Why do you need Jesus? He saves you from what?

Namaste Jesus

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Jesus was not here to save himself. God gave his only begotten Son so that we might be saved.
John 3:15-17

15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.

16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
 

'Amir Alzzalam

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Think about it . . .
God Creates Heaven and Earth
God Creates Man
God Enables Sin
God Sends His only Son down to Earth to die for Something God Created in the First Place
 

Namaste Jesus

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Read the book all is revealed. Yes, God laid the foundation for all that there is. God showed us the righteous path to follow too, spelling out quite clearly what was good and what was evil and the consequences thereof, but he also gave us the freedom to decide which path to follow for ourselves. So it is not God who enables sin, but us when we fail to heed his words.

Mankind is all too quick to take credit for what is good, but to blame God for what is bad. Neither Satan nor God will enter your home uninvited and which one gets that invitation is dependent not or words, but our actions.

Thing is, even though many turn their back on the creator, God loves his children so much that he's still willing to forgive them and take the hit in their stead and all he asks for in return is our belief and love...
 

Spartta

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Jesus was not here to save himself. God gave his only begotten Son so that we might be saved.
John 3:15-17

15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.

16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
Thanks for these anwers. We believers are together in this mission to spread the gospel. I pray you will be blessed in Jesus name. Amen.
 

Namaste Jesus

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Thanks for these anwers. We believers are together in this mission to spread the gospel. I pray you will be blessed in Jesus name. Amen.
You're quite welcome, Spartta. Nothing wrong with sharing your beliefs, that's what we're here for, but please know this is an interfaith forum and not everyone sees God quite the same way. We try our best to respect that here and not proselytize.

Here's a useful link to help you know what we're all about.
https://www.interfaith.org/community/threads/7047/

Welcome and God Bless, my friend.
 

'Amir Alzzalam

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I take my lead directly from the Christian bible. Yahweh does not paint a pleasant, loving picture regarding His 'children'.


1 Chronicles 21
-God kills 70,000 innocent people because David ordered a census of the people

Deuteronomy 3
-God also orders the destruction of 60 cities so that the Israelites can live there. -He orders the killing of all the men, women, and children of each city, and the looting of all of value

Joshua 6
-He orders another attack and the killing of “all the living creatures of the city: men and women, young, and old, as well as oxen sheep, and asses”

-In (Judges 21) He orders the murder of all the people of Jabesh-gilead

2 Kings 10:18-27
God orders the murder of all the worshipers of a different god in their very own church!

Judges 21:10-24
God has an entire town killed and the virgins repeatedly raped, and then wanted more virgins, so they hid beside the road to kidnap and rape some more.

Numbers 31:7-18
"They attacked Midian just as the LORD had commanded Moses, and they killed all the men . . . Now kill all the boys and all the women who have slept with a man. Only the young girls who are virgins may live; you may keep them for yourselves.

In total God kills 371,186 people
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How could Adam and Eve know of good and evil prior to sinning? It was only after eating of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil that they came “to know good and evil” (Genesis 3:5). Why would Yahweh (who is omniscient, omnipotent) punish them for an evil action if they did not know what evil was?
 

Namaste Jesus

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I take my lead directly from the Christian bible. Yahweh does not paint a pleasant, loving picture regarding His 'children'.
Yes, some choose to read it that way, putting the emphasis on the aftermath rather than the cause, man's own folly. Like I said, God laid the foundation for all that there is, showed us the righteous path, spelled out what was good and what was evil, the consequences of each and left it to us to decide.
How could Adam and Eve know of good and evil prior to sinning? It was only after eating of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil that they came “to know good and evil”
No, God sought to shield Adam and Eve from evil beforehand, expressly telling them not to mess with Satan, (metaphorically, eat from the tree of knowledge). Eve disobeyed then coerced Adam to do same. So what happens? God gives them a chance to redeem themselves, but when confronted, rather than owning up to their indiscretions, just as folks do to this day, Adam tried to blame God, "Hey, not my fault, that woman you gave me, it was her idea!" So they end up being cast from the garden. Again, the result of man's own folly.

Blaming God for the misfortunes that befall us, is like condemning the power company because despite the yellow warning sticker, you decided to stick your finger in a light socket, injuring yourself and others around you. "Oh, a loving power company would not have let this happen!"
 

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Jesus is the answer to all your problems. This video explains you from what does He save you and why.

In theology he saves believers from sins. To me, Jesus isn't alive to save me and I don't agree that people "should" die for me to take away responsibility for my misdeeds.

I see it more our actions are "put out into the wind" and through complicated chain of events we may experience the repercussions subtle or avert.

Maybe a better question is who/what people believe in and how does that belief, idea, or action "save them?" Ask people what keeps them alive. Jesus isn't always the answer.
 

'Amir Alzzalam

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Yes, some choose to read it that way, putting the emphasis on the aftermath rather than the cause, man's own folly. Like I said, God laid the foundation for all that there is, showed us the righteous path, spelled out what was good and what was evil, the consequences of each and left it to us to decide.

No, God sought to shield Adam and Eve from evil beforehand, expressly telling them not to mess with Satan, (metaphorically, eat from the tree of knowledge). Eve disobeyed then coerced Adam to do same. So what happens? God gives them a chance to redeem themselves, but when confronted, rather than owning up to their indiscretions, just as folks do to this day, Adam tried to blame God, "Hey, not my fault, that woman you gave me, it was her idea!" So they end up being cast from the garden. Again, the result of man's own folly.

