Love

Was he not religious?
Or, are you comparing the average religious person to Jesus?

(I thought @muhammad_isa was referring to the average religious person, claiming to be able to infer G-d's judgment?)
Catholics refer to 'the religious' as the formal members of the various religious orders: the priests and monks and nuns, with their religious clothing and communities and ritualized prayer times, and so on.
He spoke against religion and religious people. God's judgement is clearly stated in scripture.
He spoke against religious hypocrites, imo
 
Jesus being God in the flesh.
Are verses such as these blasphemy?

"It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life."

Saying God is in the flesh, That logically would be saying God profiteth nothing.

The body is gifted as a temple for our Soul, but it does not contain the Spirit that is the Light and Life.

Much can be discussed.

Regards Tony
 
You lost your wisdom long ago when you surrendered your own God given gift of thought and reason to Baha'u'llah imo
 
Am I correct in assuming that this is what you are referring to in a later post.

I hope that I can correctly answer this. There is the Church, believers in Christ. They will be for us, then there is the rest. They will be against us. Persecution is a sign that the Church is real. Meaning individual people, not an organization or a building.
Like I said in an earlier response, The first half of your post is Scripture, the second part I don’t remember as being Scripture.

Not sure as to your meaning of “poles”, just had to decipher on my own here. I thought the question was about Matthew 11:28-30.
You said, Mt 11:28-30 opened your eyes to the Truth of God; this Word spoke to you in particular, and I asked, what did/does it mean for you?
Now, you answered on what I meant with the opposite pole: the hardness of persecution.

I see the latter, the persecution, rather as a word in the time, not an eternal rule, and I see that just in the pleonasm of the two sayings, "Who is not against us, is in favour of us", earlier in Jesus' ministry, and the later "Who is not in favour of us is against us". I dispute Muslim scholars who just say, the latest statement of Muhammad is the definite statement. If you have two contradictory statements, it's a clear sign that neither is independent from the situation. So I don't think that animosity towards Christians needs to be perpetual, or even more, that this is a sign of a living community.

I read a novel called «Il Visconte Dimezzato», where the story goes like that:

A duke has been divided into two halfs by a sword, but the two halfs kept on living. One half was entirely good, and the other half was entirely bad. Of course, the people hated and feared the bad part. But more and more, also the entirely good part got a lot of enemies, because it didn't only do good but also accused all evil, and as all people did not always do good, they got upset against the good part as well. In the end, the two parts of the duke are reassembled, and the author closes with the sentence, "You think now that everything was fine? No, it was just the world we are used to".

Sometimes it seems to me that you feel as if the "real church" you mean should be as the good half of this duke; maybe that is your feeling that tells you that having enemies is a good sign.
We may ideally see in Jesus the all-good. But he was different; his teachings, His Word (you find most in Mt 5-7, but also elsewhere) answered differently to the problem of good and evil:

His "rulings" for the Kingdom of God are ideally good. They are the goal, our excercise for preparation of the soul for Jannah (Heavenly Paradise). But at the same time, he prays not to judge, and to forgive. One reason may be not to trap in the trap of the good half of the duke.
However, the major reason is that we are ourselves not perfect. "Forgive us, as we forgive" is the liberation from the need to be perfect, but equally the liberation from hatred and vengence. We are in this world, and we are not perfect. When Jesus said to his disciples, "you are not of this world", he did not mean that they were already in the state of Jannah, but rather, that they had decided to give absolute priority to the Word of God over the temptations of the world we are living in. This is the epiphany I had when I began to read the Gospels (long time ago), and still what I consider the essence of the Good Message.

It also leads us back to a part of your original question:

We shall act in love to each other. This entails everything: To try to do good where you are, to anyone in your reach; to insist in goodness without hardness, and not to let hatred capture us, but feel the freedom to forgive, to try to keep the high commandment in deed, not giving up upon our own fails.
God does not need to be loved. It is us who need to love God and follow His Word.
 
exactly, legalistic, just what God hated the Jews for.
Does God hate?
Jesus said, you shall keep the small things, but not forget the important things thereover.
Yes, Orthodox Jews as well as Orthodox Muslim observe a lot of rulings for fear that they may be the Will of God.
But also some Christians forget the important over the less important.
What is the important in you opinion?
 
I would never "deny" that God could do anything that He wants. It's just there is no other need for a prophet after Jesus. Jesus died on the Cross to redeem mankind from their sins. Nothing else is needed, especially another "book".

Jesus died on the Cross to redeem mankind from their sins.
That's your catholic dogmatic version.
My interpretation is: Jesus suffered to death on the cross because he took his task to convey the Message without compromise.
There is no salvation coming from the cross; it was an instrument of torture and murder. Neither would God have needed or demanded the human sacrifice of a His prophet. I wonder how you bring this together with your trinitarian dogma, saying that Jesus is God; why should "God" need to suffer for you to be redeemed?
It's just there is no other need for a prophet after Jesus.
You know better than God!
By the way, don't you take Paul as a prophet? Many items of your belief seem to me based rather on Paul than on Jesus.
(By the way, I receive Paul as a great scholar, but not as infaillable)
 
Who told you this?
The Baha'i Writings contain a significant amount of information on the Soul and its progress towards God.

The Bible has introduced the subject.

1 Corinthians 15:44

"They are buried as natural human bodies, but they will be raised as spiritual bodies. For just as there are natural bodies, there are also spiritual bodies."

Regards Tony
 
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You lost your wisdom long ago when you surrendered your own God given gift of thought and reason to Baha'u'llah imo
I see the start of all wisdom is submission to the Holy Spirit. To be born again from self to spirit.

