Love

[Tony Bristow-Stagg]

Depends on what you want to call "Scripture". You seem to believe that anyone can write it. Scripture is what is inspired by God, not men.

You are imputing a lot of things I need not reply to. Just to let you know.

Regards Tony

 

[Tony Bristow-Stagg]

the, each letter, let's see. There is the "t" which means tree. Then there is the "h" which means house. Then there is the "e" which means earth. How did I do? And then we come to "words". Lets see, those letters create the word "the". Wait is that a noun, verb, adverb, pronoun..... I am certainly confused now by the word "the".

I have read a little bit about Hidden meanings in scripture, it is not a new concept, the Jews could explain a lot on this topic. It is not a new concept.

"We speak one word, and by it we intend one and seventy meanings; each one of these meanings we can explain." Bahá’u’lláh, The Ki tab-i-Ian, p. 255

"Not only do the words uttered by the Manifestations have inner meanings but even a single letter contains divine mysteries and significances." Adib Taherzadeh, The Revelation of Bahá’u’lláh v 1, p. 34

A fee more for those interested in such a topic.

Seventy and One Meanings | Bahá’í Quotes

bahaiquotes.com

Maybe instead of having a go at me, you could look up this subject and be amazed. Just an offer, otherwise, keep dishing it out, I take the attention as a badge of honour.

Regards Tony

 

[RJM]

I also like to consider that "In My Father's there are many mansions" is a reference to the many Messengers.

Regards Tony

Ok @Tony Bristow-Stagg, let's play. Here is the passage NKJV, with the rest of the chapter available from the link:

Let not your heart be troubled; you believe in God, believe also in Me. In My Father’s house are many mansions; if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself; that where I am, there you may be also. And where I go you know, and the way you know.”

Thomas said to Him, “Lord, we do not know where You are going, and how can we know the way?”

Jesus said to him, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.
John 14:1-6

How do you get out of it a prediction of the coming of Muhammad (pbuh) and Baha'u'llah?

I would ask you please to try use your own words, and not respond by posting a Baha'i tract?

 

[muhammad_isa]

Thomas said to Him, “Lord, we do not know where You are going, and how can we know the way?”

Jesus said to him, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.
John 14:1-6

How do you get out of it a prediction of the coming of Muhammad (pbuh) and Baha'u'llah?

I would ask you please to try use your own words, and not respond by posting a Baha'i tract?

I assume when you read the above verses, you interpret it as Jesus making a categorical statement that
is meant to convey an eternal truth.

I DO NOT .. I see it in a context of who he was speaking to, and as meaning that those in his time
who were denying his authority would not enter the kingdom heaven.
Do ya ken?

 

[RJM]

I assume when you read the above verses, you interpret it as Jesus making a categorical statement that
is meant to convey an eternal truth.
I DO NOT .. I see it in a context of who he was speaking to, and as meaning that those in his time
who were denying his authority would not enter the kingdom heaven.
Do ya ken?

Ok. But what about the 'many mansions' part in red?

 

[Tony Bristow-Stagg]

How do you get out of it a prediction of the coming of Muhammad (pbuh) and Baha'u'llah?

I would ask you please to try use your own words, and not respond by posting a Baha'i tract?

I really have no cemented thoughts on this at all. My thoughts are tied to the fact that the Baha'i Writings mention the "loftiest mansions" that await a true believer in the next world.

Since Jesus and Muhammad also talks about these Mansions, it only confirms to me that there is something significant about them.

Without quoting these passages, there is not much else I can offer at this time.

It would be a good topic to explore. There is so much to learn!

Regards Tony

 

[RJM]

would be a good topic to explore. There is so much to learn!

Ok. But how would you interpret the words of Jesus in the 'many mansions' passage? I've given you mine:

I see love in the true spiritual sense is the knowledge that all is one and returns to the One. Love is the glue that holds all the worlds and dimensions together, that weaves and surrounds and permeates our own dimension of nature, limited by walls of time and space, like a room within the greater house of Spirit -- whose walls are walls of love. My Father's house has many mansions. Perhaps infinite other rooms (dimensions).

What affects one, affects all.

And beyond that? Perhaps no human mind can even begin to conceive?

This was your response and I'm interested as a point of discussion in how you draw that meaning from the words of Jesus here?

I also like to consider that "In My Father's there are many mansions" is a reference to the many Messengers.

