That's what Thomas was saying, basically! "A long time before Joshua's conquest".
At what date in time do you place Joshua's conquest?
Is anybody came from heavens to this world in the human history? No
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At what date in time do you place Joshua's conquest?
The Anointed
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Cino .....wrote. That's what Thomas was saying, basically! "A long time before Joshua's conquest".
At what date in time do you place Joshua's conquest?
The Anointed responds...... The scriptures place Joshua's conquest of Jericho as 40 years after the Exodus in 1542 B. C..
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moralorel responded ....... So are you saying that Enoch ascended into heaven?
I am coming from a belief that Enoch, at the age of 365 was taken up bodily (See Genesis 5: 23-24. KJV.) and anointed as the heir and successor to the throne of the Most High in the creation and translated from a body of corruptible matter into a glorious body of brilliant and blinding light in order that he should never experience death (See Hebrews 11: 5. KJV.) and HE, the Most High in the creation (THE SON OF MAN) is my Lord God and savior. There's your answer mate.
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If Thomas believes that Jericho was destroyed 'A long time before Joshua's conquest,' then he must believe the OT or the Hebrew bible which both erroneously state that Israel was in Egypt for 430 years, when they were only in the land of Egypt for 215 years.
OT history is not my strong suit and, urged on by @The Anointed's claims, I have looked into the matter further.
The claims of archaeologists have been questioned, the Fall of Jericho cannot strictly be dated, and this, combined with various dates for the Exodus etc., make it all very difficult to pin down.
World History Enclopaedia (précis):
According to the Bible, around 1400 BCE, Jericho was attacked by the Israelites after they crossed the Jordan and entered Canaan. The Wall of Jericho was destroyed when the Israelites walked around it for seven days carrying the Ark of the Covenant.
Excavations of the site reveal a network of collapsed walls. The most likely cause of the collapse was an earthquake. Descriptions of earthquake destruction (1267CE & 1927CE) match the description of the collapsed walls in the Bible. In both modern cases, the cliffs above the Jordan fell into the river and dammed it up.
Non-Biblical Scholars believe the Bible story is an allegory – written sometime after 722BCE, long after the events described, and was used to claim the territory for the Kingdom Of Israel. Biblical Scholars point to the destruction of the walls as proof that the story in the Bible is true.
Encyclopaedia Britannica:
The Book of Joshua, along with Deuteronomy, Judges, 1 and 2 Samuel, and 1 and 2 Kings, was first committed to writing about 550 BCE, during the Babylonian Exile. Many ancient traditions are preserved in the book, but they are coloured by the historian’s personal point of view.
My own take is between the two. Joshua was written around 700 years after the events it describes, and as is evident elsewhere in the Biblical histories, combines a number of oral traditions and sources presented in such a way to create a narrative with a particular aim and purpose – the fall of Jericho as the result of an earthquake becomes a great victory for Joshua.
The Deuteronomic Tradition produced a heavily redacted version of Joshua, Judges, Samuel and Kings to explain the fall of Jerusalem and the Babylonian exile using the theology and language of the Book of Deuteronomy. "The author used his sources with a heavy hand, depicting Joshua as a grand, divinely guided conquest, Judges as a cycle of rebellion and salvation, and the story of the kings as recurring disaster due to disobedience to God."
If you're going to claim the Book of Joshua as literal history, then you've got a lot of Deuteronomist scholarship to overcome.
The claims of archaeologists have been questioned, the Fall of Jericho cannot strictly be dated, and this, combined with various dates for the Exodus etc., make it all very difficult to pin down.
World History Enclopaedia (précis):
According to the Bible, around 1400 BCE, Jericho was attacked by the Israelites after they crossed the Jordan and entered Canaan. The Wall of Jericho was destroyed when the Israelites walked around it for seven days carrying the Ark of the Covenant.
Excavations of the site reveal a network of collapsed walls. The most likely cause of the collapse was an earthquake. Descriptions of earthquake destruction (1267CE & 1927CE) match the description of the collapsed walls in the Bible. In both modern cases, the cliffs above the Jordan fell into the river and dammed it up.
Non-Biblical Scholars believe the Bible story is an allegory – written sometime after 722BCE, long after the events described, and was used to claim the territory for the Kingdom Of Israel. Biblical Scholars point to the destruction of the walls as proof that the story in the Bible is true.
Encyclopaedia Britannica:
The Book of Joshua, along with Deuteronomy, Judges, 1 and 2 Samuel, and 1 and 2 Kings, was first committed to writing about 550 BCE, during the Babylonian Exile. Many ancient traditions are preserved in the book, but they are coloured by the historian’s personal point of view.
My own take is between the two. Joshua was written around 700 years after the events it describes, and as is evident elsewhere in the Biblical histories, combines a number of oral traditions and sources presented in such a way to create a narrative with a particular aim and purpose – the fall of Jericho as the result of an earthquake becomes a great victory for Joshua.