"Know ye that true wisdom is to fear God, to know Him, and to recognize His Manifestations. This wisdom, however, can be attained only by those who detach themselves from the world, and who walk in the ways of the good pleasure of their Lord." - Bahá’u’lláh, The Summons of the Lord of Hosts, p. 234-235

Regards Tony
 
The Baha'i Writings contain a significant amount of information on the Soul and its progress towards God.

The Bible has introduced the subject.

1 Corinthians 15:44

"They are buried as natural human bodies, but they will be raised as spiritual bodies. For just as there are natural bodies, there are also spiritual bodies."

Regards Tony
1 Corinthians 6:19–20 (ESV)
19 Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit within you, whom you have from God? You are not your own, 20 for you were bought with a price. So glorify God in your body

You should try reading the whole thing lol
 
1 Corinthians 6:19–20 (ESV)
19 Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit within you, whom you have from God? You are not your own, 20 for you were bought with a price. So glorify God in your body

You should try reading the whole thing lol
Or we can discuss further understandings of what that passage may be saying, based on further information given in the Baha'iWritings.

I see the condition noted in this passage is that of surrender to Christ.

A Temple is not a permanent structure.

Regards Tony
 
Or we can discuss further understandings of what that passage may be saying, based on further information given in the Baha'iWritings.

I see the condition noted in this passage is that of surrender to Christ.

A Temple is not a permanent structure.

Regards Tony
I don't believe the bible needs further interpretation from uninspired writers. I'm simply quoting scripture that says the Holy Spirit dwells in the body of the believer that the body is the temple of God.

I understand that you believe your book teaches a different message. Mine says there is only one way and there is only one Word. Jesus said He was God and anything that teaches contrary is a false gospel.
 
The Baha'i Writings contain a significant amount of information on the Soul and its progress towards God.

The Bible has introduced the subject.

1 Corinthians 15:44

"They are buried as natural human bodies, but they will be raised as spiritual bodies. For just as there are natural bodies, there are also spiritual bodies."

Regards Tony
Jesus, according to John (Jn 3:3-8), introduced the topic, saying,

3Jesus replied, “Very truly I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God unless they are born again. a

4“How can someone be born when they are old?” Nicodemus asked. “Surely they cannot enter a second time into their mother’s womb to be born!”

5Jesus answered, “Very truly I tell you, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless they are born of water and the Spirit. 6Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit b gives birth to spirit. 7You should not be surprised at my saying, ‘You c must be born again.’ 8The wind blows wherever it pleases. You hear its sound, but you cannot tell where it comes from or where it is going. So it is with everyone born of the Spirit.” (NIV)
 
You lost your wisdom long ago when you surrendered your own God given gift of thought and reason to Baha'u'llah imo
Be careful, you are starting to sound like me and you know they are ready to kick me out of here. I do agree with you.

(Post edited by moderator to remove personal ad hominem)
 
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I see the condition noted in this passage is that of surrender to Christ.
You can only see what your lititle god has told you. It’s a simple passage that is backed up by Scripture. A Christians body is the dwelling place of the Holy Spirit given to Christians by God when we accept Jesus as our Lord and Savior. No “mystical“ meaning here, just fact.

Romans 8:9–11 (NASB95): However, you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him.
10 If Christ is in you, though the body is dead because of sin, yet the spirit is alive because of righteousness.
11 But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you.
 
Be careful, you are starting to sound like me and you know they are ready to kick me out of here. I do agree with you.
I don't understand how anyone can voluntarily surrender their God given right to think for themselves in submission to what another says they must think... but I guess it takes all kinds ... however it is not a personal attack?
 
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I don't understand how anyone can voluntarily surrender their God given right to think for themselves in submission to what another says they must think... but I guess it takes all kinds ... however it is not a personal attack?
Like you have submitted to the Name Jesus?

Regards Tony
 
Like you have submitted to the Name Jesus?

Regards Tony
I need time to compose a mature response to this. I try to submit to God:

Trust in the Lord with all your heart,
And lean not on your own understanding;
In all your ways acknowledge Him,
And He shall direct your paths.
Do not be wise in your own eyes;
Fear the Lord and depart from evil.
Proverbs 3


I try to 'test the spirits'. I do not go after messengers and teachers who require me to give up my own thought and reason and blindly accept and act on what they tell me.

I do not deny anybody's right to follow their own drummer, but when they come in swinging against Catholicism and the trinity and eucharist etc, cherry-picking and manipulating the New Testament to suit their drift -- that's when my bullsh*t radar kicks in -- whoever they are: Maga Christians, Baha'i, Muslims, Amadiyya ... you name it
 
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I try to 'test the spirits'. I do not go after messengers and teachers who require me to give up my own thought and reason and blindly accept and act on what they tell me.
I would offer that is exactly what we are asked to do and except no Messengers blindly.

Our quandary is the standard we choose with our search. All the Messengers says we first have to be like a child, empty of preconceived ideas if we are to find the Truth in what they offer. Jesus likewise gave this counsel. We must be empty so we can be filled.

Regards Tony
 
I would offer that is exactly what we are asked to do and except no Messengers blindly.

Our quandary is the standard we choose with our search. All the Messengers says we first have to be like a child, empty of preconceived ideas if we are to find the Truth in what they offer. Jesus likewise gave this counsel. We must be empty so we can be filled.

Regards Tony
And so, given the choice, I prefer to listen to Jesus as the Christ, rather than any self-proclaimed new Messiah who likes to take the New Testament and cherry-pick the bits that suit ...

@Tony Bristow-Stagg the problem is not your right to believe what you do, but your mission against other religions, particularly Trinitarian Christianity, rooted in the Quran, which others do not accept, imo
I would offer that we need to let go of the word Trinity, as that doctrine has become a cause of great division amongst humanity ...
https://www.interfaith.org/community/threads/20640/#post-374813
Etc...
 
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