Jonah and Jesus cried by reason of their respective afflictions and prayed to their Lord for deliverance. The prayers of both were heard. If Jesus did not enter the heart of the earth (sepulcher) alive and come out alive, where is the resemblance of the two signs?)
Well by some interpretation, while Jonah was crying out for help, Jesus was reciting Psalms 22. That which was written 1000 years prior. In other words, look, it's happening! Even in utter agony, Jesus never stopped teaching.
The resemblance is that both Jesus and Jonah carried a warning for their generations, and both emerged alive after three days in sheol. It does not mean Jesus entered the tomb alive. That is not the take-away point, imo
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A crucified man had to keep pulling himself up in order to breathe. It was not possible to lose consciousness. That was the cruelty of crucifixion. If Jesus had lost consciousness on the cross he would have died by asphixiation. To say nothing of being thrust through with a spear.
In any event, he would have been in no condition to be walking around and talking after 3 days, imo
In any event, he would have been in no condition to be walking around and talking after 3 days, imo
Interesting point NJ
Not entirely correct. Usually it takes few days for a person to die on the cross. A crucified person doesn’t need to keep pulling himself up in order to breath. It only happens when he gets exhausted and can’t hold his body weight.
People would eventually die on the cross after few days due to exhaustion and asphyxiation. If Roman wanted a person to die quickly they would break the legs of that person. In this way the person can’t hold his body and his rib would collapse and he would die due to asphyxiation.
Jesus was a healthy 33 years old man. There was no reason for him to die on the cross within few hours. His legs weren’t broken either. Even Pontius Pilot was surprised that how Jesus died so quickly.
But if he had lost consciousness, he wouldn't have been able to breathe? And he was run through with a spear?
I personally believe God shortened Jesus's time on the cross
It is part of the meditation on the crucifixion mystery, imo
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Ijaz Ahmad Ahmadi
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my 2nd part:
II – Pontius Pilate’s wife sees a dream
“When he (Pilate) was set down on the Judgement seat, his wife sent unto him, saying, Have you nothing to do with that just man (Jesus): for I have suffered many things this day in a dream because of him”. (Matthew 27:19)
The lady’s dream was really true and quite opportune. It purports to mean that Christ be saved from the accursed death on the Cross. God saves his dear ones by means of dreams of others as was the case with Joseph who was released from jail having interpreted the two dreams of Pharaoh. God wanted to protect Jesus against his enemies, hence the dream of the Roman governor’s wife which influenced his judgment.
II – Pontius Pilate’s wife sees a dream
“When he (Pilate) was set down on the Judgement seat, his wife sent unto him, saying, Have you nothing to do with that just man (Jesus): for I have suffered many things this day in a dream because of him”. (Matthew 27:19)
The lady’s dream was really true and quite opportune. It purports to mean that Christ be saved from the accursed death on the Cross. God saves his dear ones by means of dreams of others as was the case with Joseph who was released from jail having interpreted the two dreams of Pharaoh. God wanted to protect Jesus against his enemies, hence the dream of the Roman governor’s wife which influenced his judgment.
But that doesn't mean Jesus didn't die on the cross? It means that Pilate's wife had a dream? Matthew's gospel reports on several events surrounding the crucifixion; the dream is just one of several events.
Again -- Pilate's wife's dream is not the take-away point of Matthew's account of the trial and crucifixion, imo? That would be Jesus's death on the cross and the rending of the temple veil, etc
Read full chapter: Matthew 27
(post edited ...)
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To be fair, the best that we can say, regarding his health, is that he appears to be healthy in the limited material available.
Ijaz Ahmad Ahmadi
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III – The Roman Governor’s Sympathetic Attitude
The Jews presented the case of Jesus Christ to Pilate, the Roman Governor of Palestine. He held a judicial inquiry into the case and declared that he was not guilty of the charges brought against him. He said unto them:
“Ye have brought this man unto me as one that perverteth the people: and behold, I, having examined him before you, have found no fault in this man touching those things whereof ye accuse him”. (Luke 23:14)
“He went out again unto the Jews and said unto them, l find in him no fault at all. But ye have a custom, that I should release unto you one at the Passover: will ye, therefore, that l release unto you the King of the Jews? Then cried they all again, saying, Not this man, but Barabbas.” (John 18:38, 40)
And from thenceforth Pilate sought to release him: but the Jews cried out, saying, If thou let this man go, thou art, not Caesar's friend: whosoever maketh himself a king speaketh against Caesar”. (John 19:12)
From the references given above, it is evident that the Governor regards Jesus innocent of all the charges brought against him by the Jews, he tries his utmost to release him but when the Jews threatened to report him to the Caesar at Rome he yielded to them and handed Jesus over to them. However, secretly he took measures to see that Jesus should be saved.
