Deism, a badger's point of view.

[badger]

How to find my way, the way of my own soul? Perhaps God speaks to every soul?

If you have a soul, something that might somehow exist afterlife, then it might be best to leave be and to find the way of life in this moment of time.
One of the freedoms of Deism is that we live for this moment in time, and not under any threats or promises for any afterlife. Living in the moment doesn't mean we can't plan for pensions or write wills etc, it just means that we live in life now.

 

[badger]

Not in my neighborhood.

Hello! I've seen your posts before on some other planet, or somewhere.

Is your neighbourhood Judaism? If so then surely your cornerstone is 613 laws?

 

[badger]

What is nature? Where are the bounds of nature? Do you mean life on Earth?

No.... Well, yes, everything upon this planet is of Nature, the governor around here, but Mother Nature is the governor of everything in this universe, everything, anything, and all the nothingness as well.

Where are the bounds of Nature, you ask me....... Nature is unbounded within this universe as far as I can perceive, and beyond it I have no knowledge.

 

[RJM]

If you have a soul, something that might somehow exist afterlife, then it might be best to leave be and to find the way of life in this moment of time.
One of the freedoms of Deism is that we live for this moment in time, and not under any threats or promises for any afterlife. Living in the moment doesn't mean we can't plan for pensions or write wills etc, it just means that we live in life now.

Having a soul doesn't preclude living in the now. It means not letting material attachment get in the way of the real purpose of human existence, beyond the Plato's cave shadow play of nature, imo

What spirit exactly? Where do you perceive this spirit?

It is with me all the time. Closer than breathing. It is my centre.
It is the same Great Spirit spoken of in all cultures

In a sacred manner I live
To the heavens I gazed
In a sacred manner I live
My horses are many
(Old Sioux Song)

 

[RJM]

IMO the eventual lesson to be learned from nature is that all things change; there is no peace to be found in material attachments. I never really think about the afterlife. As you say, who really knows? It's about peace of mind in this world amid the changes. It cannot come from the importance of material attachments -- which is not the same as lacking gratitude for the good things I am given?

 

[badger]

Having a soul doesn't preclude living in the now. It means not letting material attachment get in the way of the real purpose of human existence, beyond the Plato's cave shadow play of nature, imo

Now that's what Jesus was talking about, imo, the 'letting-go' about mammon.
I live in Southern England where small-Christianity once abounded, now less so. Many years ago I surveyed property for a large security company which received orders from the Diocesan Board of the Church of England. I was sent to an ancient property where a church dignitary's family lived, and the riches within were just breath-taking, a long cabinet holding several pairs of shotguns made by Purdy, Holland&Holland, etc any pair of which could buy a house back then or today. And the hard ruthlessness of the woman who received me.......... material attachment.
And I'm not just poking at the Christianity that is here...... I don't know many folks who are not strung up about status, class, materialism, the whole package of sadness, and it's not longer Christianity because there isn't that much around here anymore.

If you have left all that mammon stuff behind then you are a rich person

It is with me all the time. Closer than breathing. It is my centre.
It is the same Great Spirit spoken of in all cultures

In a sacred manner I live
To the heavens I gazed
In a sacred manner I live
My horses are many
(Old Sioux Song)

That Sioux knew about the great spirit, he lived in the heart of the Great Spirit each moment, he knew about Mother Nature....or that is my proposal.

And I'll bet that as and when he took life (for whatever reason) or ate food, he would speak to it, explaining that he too would be taken for a better purpose. I'll bet that his way was not so different from the ancient peoples here, before the Romans brought their mammon. Now I could listen to such as him, they are just a bit hard to find around here.

I really like that concept, but for me it is here, in the weather, the sun and moon, the sends of the seasons and surges of the migrations. I can see that.

 

[badger]

IMO the eventual lesson to be learned from nature is that all things change; there is no peace to be found in material attachments. I never really think about the afterlife. As you say, who really knows? It's about peace of mind in this world amid the changes. It cannot come from the importance of material attachments -- which is not the same as lacking gratitude for the good things I am given?

Agreed.....all of it.
Everything is in a state of constant change, just as you say, so there is the 'now' to be grateful for, I think.
I try to take every ounce of life from the 'now', and treasure each moment, but many of my friends throw each moment away with the stresses and worries of life, very few which are really important.

I do like reading Khayyam......


Oh, How sweet is mortal Sovranty...think some,
Others....'How blest the Paradise to come'.
Ah, take the cash in hand and wave the rest,
Oh, the brave music of a distant drum!
Omar Khayyam

 

[RJM]

Sure. And the powers kill those who speak truth? No change, imo ...

 

[badger]

Sure. And the powers kill those who speak truth? No change, imo ...

I don't understand what you're saying .......
You would need to expand on that post before I can see your point.

 

[RJM]

I don't understand what you're saying .......
You would need to expand on that post before I can see your point.

Sorry.
I'm not quite sure what I do mean. Truth is dangerous. If Christ returned, they'd do it again. In fact they still do keep on killing him. Trying to. Something along those lines?

 

[badger]

Sorry.
I'm not quite sure what I mean. Truth is dangerous. If Christ returned, they'd do it again. In fact they still do keep on killing him. Something along those lines?

