Current suppression of Baha'is in Iran

Citation please,?

86. Should anyone intentionally destroy a house by fire, him also shall ye burn; should anyone deliberately take another’s life, him also shall ye put to death.

The law of Bahá’u’lláh prescribes the death penalty for murder and arson, with the alternative of life imprisonment (see note 87).

(The Kitáb-i-Aqdas)
www.bahai.org/r/774091189

87. Should ye condemn the arsonist and the murderer to life imprisonment, it would be permissible according to the provisions of the Book. ¶62

Shoghi Effendi, in response to a question about this verse of the Aqdas, affirmed that while capital punishment is permitted, an alternative, “life imprisonment,” has been provided “whereby the rigors of such a condemnation can be seriously mitigated.” He states that “Bahá’u’lláh has given us a choice and has, therefore, left us free to use our own discretion within certain limitations imposed by His law.” In the absence of specific guidance concerning the application of this aspect of Bahá’í law, it remains for the Universal House of Justice to legislate on the matter in the future.

(The Kitáb-i-Aqdas)
www.bahai.org/r/396574667
 
86. Should anyone intentionally destroy a house by fire, him also shall ye burn; should anyone deliberately take another’s life, him also shall ye put to death.

The law of Bahá’u’lláh prescribes the death penalty for murder and arson, with the alternative of life imprisonment (see note 87).

(The Kitáb-i-Aqdas)
www.bahai.org/r/774091189

87. Should ye condemn the arsonist and the murderer to life imprisonment, it would be permissible according to the provisions of the Book. ¶62

Shoghi Effendi, in response to a question about this verse of the Aqdas, affirmed that while capital punishment is permitted, an alternative, “life imprisonment,” has been provided “whereby the rigors of such a condemnation can be seriously mitigated.” He states that “Bahá’u’lláh has given us a choice and has, therefore, left us free to use our own discretion within certain limitations imposed by His law.” In the absence of specific guidance concerning the application of this aspect of Bahá’í law, it remains for the Universal House of Justice to legislate on the matter in the future.
 
86. Should anyone intentionally destroy a house by fire, him also shall ye burn; should anyone deliberately take another’s life, him also shall ye put to death.

The law of Bahá’u’lláh prescribes the death penalty for murder and arson, with the alternative of life imprisonment (see note 87).

(The Kitáb-i-Aqdas)
www.bahai.org/r/774091189

87. Should ye condemn the arsonist and the murderer to life imprisonment, it would be permissible according to the provisions of the Book. ¶62

Shoghi Effendi, in response to a question about this verse of the Aqdas, affirmed that while capital punishment is permitted, an alternative, “life imprisonment,” has been provided “whereby the rigors of such a condemnation can be seriously mitigated.” He states that “Bahá’u’lláh has given us a choice and has, therefore, left us free to use our own discretion within certain limitations imposed by His law.” In the absence of specific guidance concerning the application of this aspect of Bahá’í law, it remains for the Universal House of Justice to legislate on the matter in the future.

(The Kitáb-i-Aqdas)
www.bahai.org/r/396574667
That's strange....
I was waiting for section 61 of the Aqdas, like so:-
61.
Should anyone intentionally destroy a house by fire, him also shall ye burn; should anyone deliberately take another’s life, him also shall ye put to death. Take ye hold of the precepts of God with all your strength and power, and abandon the ways of the ignorant. Should ye condemn the arsonist and the murderer to life imprisonment, it would be permissible according to the provisions of the Book. He, verily, hath power to ordain whatsoever He pleaseth.

However, I need to call @Aupmanyav , his attention to the above, thus:-
....concerning the application of this aspect of Bahá’í law, it remains for the Universal House of Justice to legislate on the matter in the future.....
Aup.... I think that the UHJ can indeed adjust, include, add and redact Bahai law when sitting as one, in quorum. And so it could, if it wished, announce that all/any provisions for the enforcement of criminal laws by Bahai are redacted... maybe? This would totally eradicate any suggestion that Bahai might wish, one day, to rule any communities at all. ....... if it wanted to. ???
 
That's strange....
I was waiting for section 61 of the Aqdas, like so

Then why ask since you already have the answer?

What does @badger suggest society should do with a murderer - such as a mass shooter - who intentionally kills a group of people?
 
The political campaigning of Baha’is in the west against the government of Iran could actually be making things worse for the Baha’is there, helping the Iranian government to brand the Baha’i Faith as as an anti-Iranian political movement and not a true religion.
 
The political campaigning of Baha’is in the west against the government of Iran could actually be making things worse for the Baha’is there, helping the Iranian government to brand the Baha’i Faith as as an anti-Iranian political movement and not a true religion.

Example?
 