The Deuteronomic Tradition produced a heavily redacted version of Joshua, Judges, Samuel and Kings to explain the fall of Jerusalem and the Babylonian exile using the theology and language of the Book of Deuteronomy. "The author used his sources with a heavy hand, depicting Joshua as a grand, divinely guided conquest, Judges as a cycle of rebellion and salvation, and the story of the kings as recurring disaster due to disobedience to God."
If you're going to claim the Book of Joshua as literal history, then you've got a lot of Deuteronomist scholarship to overcome.
Just to clarify —
Note also that Elias was taken up as well, 2 Kings 2:11-12: "And as they still went on and talked, behold, chariots of fire and horses of fire separated the two of them. And Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven. And Elisha saw it and he cried, “My father, my father! The chariots of Israel and its horsemen!” And he saw him no more."
A far more spectacular ascent ...
OK ... the text says "And he walked with God, and was seen no more: because God took him." (v24)
No scriptural support for that – an apocryphal legend.
Hebrews 11:5 says: "By faith Enoch was translated, that he should not see death; and he was not found, because God had translated him."
But that's totally apocryphal.
Note also that Elias was taken up as well, 2 Kings 2:11-12: "And as they still went on and talked, behold, chariots of fire and horses of fire separated the two of them. And Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven. And Elisha saw it and he cried, “My father, my father! The chariots of Israel and its horsemen!” And he saw him no more."
A far more spectacular ascent ...
The Anointed
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Yes been through them all many years ago. The main detractors of Kathleen Kenyons work were those who were attempting to support the erroneous date of the exodus according to the English translations of Jerome’s OT and the Mazoretic text which, surprise, surprise both erroneously claim that the Israelites were in Egypt for 430 years.
And Kathleen Kenyon, who is a most respected archaeologist dug at Jericho over the seasons between 1952 to 1958, her results were confirmed in 1995 by radiocarbon tests, which dated the destruction of Jericho to 1562 BC (Plus/minus 38 years) with a certainty of 95%.
The radiocarbon tests which dated the destruction of Jericho to 1562 BC (plus/minus 38 years) with a certainty of 95%, confirm that the biblical date of 1505 BC for the destruction, agrees closely with Kathleen Kenyon’s findings. 1562- 38 =1524, which is only 95% certain. 19 years out
Correct, The Wall of Jericho was destroyed when the Israelites had walked around it for seven days carrying the Ark of the Covenant. But the1400 BCE, Date, is simply more unsubstantiated rubbish. Because according to the Bible, it was around 1505 BCE, when Jericho was attacked by the Israelites.
The most likely cause of the Joran drying up long enough for the Israelites to cross, as I said in my post was more than likely an earth tremor, as the fault line between the Arabian plate and the African plate, runs through the Red Sea up the Jordan Valley, where the African plate interacts with the Anatolian plate but the main cause for the fall of the walls of Jericho was because the structural integrity of the wall had been compromised by the inhabitants removing the stones to make escape routes out of the city.
The walls of Jericho are the oldest stone walls ever discovered and would date back to at least 8000 BCE, and would have survived many, many earth tremors, and you think a minor tremor not even noticed among the shouts and trumpet blasts of the Israelites brought those walls down without any help, I think not.
Non-Biblical Scholars and non-biblical believers such as yourself might believe the Bible story is an allegory, but the more serious Biblical Scholars believe the historical truth of the Hyksos Kings under who the Israelites governed Egypt until the death of Joseph and even after that, they fought for and commanded sections of the Hyksos army. And in Judges 5: 14, it is written that the commanders of the Israelite army came down from Machir, of who it is said in Joshua 17: 1; that Machir was the firstborn son of Manasseh, the first born of Joseph, and that he was a military hero, and the father of young Gilead.
Of course Machir the grandson of Joseph, who was a military Hero during the reign of the Hyksos Shepherd Kings, was long dead by the time of the Exodus.
The entire Israelites 'Book of the Law' which was housed in Solomon's Temple and was destroyed in the flames when the temple was sacked and burned by the forces of Nebuchadnezzaar, was rewritten during the Babylonian Exile and was not coloured by the recorders of the Tanakh as stated by the detractors of God's word.
And you have evidence to support this do you Thomas? Where do you fit Rahab the prostitute into your make-believe story.
And I claim the book of Joshua as literal history.
To be continued.
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Continued from previous post.
From ‘The World Book Dictionary,’ (Hyksos) “A succession of six foreign rulers of Egypt—from about 1730 B.C. to about 1570 B.C; Shepherd Kings.” --- And from the Encyclopedia Britannica, ‘Hyksos’, invaders who were also called the Shepherd Kings, who in the time of “King Tutimaios” entered Egypt and took possession of it ‘without striking a blow.’