Blaming God for the misfortunes that befall us, is like condemning the power company because despite the yellow warning sticker, you decided to stick your finger in a light socket, injuring yourself and others around you. "Oh, a loving power company would not have let this happen!"
Let's take a closer look at this god (Yahweh) thing of yours.
This god is allegedly omniscient and can see all so He knows the outcome of everything. God is capable of changing anything that exists in reality as he is capable of anything possible. He created Adam & Eve with Free Will but He already knew the outcome of everything they would do before they did it. This makes god responsible for their actions and for introducing Sin into mankind. This is called deception, Adam & Eve did not have Free Will and was the first of many lies by this god.

Now, let's take a look at the real hero of the Christian bible, The Serpent.

God is speaking in this verse, Genesis 3:22 - “The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever.”

The Serpent told Eve, “God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil” (Genesis 3:5).

The Original Sin contends that every human life begins under the curse of the Abrahamic god. This curse was the result of Adam and Eve innocently and ignorantly eating of the fruit from the tree of knowledge of good and evil. Partaking of this fruit enabled their conscious awareness of their Higher Self/GodSelf and allowed 'them' to evaluate what was good and what was evil based on their own intelligence and experience . . . not the Abrahamic god's. The Serpent in the Garden guided Adam & Eve away from the Abrahamic god and away from the chains of spiritual oppression that hold back Mankind from true liberation.
 

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The Original Sin contends that every human life begins under the curse of the Abrahamic god. This curse was the result of Adam and Eve innocently and ignorantly eating of the fruit from the tree of knowledge of good and evil. Partaking of this fruit enabled their conscious awareness of their Higher Self/GodSelf and allowed 'them' to evaluate what was good and what was evil based on their own intelligence and experience . . . not the Abrahamic god's. The Serpent in the Garden guided Adam & Eve away from the Abrahamic god and away from the chains of spiritual oppression that hold back Mankind from true liberation.
That's totally wrong.
G-d does not ask us not to do something for some selfish reason.
When mankind disobey what G-d commands us, there are unavoidable consequences.

Yes, by our very nature, we usually disobey and have to find out for ourselves.
G-d only wishes good for us, and to avoid the pitfalls. We can't achieve that through pride and arrogance.
In reality, we are not truly independent. It is only an "illusion" for a time. Wealth [ or lack of it ] is a test for us.
 

Namaste Jesus

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You seem to have created your own narrative, 'Amir Alzzalam. Nothing new there. That was a favorite ploy of Satan throughout the Bible, twisting God's word in order to deceive. As witnessed in Genesis 3, where Satan tricks Eve. So, suffice it to say, I don't share your take on things.

Though his influence remains great, Satan was effectively defeated on the cross. The day is coming, God says, when you (not just your offspring) will be defeated and removed from the earth. The offspring of this woman will crush you (see Romans 16:20 and Hebrews 2:14). From a Christian perspective, that decisive blow was struck by the perfect offspring of the woman, Jesus Christ, when he died on the cross. This is one of the reasons why the eternal Son of God had to become a man — because it was the offspring of the woman who would crush Satan.

To learn where Satan and his followers are headed, see Revelations 20:
 

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@Spartta
It looks like you're just going to pop off your video and then disappear? Are you not interested in joining the debate that you initiated?
 
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Namaste Jesus

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Might be all he had to say. His short video is pretty succinct. Some concur, some don't Like Aussie's father use to say, "I just put the seeds in the ground, what happens next is up to God."
 
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Might be all he had to say. His short video is pretty succinct. Some concur, some don't Like Aussie's father use to say, "I just put the seeds in the ground, what happens next is up to God."
Like a sermon? Post your bit, then split -- no question time?

How does the evangelist counter the satanist? Is that not the issue here?
 
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In the open arena of ideas?
 

Namaste Jesus

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Like a sermon? Post your bit, then split -- no question time?
Don't think so, he seems to understand about proselytizing being frowned upon here and he did put a like on #7, so I don't think he came to preach, just spread the word as it were. More or less said that in his reply to me in #6.
How does the evangelist counter the satanist? Is that not the issue here?
Idk, perhaps he feels God's word speaks for itself and doesn't need defending. Then again maybe he just doesn't want to give naysayers the attention they so crave. Don't know... I avoid addressing such nonsense myself. I mean, it's an exercise in frustration trying to get through to these guys. I just like to point out when scripture is being deliberately manipulated for the benefit of folks that may be new to the faith. At the end of the day though, I think satanists and the like are their own worst enemies, but I'm quite sure they feel the same way about believers. So, it's a wash! :p
 

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@Namaste Jesus
@RJM

On a YouTube page, Spartta mentioned that he lives to evangelize. Even so, most of the video he posted would be acceptable as a standard statement of a traditional Christian viewpoint. However, it careens off the tracks, in my opinion, at the very end when it pushes the viewer to accept Jesus as lord and savior and to pray what is referred to in many corners as “the sinner’s prayer”.

I don’t have a problem with Spartta continuing as a contributing member of the forum as long, of course, he stays within the bounds of our Code of Conduct. It may be, however, that he finds the Code too confining for his purposes. Only he can answer that question.

In the spirit of fellowship, I do say to @Spartta - Welcome to the forum!
 

Namaste Jesus

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On a YouTube page, Spartta mentioned that he lives to evangelize. Even so, most of the video he posted would be acceptable as a standard statement of a traditional Christian viewpoint. However, it careens off the tracks, in my opinion, at the very end when it pushes the viewer to accept Jesus as lord and savior and to pray what is referred to in many corners as “the sinner’s prayer”.
I didn't take it that way. The video just calmly presents a Christian perspective and asks a question: Do you want to receive Jesus Christ as your lord and savior? If so, pray this... No demand to accept Jesus, no demand to pray, no push to repent. He just asks.

Now there's currently threads on the Christian and Islamic boards all but calling Christianity a lie, while strongly pushing the Islamic POV. Spartta as yet, has not done this, nor attempted to discredit anyone's faith. He's just spreading the word as our scripture instructs us to do, IMO.
 
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