The Jews presented the case of Jesus Christ to Pilate, the Roman Governor of Palestine. He held a judicial inquiry into the case and declared that he was not guilty of the charges brought against him. He said unto them:
“Ye have brought this man unto me as one that perverteth the people: and behold, I, having examined him before you, have found no fault in this man touching those things whereof ye accuse him”. (Luke 23:14)
“He went out again unto the Jews and said unto them, l find in him no fault at all. But ye have a custom, that I should release unto you one at the Passover: will ye, therefore, that l release unto you the King of the Jews? Then cried they all again, saying, Not this man, but Barabbas.” (John 18:38, 40)
And from thenceforth Pilate sought to release him: but the Jews cried out, saying, If thou let this man go, thou art, not Caesar's friend: whosoever maketh himself a king speaketh against Caesar”. (John 19:12)
From the references given above, it is evident that the Governor regards Jesus innocent of all the charges brought against him by the Jews, he tries his utmost to release him but when the Jews threatened to report him to the Caesar at Rome he yielded to them and handed Jesus over to them. However, secretly he took measures to see that Jesus should be saved.
Ijaz Ahmad Ahmadi
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IV- Pontius Pilate’s attempts to save Christ
Pilate, the Governor, was thoroughly convinced of the innocence of Jesus Christ, he, therefore, had a pre-planned scheme to save Jesus’s life. As a responsible official of the Roman Empire, he could not openly come to the forefront, but he was the mastermind behind the whole scheme and the chief actor in the drama. Other characters of the show were Joseph of Arimathaea, an honorable counselor, and disciple of Jesus Christ. He had already had a sepulcher hewn out in a rock garden nearby. Another actor in the drama was a learned Jew named Nicodemus who was also in the know of the whole matter. We read of him in St. John:
“And there came also Nicodemus, which at the first came to Jesus by night and brought a mixture of myrrh and aloes about a hundred pound weight”. (John 19: 39)
It was very clever of Pilate to choose Friday afternoon as the time for Jesus’s crucifixion so that he could not remain on the cross after sunset, the following day being Sabbath, so holy to the Jews. He selected Joseph and Nicodemus as the most trusted friends to execute the pre-arranged scheme. All necessary measures were adopted to bring Jesus to consciousness. Otherwise, what did Nicodemus mean by bringing the mixture of myrrh and aloes? Jesus was shown to have died in official records to pacify the Jews and the Imperial government at Rome. Joseph of Arimathaea boldly asked the Governor to hand over the ‘body’ of Jesus which request he readily granted. If the plan was not pre-conceived how could the Governor hand over the ‘body’ of Jesus to a stranger from outside? There is reason to believe that Jesus Christ himself must have been informed of the plan so that his prophecy might come true that as Jonah was three days and three nights in the whale’s belly so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth. Nicodemus’s meeting with Jesus Christ the previous night brings into limelight the whole story.
Pilate, the Governor, was thoroughly convinced of the innocence of Jesus Christ, he, therefore, had a pre-planned scheme to save Jesus’s life. As a responsible official of the Roman Empire, he could not openly come to the forefront, but he was the mastermind behind the whole scheme and the chief actor in the drama. Other characters of the show were Joseph of Arimathaea, an honorable counselor, and disciple of Jesus Christ. He had already had a sepulcher hewn out in a rock garden nearby. Another actor in the drama was a learned Jew named Nicodemus who was also in the know of the whole matter. We read of him in St. John:
“And there came also Nicodemus, which at the first came to Jesus by night and brought a mixture of myrrh and aloes about a hundred pound weight”. (John 19: 39)
It was very clever of Pilate to choose Friday afternoon as the time for Jesus’s crucifixion so that he could not remain on the cross after sunset, the following day being Sabbath, so holy to the Jews. He selected Joseph and Nicodemus as the most trusted friends to execute the pre-arranged scheme. All necessary measures were adopted to bring Jesus to consciousness. Otherwise, what did Nicodemus mean by bringing the mixture of myrrh and aloes? Jesus was shown to have died in official records to pacify the Jews and the Imperial government at Rome. Joseph of Arimathaea boldly asked the Governor to hand over the ‘body’ of Jesus which request he readily granted. If the plan was not pre-conceived how could the Governor hand over the ‘body’ of Jesus to a stranger from outside? There is reason to believe that Jesus Christ himself must have been informed of the plan so that his prophecy might come true that as Jonah was three days and three nights in the whale’s belly so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth. Nicodemus’s meeting with Jesus Christ the previous night brings into limelight the whole story.
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