Genesis 41: After Joseph had revealed to the Hyksos king that his dreams were a prophecy telling of a seven-year period of plenty, which would be followed by a seven years period of severe drought, Joseph is made Governor of all Egypt, and all Egyptians were commanded by the King to obey him. The King removed his royal ring with its engraved seal and put it on the finger of Joseph. He was given the second royal chariot and a guard of honour who went ahead of him crying out, “Make way, make way.” And the King said: I am King, but no one in all of Egypt shall so much as lift a hand or a foot without Joseph’s permission. He gave Joseph an Egyptian wife, Asenath, the daughter of the High priest of Heliopolis, who prophesied that if ever the bones of Joseph left Egypt, the LIGHT of Egypt would go with him. For that reason, a permanent guard was set up to keep watch over the tomb of Joseph, in order that no one could remove the mummified body of Joseph.
During the seven years of plenty, Joseph gathered a percentage of the Egyptian grain crop as a tax, which was stored in silos throughout Egypt. In the early stages of the great seven-year drought, the Egyptians had to buy their grain from Joseph, when their money had all gone, they traded their possessions and livestock, after which, they were forced to sign their land over for grain in order to survive.
Genesis 47: 20-21. Joseph bought all the land of Egypt for the king. Every Egyptian was forced to sell their land, because the famine was so severe; Joseph made slaves of all the people from one end of Egypt to the other, ‘without striking a blow.’
The Hyksos were described as bowmen and cavalrymen wearing the cloaks of many colours, much like the cloak of many colours that was worn by Joseph the son of Israel was the first under the Hyksos king, of who it is said in Genesis 50: 23; that he lived to receive the children of Machir the son of Manasseh into the family. And in Judges 5: 14, it is written that the commanders of the army came down from Machir, of who it is said in Joshua 17: 1; that Machir was the firstborn son of Manasseh, the first born of Joseph, and that he was a military hero, and the father of young Gilead.
Machir, who was a military Hero during the reign of the Shepherd Kings, was long dead by the time of the Exodus.
Gilead the first born of Machir would have been welcomed into the family by Joseph, and presumably, the funeral procession of Young Gilead who is thought to have died childless beside his father ‘Machir’ in a war against the people of the country that would later carry his name, ‘The land of Gilead’ which land was allocated to the descendants of Machir after the exodus. The funeral procession of the young Prince Gilead would have been led by his great grandfather Joseph, and possibly buried in his own tomb, which was to be later placed under a permanent guard against tomb robbers, because the high priest of Heliopolis had prophesied that if ever the bones of Joseph left Egypt, the LIGHT of Egypt would go with him.
After the Exodus , which was the release of the Israelites from under the yoke of the shepherd kings, and the removal of the mummified remains of Joseph, which were to be taken to Shechem and buried there in the land of Israel as per Joseph’s last wish, the Egyptian Guards would have been removed, and any grave robbers who were later confronted with the opened sarcophagus’ of Joseph and his wife in the empty tomb, would have assumed that others had beaten them to the treasures that the tomb of Joseph would have contained, and would have left empty handed.
After wandering the wilderness for 40 years as punishment for their rebellion against the commands of Moses to prepare to invade the land of Canaan, they finally obeyed the Lord and attacked Jericho.
From ‘The World Book Dictionary,’ (Hyksos) “A succession of six foreign rulers of Egypt—from about 1730 B.C. to about 1570 B.C; Shepherd Kings.” --- And from the Encyclopedia Britannica, ‘Hyksos’, invaders who were also called the Shepherd Kings, who in the time of “King Tutimaios” entered Egypt and took possession of it ‘without striking a blow.’
Genesis 41: After Joseph had revealed to the Hyksos king that his dreams were a prophecy telling of a seven-year period of plenty, which would be followed by a seven years period of severe drought, Joseph is made Governor of all Egypt, and all Egyptians were commanded by the King to obey him. The King removed his royal ring with its engraved seal and put it on the finger of Joseph. He was given the second royal chariot and a guard of honour who went ahead of him crying out, “Make way, make way.” And the King said: I am King, but no one in all of Egypt shall so much as lift a hand or a foot without Joseph’s permission. He gave Joseph an Egyptian wife, Asenath, the daughter of the High priest of Heliopolis, who prophesied that if ever the bones of Joseph left Egypt, the LIGHT of Egypt would go with him. For that reason, a permanent guard was set up to keep watch over the tomb of Joseph, in order that no one could remove the mummified body of Joseph.
During the seven years of plenty, Joseph gathered a percentage of the Egyptian grain crop as a tax, which was stored in silos throughout Egypt. In the early stages of the great seven-year drought, the Egyptians had to buy their grain from Joseph, when their money had all gone, they traded their possessions and livestock, after which, they were forced to sign their land over for grain in order to survive.
Genesis 47: 20-21. Joseph bought all the land of Egypt for the king. Every Egyptian was forced to sell their land, because the famine was so severe; Joseph made slaves of all the people from one end of Egypt to the other, ‘without striking a blow.’