....concerning the application of this aspect of Bahá’í law, it remains for the Universal House of Justice to legislate on the matter in the future.....
Aup.... I think that the UHJ can indeed adjust, include, add and redact Bahai law when sitting as one, in quorum. And so it could, if it wished, announce that all/any provisions for the enforcement of criminal laws by Bahai are redacted... maybe? This would totally eradicate any suggestion that Bahai might wish, one day, to rule any communities at all. ....... if it wanted to. ???

That is nearly right OB. The laws already stated are not able to be changed. They will stand for this dispensation.

The Universal House of Justice can enact and repeal laws that are not already in the book. Also the details of the laws already set, such as the penalties, are also able to be set and repealed, as many laws do not yet have the set penalty details given.

Regards Tony
 
The political campaigning of Baha’is in the west against the government of Iran could actually be making things worse for the Baha’is there, helping the Iranian government to brand the Baha’i Faith as as an anti-Iranian political movement and not a true religion.

Seems like a dammed if you do and dammed if you do type of situation

How will it change, if not by the Baha'i appealing to the world body, which is currently the United Nations, where it is open to all?

Is this not the embryo of the future?

Regards Tony
 
Then why ask since you already have the answer?
I was waiting to see yours........ What a sweet piece of legislation. In the West we thought Bahai was just sweetness and love, until we saw the translations. I think that's how folks like Juan Cole got in to trouble.

What does @badger suggest society should do with a murderer - such as a mass shooter - who intentionally kills a group of people?[/QUOTE]
We're dealing with one right at this time!
We're going to put up with some serious difficulties in order to support the violated people.
.....Green-belt violators and ankle gated convicts? We're involved with something as bad as the Invasion of Poland was in 38' so your moans won't be heard too much in the West.
 
The political campaigning of Baha’is in the west against the government of Iran could actually be making things worse for the Baha’is there, helping the Iranian government to brand the Baha’i Faith as as an anti-Iranian political movement and not a true religion.
They already know, Longfellow.....

⦁ The Bab began the fifth Wahid of the fifth Bab Al-Bayan as follows: "Those who do not accept the Bab and his religion, all their belongings should be snatched away from them, if that is possible: but if they accept him their property can be returned to them."
 
You asked Longfellow for an example of Bahai being 'political'?
I think that this has been made quite clear for most folks.

Or did you believe that Bahai was purely theological and doctrinal?
 
That is nearly right OB. The laws already stated are not able to be changed. They will stand for this dispensation.
Tony..... they changed the marriage laws.

The Universal House of Justice can enact and repeal laws that are not already in the book. Also the details of the laws already set, such as the penalties, are also able to be set and repealed, as many laws do not yet have the set penalty details given.

Regards Tony
I know..... when a religion's World assembly can pass and alter criminal laws and sentences, you know its not just a theological assembly!
That House of Justice in a Bahai World? Now that would be a real shocker.
 
I know..... when a religion's World assembly can pass and alter criminal laws and sentences, you know its not just a theological assembly!
That House of Justice in a Bahai World? Now that would be a real shocker.

One has absolutely no idea what that will be like, as no one living today could know. In fact I would offer it will be the opposite, it will be Paradise, God's Kingdom on Earth as it is in Heaven. :D

So, they are really ludicrous statements OB, but you already know that. ;)

Regards Tony
 
86. Should anyone intentionally destroy a house by fire, him also shall ye burn; should anyone deliberately take another’s life, him also shall ye put to death.
Shoghi (or House of Justice, for that matter) had/have no right to amend what Bahaollah said. This is corruption of Allah's message.
Allah's message was categorical. Why should there be any doubt?
Furthermore, all those who go by amended laws are no longer Bahais and are 'covenant breakers'.
 
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Shoghi (or House of Justice, for that matter) had/have no right to amend what Bahaollah said. This is corruption of Allah's message.
Allah's message was categorical. Why should there be any doubt?
Furthermore, all those who go by amended laws are no longer Bahais and are 'covenant breakers'.

In fact, it was Baha'u'llah that gave them that Authority.

Regards Tony
 
One has absolutely no idea what that will be like, as no one living today could know. In fact I would offer it will be the opposite, it will be Paradise, God's Kingdom on Earth as it is in Heaven. :D

So, they are really ludicrous statements OB, but you already know that. ;)

Regards Tony
Hang on........ I've read the doctrine, the laws, the system......... World Order? Terrifying imo.
 
Shoghi (or House of Justice, for that matter) had/have no right to amend what Bahaollah said. This is corruption of Allah's message.
Allah's message was categorical. Why should there be any doubt?
Furthermore, all those who go by amended laws are no longer Bahais and are 'covenant breakers'.

I don't think Bahai can see it your way, Aup.

And talking of suppression, if a parking enforcement officer stuck a ticket on a Bahai window it would seem like persecution to the car owner.
 
In fact, it was Baha'u'llah that gave them that Authority.

Regards Tony

Therefore........ why can't the UHJ announce that Bahai has no interests in forming any kind of World power, would never support its own army nor police force, will redact all its criminal laws and punishments as unnecessary and simply become a spiritual faith?
 
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