 

[RJM]

The fact that others since Jesus also refer to mansions (in the beyond) does not seem to justify concluding that Jesus's words in the context predict Muhammad (pbuh) or Baha'u'llah?

EDIT: Not to put too fine a point on it: Jesus's words are widely used by very many people ...

 

[Thinking required]

You are imputing a lot of things I need not reply to. Just to let you know.

Truth hurts.

 

[Thinking required]

We speak one word, and by it we intend one and seventy meanings; each one of these meanings we can explain

If this is what you want to believe, then communication ends and opinions begin. This is one very messed up message.

 

[Thinking required]

Maybe instead of having a go at me, you could look up this subject and be amazed

You seem to think that I haven’t research and read stuff. Why would I be amazed at what is a lie. I am amazed by one thing and that one thing is God. You are amazed by men. There are no hidden messages in the Bible.

 

[Thinking required]

Maybe instead of having a go at me, you could look up this subject and be amazed

Let’s try to be real for a moment. You neglect sources which contradict your Baha writing and don’t have a problem doing so even though you have read those writing, meaning the Bible. this is what every cult and cult member has done since Jesus. Miracles, where are all the miracles from anyone except Jesus. Where? Miracles have always been where God is and when God wants to make a statement. The statement was made by Jesus, there are no other “messengers” after Jesus, just men wanting to have followers, taking from the texts of the Bible and passing them along as something new. There is a list of them, why stop at the Baha writings, why not go all the way to Joseph Smith. At least he just used the Bible and changed some passages.

 

[talib-al-kalim]

Love is the cause of the creation of the phenomenal world.
Love then logically has unestimatable potential and facets.

"The essence of love is for man to turn his heart to the Beloved One, and sever himself from all else but Him, and desire naught save that which is the desire of his Lord." Bahá’u’lláh, Tablets of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 155

Regards Tony

What does this mean in relation to humans, animals or plants?

 

[Thinking required]

Since Jesus and Muhammad also talks about these Mansions, it only confirms to me that there is something significant about them.

Well Jesus comes first and I would think to “validate” both of them being messengers, they would want the sayings of Jesus to support them. Muhammad 600+ years after Jesus and Baha, 1900 years after, Joseph Smith 1830 years later (Mormons). Charles Taze Russel 1850 years later (JW). All their ”messages” hinge on Jesus. Nothing new, so why not just use the Bible?

 

[talib-al-kalim]

It's most probably not, though ... especially if you read it in the context of the Last Supper Discourse ... then it certainly doesn't.

Why?

 

[RJM]

Ok @Tony Bristow-Stagg
Let's accept this statement as your concession to @Thomas on the point that the 'many mansions' passage in context, cannot be interpreted as Jesus predicting the coming of Muhammad (pbuh) or Baha'u'llah

In saying that and reading John 14:1-6, in relation to one passage I found from Abdul'baha, I would say you are most likely correct.

I apologize for missing your reply.

Do you have other New Testament passages you believe do predict the coming of those two messengers after Jesus? Always requesting that for the sake of discussion you try to express your own personal views?

Why?

How would you interpret the 'many mansions' passage as Jesus foretelling the coming of Muhammad?

 

[talib-al-kalim]

Well Jesus comes first and I would think to “validate” both of them being messengers, they would want the sayings of Jesus to support them. Muhammad 600+ years after Jesus and Baha, 1900 years after, Joseph Smith 1830 years later (Mormons). Charles Taze Russel 1850 years later (JW). All their ”messages” hinge on Jesus. Nothing new, so why not just use the Bible?

Maybe you don't refuse to read Augustine, Theresa of Avila, Martin Luther or Karl Barth.
I have differentiate (ambiguous, rather negative for Smith) opinions on the three persons you cited; they have in common that they only founded new sects. But there are new challenges in this time, and there have been new challenges in former times. It is false to refuse to read the Bible, but it is evenly false to reject everything else.

 

[wil]

Divine.
Do you dictate what and how your kids think?

Hell no! I tried to raise them TO THINK!

I had Gibran's "On Children" above my toilet...so anytime I stood there to pee it was a reminder.

 

[wil]

Truth hurts.

"YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH."

I finally figured out who you remind me of...not the actor, but the character he portrayed.

The way you come out swinging with such bravado all the time.

I think it could be a good trait...if used right.

 

[Ahanu]