The Hyksos were described as bowmen and cavalrymen wearing the cloaks of many colours, much like the cloak of many colours that was worn by Joseph the son of Israel was the first under the Hyksos king, of who it is said in Genesis 50: 23; that he lived to receive the children of Machir the son of Manasseh into the family. And in Judges 5: 14, it is written that the commanders of the army came down from Machir, of who it is said in Joshua 17: 1; that Machir was the firstborn son of Manasseh, the first born of Joseph, and that he was a military hero, and the father of young Gilead.
Machir, who was a military Hero during the reign of the Shepherd Kings, was long dead by the time of the Exodus.
Gilead the first born of Machir would have been welcomed into the family by Joseph, and presumably, the funeral procession of Young Gilead who is thought to have died childless beside his father ‘Machir’ in a war against the people of the country that would later carry his name, ‘The land of Gilead’ which land was allocated to the descendants of Machir after the exodus. The funeral procession of the young Prince Gilead would have been led by his great grandfather Joseph, and possibly buried in his own tomb, which was to be later placed under a permanent guard against tomb robbers, because the high priest of Heliopolis had prophesied that if ever the bones of Joseph left Egypt, the LIGHT of Egypt would go with him.
After the Exodus , which was the release of the Israelites from under the yoke of the shepherd kings, and the removal of the mummified remains of Joseph, which were to be taken to Shechem and buried there in the land of Israel as per Joseph’s last wish, the Egyptian Guards would have been removed, and any grave robbers who were later confronted with the opened sarcophagus’ of Joseph and his wife in the empty tomb, would have assumed that others had beaten them to the treasures that the tomb of Joseph would have contained, and would have left empty handed.
After wandering the wilderness for 40 years as punishment for their rebellion against the commands of Moses to prepare to invade the land of Canaan, they finally obeyed the Lord and attacked Jericho.
The Anointed
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Continued from previous post.
In Galatians 3: 17; Paul says; “What I mean, is that God made a covenant with Abraham and promised to keep it. The Law that was given four hundred and thirty years later, (That is 430 years after God’s covenant/promise with Abraham) cannot break and cancel God’s promise.”
“Go from your country and your kindred and your father’s house to the land that I will show you. 2 And I will make of you a great nation, and your descendants will inherit that land,” this was the first covenant/promise that God made with Abraham.
The Roman OT, and the English Hebrew bible, both state in Exodus 12: 40; that the children of Israel were in the actual land of Egypt for 430 years to the day, Whereas the Septuagint, a Greek translation of the Hebrew Bible by 70 Jews in Alexandria some 300 years B C E, from which translation Jesus and his apostles taught, in Exodus 12: 40 reveals that the sojourning of the children of Israel, while they sojourned in THE LAND OF EGYPT AND THE LAND OF CANAAN, was 430 years. And it came to pass, after the 430 years, all the forces of the Lord came out of the land of Egypt by night.
From the Encarta encyclopedia: “Hyksos,” Semitic invaders who conquered Egypt in the early part of the 17th century BC and founded the 15th Dynasty. Sweeping south into Egypt, probably from Palestine and Syria, they and their nomadic followers captured Memphis and exacted tribute from the rest of the country. They established a stronghold at Avaris (possibly the later Tanis), on the northeastern border of the Nile delta, but left the territory above Memphis under the rule of tributary princes of the old nobility. These vassals started the nationalistic revolt that finally, under Ahmose I (reigned 1570-1546 BC), founder of the 18th Dynasty, drove out the foreign rulers.”
Although it is said in Exodus 12: 40; that the Israelites had lived in Egypt for 430 years, in Galatians 3: 17; Paul makes it quite clear that they were in the land of Egypt for only 215 years. See Gal 3: 17; which states, “God made a covenant/promise with Abraham and promised to keep it. The Law that was given [through Moses] 430 years later, cannot break that covenant and cancel God’s promise.” Plus, the Greek Septuagint and the Samaritan bible, have Abraham and his descendants sojourning in the land ‘of Canaan and Egypt’ for 430 years.
Paul was a student of Gamaliel one of the greatest Jewish teachers of those days, and if we accept Paul’s statement, that there was a period of 430 years between the time that God promised to Abraham, all the land that was occupied by the descendants of Canaan, and the exodus, then we must conclude that the children of Israel were only in Egypt for 215 years.
Abraham, who had entered Canaan at the age of 75, 25 years later when he was 100 sired Isaac, who was 60 when his son Jacob was born, and Jacob was 130 when he was reunited with his son Joseph in the land of Egypt. 25+60+130=215. So, we see that there was a period of 215 years between God’s promise to Abraham and the entry of the family of Israel into Egypt, where they dwelt for 215 years before departing 430 years after the covenant/promise was first made with Abraham.