Thank you for that.
Truth can be dangerous, for sure, but lies are dangerous as well.
If I was walking up Canterbury high street and a person approached, telling me to follow because they had come to bring God's message to a wayward and messed up world, I might offer some money for a breakfast, or listen for a while but I'd not follow; Zebedee didn't follow...!

You know that I'm unsure about how things ended for Jesus, but I get your point. The way I perceive things, I don't personally know a Christian that actually follows Jesus, not one....some seem to follow Paul, what he wanted, but even then they break Paul's 'rules'.

 

[RJM]

@badger
He would probably condemn many of the Christian 'religious professionals' who profess to own the truth, as he condemned many religious professionals of the day. Christ condemned few others, imo

Sorry to take your thread off-track

 

[badger]

@badger
He would probably condemn many of the Christian 'religious professionals' who profess to own the truth, as he condemned many religious professionals of the day. Christ condemned few others, imo

Absolutely for sure! Fat, corrupted hypocrites? There are a few around.
I think that Jesus did condemn others, or rather he condemned their failings, but the priest class he absolutely condemned outright, as did the Baptist.

Sorry to take your thread off-track

I don't mind conversations that wander and have no problems with that on any threads of mine.

 

[RJM]

the priest class he absolutely condemned outright, as did the Baptist.

I mainly mean the 'pastors' and political Christians, because I know many monks and monk-priests and they are not hypocrites.

 

[Tony Bristow-Stagg]

@badger
He would probably condemn many of the Christian 'religious professionals' who profess to own the truth, as he condemned many religious professionals of the day. Christ condemned few others, imo

Sorry to take your thread off-track

That exactly what happened.



What else can be offered?

@badger, my sparring mate OB, will get a smile from this reply

Regards Tony

 

[badger]

I mainly mean the 'pastors' and political Christians, because I know many monks and monk-priests and they are not hypocrites.

Yes..,. fair enough.
I tend not to think of monks as priests since many of their vocations are about insulated meditation and isolated lifestyles.

How do you know lots of monks? Is it that you are a Catholic or just that you visit monasteries a lot? Obviously we still do have monasteries here in the UK, but after Henry 8th's lootings, pillagings and murders they're not so frequent as before.

 

[badger]

That exactly what happened.



What else can be offered?

@badger, my sparring mate OB, will get a smile from this reply

Regards Tony

Good morning (evening in Oz) Tony!
Yes, Jesus did condemn fat, corrupted, quisling priests in his day.

You find a happy and contented badger this morning (evening in Oz) because this week the boot-fair in the back-field has recommenced for the summer.... the previously soft ground has dried and hardened, the curlews have forsaken it for softer marshes and the gifts of chance abound once more. Some readers might feel that this is a total em[igration from the OP but it's just an obvious fact that all Deists love ....boot-fairs, digging stuff up, etc......it is the very essence of Deism, for badgers.

On Wednesday, the 1st boot-fair, I found a Victorian bronze working cannon in a box of brass stuff for £3...... 50 years ago I could have fired this delightful little gun because I kept black powder for wildfowling, but today all I will do is finish restoring it's carriage. Happy days!

 

[RJM]

How do you know lots of monks?

I used to do monastery retreats at Buckfast Abbey in Devon

I tend not to think of monks as priests

A lot of them are

Obviously we still do have monasteries here in the UK, but after Henry 8th's lootings, pillagings and murders they're not so frequent as before.

They're mostly small communities of old men these days. Few new members

 

[RJM]

It's the monks who have kept the church alive, down through thousands of years. Their unchanging ritual and repetitive prayer is the shell of the nut, that has preserved the living truth within imo. They have always been the keepers of the flame. There's an idea that monks changed the scriptures, but that's not the case. Their whole life is devoted to preserving the authenticity of the prayers and scriptures. If one monastery tried to change the Bible, it would be countered by another monastery.

The Catholic church is probably the largest NGO charity organisation in the world. Catholic organisations work directly with lepers and aids patients in the most difficult and dangerous places. Catholic priests and nuns take vows of poverty, chastity and obedience.

https://catholicherald.co.uk/a-worldwide-force-for-good/
Stalin famously said of the Church, “The Pope! How many divisions has he?” Less well known is Churchill’s response that Stalin “might have mentioned a number of legions not always visible on parade”. Indeed, the reach and influence of the Church are not easily described by statistics alone, yet the raw statistics are staggering enough.

The Church operates more than 140,000 schools, 10,000 orphanages, 5,000 hospitals and some 16,000 other health clinics. Caritas, the umbrella organisation for Catholic aid agencies, estimates that spending by its affiliates totals between £2 billion and £4 billion, making it one of the biggest aid agencies in the world.

Even these numbers only tell half the tale. Caritas does not include development spending by a host of religious orders and other Catholic charities, while most of the 200,000 Catholic parishes around the world operate their own small-scale charitable projects which are never picked up in official figures. Establishing like-for-like comparisons is hard, but there can be little doubt that in pretty much every field of social action, from education to health to social care, the Church is the largest and most significant non-state organisation in the world …
Read full article

Mutemwa care centre
Working with lepers in Zimbabwe

 

[RJM]

Spot the difference:

Joel Olsteen