In the early part of the 17TH century B.C, Semetic invaders (Called Hyksos) swept into Egypt. They would control Egypt for roughly two centuries The establishment of a Hyksos dynasty in northern Egypt marked the beginning of the Second Intermediate period, a time of turmoil and disunity that lasted for over 200 years.
According to the compilers of Young’s Analytical Concordance to the Bible, they date the exodus at somewhere around the year of 1500 BC about the period when the island of Santorini or Thira blew its top, when seismic waves flooded Egyptian croplands, causing a famine and other catastrophic events.
But the absolute proof as to the time the Israelites were actually in the land of Egypt, is to be found in the parents of Moses.
Is there any other way that we can date the Exodus of the Israelite shepherds? There certainly is.
1 Kings 6: 1; States that it was 480 years after the exodus, that Solomon began to build the temple, which took seven year to complete. According to Josephus the Jewish historian, the temple stood for four hundred and seventy years six months and ten days before it was sacked and burned by Nebuchadnezzar’s forces in 587 B.C.
587 B.C., + the four hundred and seventy years six months and ten days, rounded off to four hundred and seventy and one years that the Temple stood + the seven years it took to build, after the 480 years since the Exodus and we have 587 B.C., + 471 years = 1058 B.C., + 7 years = 1065 B.C., + 480 years = 1545 B.C. I am sure that that the diligent student will discover that the Exodus did occur 40 years before the fall of Jericho and not some 200 years later as taught by those who believe the erroneous teachings of the Roman church of Emperor Constantine, who believe that the Israelites were in the land of Canaan for 215 years, before moving into Egypt where they remained for 430 Years.
Apopis, is said to have been a Hyksos king of ancient Egypt and reigned c 1585-42 B.C., and Apopis was the Last of the Shepherd Kings? Remembering always that the radiocarbon tests which dated Kathleen Kenyon’s findings of the destruction of Jericho to 1562 BC (plus/minus 38 years) had only a certainty of 95%.
If it was 1545 B.C., when the 80 years old Moses, with the 600,000 Israelite men, their wives and children, departed the land of Egypt, this would have seriously depleted the forces of the Hyksos king and it was some three years later in 1542 B.C., that Ahmose I, was finally able to defeat the depleted forces of the Hyksos king, ‘Apopis,’ and send them packing.
In Galatians 3: 17; Paul says; “What I mean, is that God made a covenant with Abraham and promised to keep it. The Law that was given four hundred and thirty years later, (That is 430 years after God’s covenant/promise with Abraham) cannot break and cancel God’s promise.”
“Go from your country and your kindred and your father’s house to the land that I will show you. 2 And I will make of you a great nation, and your descendants will inherit that land,” this was the first covenant/promise that God made with Abraham.
The Roman OT, and the English Hebrew bible, both state in Exodus 12: 40; that the children of Israel were in the actual land of Egypt for 430 years to the day, Whereas the Septuagint, a Greek translation of the Hebrew Bible by 70 Jews in Alexandria some 300 years B C E, from which translation Jesus and his apostles taught, in Exodus 12: 40 reveals that the sojourning of the children of Israel, while they sojourned in THE LAND OF EGYPT AND THE LAND OF CANAAN, was 430 years. And it came to pass, after the 430 years, all the forces of the Lord came out of the land of Egypt by night.
From the Encarta encyclopedia: “Hyksos,” Semitic invaders who conquered Egypt in the early part of the 17th century BC and founded the 15th Dynasty. Sweeping south into Egypt, probably from Palestine and Syria, they and their nomadic followers captured Memphis and exacted tribute from the rest of the country. They established a stronghold at Avaris (possibly the later Tanis), on the northeastern border of the Nile delta, but left the territory above Memphis under the rule of tributary princes of the old nobility. These vassals started the nationalistic revolt that finally, under Ahmose I (reigned 1570-1546 BC), founder of the 18th Dynasty, drove out the foreign rulers.”
Although it is said in Exodus 12: 40; that the Israelites had lived in Egypt for 430 years, in Galatians 3: 17; Paul makes it quite clear that they were in the land of Egypt for only 215 years. See Gal 3: 17; which states, “God made a covenant/promise with Abraham and promised to keep it. The Law that was given [through Moses] 430 years later, cannot break that covenant and cancel God’s promise.” Plus, the Greek Septuagint and the Samaritan bible, have Abraham and his descendants sojourning in the land ‘of Canaan and Egypt’ for 430 years.
Paul was a student of Gamaliel one of the greatest Jewish teachers of those days, and if we accept Paul’s statement, that there was a period of 430 years between the time that God promised to Abraham, all the land that was occupied by the descendants of Canaan, and the exodus, then we must conclude that the children of Israel were only in Egypt for 215 years.
Abraham, who had entered Canaan at the age of 75, 25 years later when he was 100 sired Isaac, who was 60 when his son Jacob was born, and Jacob was 130 when he was reunited with his son Joseph in the land of Egypt. 25+60+130=215. So, we see that there was a period of 215 years between God’s promise to Abraham and the entry of the family of Israel into Egypt, where they dwelt for 215 years before departing 430 years after the covenant/promise was first made with Abraham.
In the early part of the 17TH century B.C, Semetic invaders (Called Hyksos) swept into Egypt. They would control Egypt for roughly two centuries The establishment of a Hyksos dynasty in northern Egypt marked the beginning of the Second Intermediate period, a time of turmoil and disunity that lasted for over 200 years.
According to the compilers of Young’s Analytical Concordance to the Bible, they date the exodus at somewhere around the year of 1500 BC about the period when the island of Santorini or Thira blew its top, when seismic waves flooded Egyptian croplands, causing a famine and other catastrophic events.
But the absolute proof as to the time the Israelites were actually in the land of Egypt, is to be found in the parents of Moses.
Is there any other way that we can date the Exodus of the Israelite shepherds? There certainly is.
1 Kings 6: 1; States that it was 480 years after the exodus, that Solomon began to build the temple, which took seven year to complete. According to Josephus the Jewish historian, the temple stood for four hundred and seventy years six months and ten days before it was sacked and burned by Nebuchadnezzar’s forces in 587 B.C.
587 B.C., + the four hundred and seventy years six months and ten days, rounded off to four hundred and seventy and one years that the Temple stood + the seven years it took to build, after the 480 years since the Exodus and we have 587 B.C., + 471 years = 1058 B.C., + 7 years = 1065 B.C., + 480 years = 1545 B.C. I am sure that that the diligent student will discover that the Exodus did occur 40 years before the fall of Jericho and not some 200 years later as taught by those who believe the erroneous teachings of the Roman church of Emperor Constantine, who believe that the Israelites were in the land of Canaan for 215 years, before moving into Egypt where they remained for 430 Years.
Apopis, is said to have been a Hyksos king of ancient Egypt and reigned c 1585-42 B.C., and Apopis was the Last of the Shepherd Kings? Remembering always that the radiocarbon tests which dated Kathleen Kenyon’s findings of the destruction of Jericho to 1562 BC (plus/minus 38 years) had only a certainty of 95%.
If it was 1545 B.C., when the 80 years old Moses, with the 600,000 Israelite men, their wives and children, departed the land of Egypt, this would have seriously depleted the forces of the Hyksos king and it was some three years later in 1542 B.C., that Ahmose I, was finally able to defeat the depleted forces of the Hyksos king, ‘Apopis,’ and send them packing.
The Anointed
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Continued from previous post.
From ‘The World Book Dictionary,’ (Hyksos) “A succession of six foreign rulers of Egypt—from about 1730 B.C. to about 1570 B.C; Shepherd Kings.” --- And from the Encyclopedia Britannica, ‘Hyksos’, invaders who were also called the Shepherd Kings, who in the time of “King Tutimaios” entered Egypt and took possession of it ‘without striking a blow.’
Genesis 41: After Joseph had revealed to the Hyksos king that his dreams were a prophecy telling of a seven-year period of plenty, which would be followed by a seven years period of severe drought, Joseph is made Governor of all Egypt, and all Egyptians were commanded by the King to obey him. The King removed his royal ring with its engraved seal and put it on the finger of Joseph. He was given the second royal chariot and a guard of honour who went ahead of him crying out, “Make way, make way.” And the King said: I am King, but no one in all of Egypt shall so much as lift a hand or a foot without Joseph’s permission. He gave Joseph an Egyptian wife, Asenath, the daughter of the High priest of Heliopolis, who prophesied that if ever the bones of Joseph left Egypt, the LIGHT of Egypt would go with him. For that reason, a permanent guard was set up to keep watch over the tomb of Joseph, in order that no one could remove the mummified body of Joseph.
During the seven years of plenty, Joseph gathered a percentage of the Egyptian grain crop as a tax, which was stored in silos throughout Egypt. In the early stages of the great seven-year drought, the Egyptians had to buy their grain from Joseph, when their money had all gone, they traded their possessions and livestock, after which, they were forced to sign their land over for grain in order to survive.
Genesis 47: 20-21. Joseph bought all the land of Egypt for the king. Every Egyptian was forced to sell their land, because the famine was so severe; Joseph made slaves of all the people from one end of Egypt to the other, ‘without striking a blow.’
The Hyksos were described as bowmen and cavalrymen wearing the cloaks of many colours, much like the cloak of many colours that was worn by Joseph the son of Israel was the first under the Hyksos king, of who it is said in Genesis 50: 23; that he lived to receive the children of Machir the son of Manasseh into the family. And in Judges 5: 14, it is written that the commanders of the army came down from Machir, of who it is said in Joshua 17: 1; that Machir was the firstborn son of Manasseh, the first born of Joseph, and that he was a military hero, and the father of young Gilead.
Machir, who was a military Hero during the reign of the Shepherd Kings, was long dead by the time of the Exodus.
Gilead the first born of Machir would have been welcomed into the family by Joseph, and presumably, the funeral procession of Young Gilead who is thought to have died childless beside his father ‘Machir’ in a war against the people of the country that would later carry his name, ‘The land of Gilead’ which land was allocated to the descendants of Machir after the exodus. The funeral procession of the young Prince Gilead would have been led by his great grandfather Joseph, and possibly buried in his own tomb, which was to be later placed under a permanent guard against tomb robbers, because the high priest of Heliopolis had prophesied that if ever the bones of Joseph left Egypt, the LIGHT of Egypt would go with him.
After the Exodus , which was the release of the Israelites from under the yoke of the shepherd kings, and the removal of the mummified remains of Joseph, which were to be taken to Shechem and buried there in the land of Israel as per Joseph’s last wish, the Egyptian Guards would have been removed, and any grave robbers who were later confronted with the opened sarcophagus’ of Joseph and his wife in the empty tomb, would have assumed that others had beaten them to the treasures that the tomb of Joseph would have contained, and would have left empty handed.
After wandering the wilderness for 40 years as punishment for their rebellion against the commands of Moses to prepare to invade the land of Canaan, they finally obeyed the Lord and attacked Jericho.
From ‘The World Book Dictionary,’ (Hyksos) “A succession of six foreign rulers of Egypt—from about 1730 B.C. to about 1570 B.C; Shepherd Kings.” --- And from the Encyclopedia Britannica, ‘Hyksos’, invaders who were also called the Shepherd Kings, who in the time of “King Tutimaios” entered Egypt and took possession of it ‘without striking a blow.’
Genesis 41: After Joseph had revealed to the Hyksos king that his dreams were a prophecy telling of a seven-year period of plenty, which would be followed by a seven years period of severe drought, Joseph is made Governor of all Egypt, and all Egyptians were commanded by the King to obey him. The King removed his royal ring with its engraved seal and put it on the finger of Joseph. He was given the second royal chariot and a guard of honour who went ahead of him crying out, “Make way, make way.” And the King said: I am King, but no one in all of Egypt shall so much as lift a hand or a foot without Joseph’s permission. He gave Joseph an Egyptian wife, Asenath, the daughter of the High priest of Heliopolis, who prophesied that if ever the bones of Joseph left Egypt, the LIGHT of Egypt would go with him. For that reason, a permanent guard was set up to keep watch over the tomb of Joseph, in order that no one could remove the mummified body of Joseph.
During the seven years of plenty, Joseph gathered a percentage of the Egyptian grain crop as a tax, which was stored in silos throughout Egypt. In the early stages of the great seven-year drought, the Egyptians had to buy their grain from Joseph, when their money had all gone, they traded their possessions and livestock, after which, they were forced to sign their land over for grain in order to survive.
Genesis 47: 20-21. Joseph bought all the land of Egypt for the king. Every Egyptian was forced to sell their land, because the famine was so severe; Joseph made slaves of all the people from one end of Egypt to the other, ‘without striking a blow.’
The Hyksos were described as bowmen and cavalrymen wearing the cloaks of many colours, much like the cloak of many colours that was worn by Joseph the son of Israel was the first under the Hyksos king, of who it is said in Genesis 50: 23; that he lived to receive the children of Machir the son of Manasseh into the family. And in Judges 5: 14, it is written that the commanders of the army came down from Machir, of who it is said in Joshua 17: 1; that Machir was the firstborn son of Manasseh, the first born of Joseph, and that he was a military hero, and the father of young Gilead.
Machir, who was a military Hero during the reign of the Shepherd Kings, was long dead by the time of the Exodus.
Gilead the first born of Machir would have been welcomed into the family by Joseph, and presumably, the funeral procession of Young Gilead who is thought to have died childless beside his father ‘Machir’ in a war against the people of the country that would later carry his name, ‘The land of Gilead’ which land was allocated to the descendants of Machir after the exodus. The funeral procession of the young Prince Gilead would have been led by his great grandfather Joseph, and possibly buried in his own tomb, which was to be later placed under a permanent guard against tomb robbers, because the high priest of Heliopolis had prophesied that if ever the bones of Joseph left Egypt, the LIGHT of Egypt would go with him.
After the Exodus , which was the release of the Israelites from under the yoke of the shepherd kings, and the removal of the mummified remains of Joseph, which were to be taken to Shechem and buried there in the land of Israel as per Joseph’s last wish, the Egyptian Guards would have been removed, and any grave robbers who were later confronted with the opened sarcophagus’ of Joseph and his wife in the empty tomb, would have assumed that others had beaten them to the treasures that the tomb of Joseph would have contained, and would have left empty handed.
After wandering the wilderness for 40 years as punishment for their rebellion against the commands of Moses to prepare to invade the land of Canaan, they finally obeyed the Lord and attacked Jericho.
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Aupmanyav
Be your own guru.
I may have said this earlier also. No one has even gone to heaven till now.. The heavenly mansions are empty. No one can reach there before the 'day of judgment', 'the Great Tribulation', 'yawm ad-din'. All the dead are presently lying in their graves. Thinking that someone has short-circuited the process (Judgment by God) and has reached heaven is blasphemy.
So you qctually joined all of them by disagreeing with them all.
Have you discovered ANYONE that agrees with you?
But those C14 tests were later shown to have been flawed (a mis-calibrated reading).
Bible Archaeology Report 2019:
Over the years several samples of charcoal and grain seeds from the final Canaanite city at Jericho have been tested for C-14 levels. The current Italian-Palestinian excavation team, directed by Lorenzo Nigro, tested two samples from the final destruction of the city in 2000; one sample dated to 1347 BC (+/- 85 years) and the other dated to 1597 (+/- 91 years).11 Archaeologist, Dr. Titus Kennedy, has summarized: “The first of these dates fits roughly around the proposed 1400 BC destruction, while the other is closer to the proposed 1550 BC destruction…these dates are so broad that they are useless in contributing to solving the problem for the date of destruction. Overall, the C-14 dates from the destruction of the Bronze Age city of Jericho range from as high as 1883 BC to as low as 1262 BC—a range of over 600 years.”
C14 tests provide no firm data.
Again, more recent studies suggest Kenyon's assumptious were incorrect.
"Both Garstang and Kenyon conducted significant excavations at Jericho. Both were excellent field archaeologists Garstang meticulously analyzed the pottery he excavated and Kenyon carefully improved excavation methodology in general. Yet both differed on their interpretation of the data. While the Carbon-14 data is of no help in determining the date of the destruction of Jericho, the dating of from glyphic/inscriptional evidence and ceramic typology would indicate that Garstang’s original date of ca. 1400 BC is the correct date. This would support the biblical chronology of Joshua’s army destroying Jericho in what we now call the Late Bronze Age I."
(Ibid)
Your 1505 date seems well off the mark.
The Anointed
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Good heavens, you come up with some tripe Thomas. Because the Roman church of Emperor Constantine has sucked you into believing that the Israelites were in Egypt for 430 years instead of the 215 years as revealed to those who study scripture rather than the words of the church on the seven hills, you are looking for a date for the destruction of JERICHO some 250 years after the Exodus of the Israelites, which was only some three years before the Hyksos invaders were finally kicked out of Egypt. Get on side mate, before you make a laughing fool of yourself.
In the 1950's, Kathleen Kenyon conducted further excavations at Jericho and concluded that the destruction of Garstang's City IV should be dated ca. 1550 B.C., not ca. 1400 B.C. In fact, Kenyon found no evidence at all of occupation of Jericho ca. 1407 B.C. And Kathleens date for the destruction of Jericho still stands despite all those who are attempting unsuccessfully to prove the Holy Scriptures wrong.
Wanna bet on that.
There will be no peace on this subject until your church admits that they are wrong in their belief that Israel was in Egypt for 430 years and will finally admit that they were only in Egypt for 215 years.
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The Anointed
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Faithfulservant
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Edit to not get involved in this one
The Anointed
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Too late.it went to my E-mail/
Ask the Jews how long their people were in Egypt if you don't want to ask the Catholics
Why would anyone want to ask the Jews or the Catholics when they have the Holy Scriptures.
In Galatians 3: 17; Paul says; “What I mean, is that God made a covenant with Abraham and promised to keep it. The Law that was given four hundred and thirty years later, (That is 430 years after God’s covenant/promise with Abraham) cannot break and cancel God’s promise.”
“Go from your country and your kindred and your father’s house to the land that I will show you. 2 And I will make of you a great nation, and your descendants will inherit that land,” this was the first covenant/promise that God made with Abraham.
The Roman OT, and the English Hebrew bible, both state in Exodus 12: 40; that the children of Israel were in the actual land of Egypt for 430 years to the day, Whereas the Septuagint, a Greek translation of the Hebrew Bible by 70 Jews in Alexandria some 300 years B C E, from which translation Jesus and his apostles taught, in Exodus 12: 40 reveals that the sojourning of the children of Israel, while they sojourned in the land of Egypt AND THE LAND OF CANAAN, was 430 years. And it came to pass, after the 430 years, all the forces of the Lord came out of the land of Egypt by night.
But rather than explain the truth once again try reading posts 147, 149, 150, 151.
Is this your idea of interfaith dialogue?
The Anointed
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Well I could have said. ' Only when the Roman church of Emperor Constantine and all her daughter denominations who were born from her erroneous or false teachings, and those of the Jewish faith who have been deceived into believing the same lie, have finally admitted that the Israelites were only in the land of Egypt for 215 years and not the 430 years that the Roman and Hebrew bibles both erroneously claim, will the truth bring peace to the subject.