lunamoth
Episcopalian
Nice post Ruby.RubySera_Martin said:
lunamoth
what God really wants?
- Thread starter dayaa
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lunamoth
flowperson
Oannes
Wisdom and truth are wondrous things to behold, Ruby. Not that I/we have any monopoly on wisdom or truth, but your post contained a lot of both IMO. Thank you !
flow....
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RubySera_Martin said:
As it has with others, your ideas in this post struck a chord with me. Yet it also seems to have added to my confusion. What you have written makes sense, but then I remember Moses. One whom God used in a way that he was not comfortable with. I remember that there are other stories like this where people have to do, not what they want, but that which God wants instead.
I really hope you, or somebody, can reply to this.
RubySera_Martin
Well-Known Member
c
I don't know if my answer is good but I have an opinion based on my personal experience. As I have shared elsewhere on this site, I lived most of my life in a horse and buggy Mennonite community. That community had clear ideas on what work was appropriate for a Christian woman like myself. However, I found no peace in any of the things they said should and would bring peace. Instead, my health broke and emotionally and spiritually I was not healthy. In short, I was a very unhappy person on the level that everyone around me could see it. After a good twenty years I had exhausted all the advice of the community and our religion and, as stated, I was broken in body and spirit. Something had to change.
The only viable change was so enormous and impossible as not to be viable in reality. But I was desperate and took the plunge. I committed myself to do whatever needed to be done to bring me inner peace and happiness. In doing this, I was throwing away or sacrificing all family and friend relationships. This does not include the few outsider friends I had; I went on the strength of those relationships and my desperate need. You mention discomfort. This was discomfort in the extreme. I call it the crucifixion, and I came out a better and different person.
We might say I'm just imagining things when I say I came out a better person. But this is not the case. In a matter of months after my change, I noticed that I was getting positive feedback from practically all the people in my life. Granted, this did not include my family and former friends, but all the new acquaintances/friends. This pattern has been consistent over the course of about seven years. Thus I conclude that only when we take care of our own needs first and foremost can we be of service and value to others.
There was a very assuring experience. Immediately after making the decision to leave the church, and putting plans in place for its fulfillment, I experienced what in Christian terms can only be understood as the New Birth. Yet it happened exactly at the point where I turned my back on God and the church and all I was taught to hold sacred. This caused major confusion for me. I lived in a maze of confusion for years to come. But of one thing I was sure--this peace and joy and liberty that was given to me in that moment was worth all the sacrifice and pain and confusion and there was nothing in heaven or on earth that could make me choose to revoke my decision. It has reversed my entire theology and philosophy of life. In these past few months I've gotten the feeling that I'm beginning to find some solid footing spiritually and emotionally, and that I am beginning to settle down in my new station in life.
Thus, meeting one's own needs, or self-care, is probably not as easy as is often depicted in some Christian circles. The way I make sense of it is like Jesus said. He said to follow him we must give up ourselves, crucify the lusts and desires of the flesh. Like I said, sacrificing all one's primary relationships is the crucifixion. Jesus promised that his yoke is easy and his burden light. That is exactly what I found. The yoke and burden did not disappear; there was still a yoke and there was still a burden, but they were bearable. He talked much about the kingdom of heaven. He said "The kingdom of heaven is within you." I realized that what I was given was the kingdom of heaven. It is the inner peace and joy and love the NT promises to the faithful. John talks about Christians being the children of light. That fits, too. It seems that the entire NT was written with this inner kingdom of heaven in mind. The church failed to get this and made rules to force this kingdom of heaven into being while all the time it is within us.
So I am like the man who found a field containing a pearl of great price, and sold everything he had in order to possess that field. I am also like the Israelites on their way to Canaan. Only the flooded river stood between them and the Promised Land. The priests had to place their trust in God and step into the water. Then the waters receded and the people crossed on dry land. I don't know where God is leading me; I only know that I must go forward. And it all started with the commitment to myself to find happiness at all costs.
cavalier said:
I don't know if my answer is good but I have an opinion based on my personal experience. As I have shared elsewhere on this site, I lived most of my life in a horse and buggy Mennonite community. That community had clear ideas on what work was appropriate for a Christian woman like myself. However, I found no peace in any of the things they said should and would bring peace. Instead, my health broke and emotionally and spiritually I was not healthy. In short, I was a very unhappy person on the level that everyone around me could see it. After a good twenty years I had exhausted all the advice of the community and our religion and, as stated, I was broken in body and spirit. Something had to change.
The only viable change was so enormous and impossible as not to be viable in reality. But I was desperate and took the plunge. I committed myself to do whatever needed to be done to bring me inner peace and happiness. In doing this, I was throwing away or sacrificing all family and friend relationships. This does not include the few outsider friends I had; I went on the strength of those relationships and my desperate need. You mention discomfort. This was discomfort in the extreme. I call it the crucifixion, and I came out a better and different person.
We might say I'm just imagining things when I say I came out a better person. But this is not the case. In a matter of months after my change, I noticed that I was getting positive feedback from practically all the people in my life. Granted, this did not include my family and former friends, but all the new acquaintances/friends. This pattern has been consistent over the course of about seven years. Thus I conclude that only when we take care of our own needs first and foremost can we be of service and value to others.
There was a very assuring experience. Immediately after making the decision to leave the church, and putting plans in place for its fulfillment, I experienced what in Christian terms can only be understood as the New Birth. Yet it happened exactly at the point where I turned my back on God and the church and all I was taught to hold sacred. This caused major confusion for me. I lived in a maze of confusion for years to come. But of one thing I was sure--this peace and joy and liberty that was given to me in that moment was worth all the sacrifice and pain and confusion and there was nothing in heaven or on earth that could make me choose to revoke my decision. It has reversed my entire theology and philosophy of life. In these past few months I've gotten the feeling that I'm beginning to find some solid footing spiritually and emotionally, and that I am beginning to settle down in my new station in life.
Thus, meeting one's own needs, or self-care, is probably not as easy as is often depicted in some Christian circles. The way I make sense of it is like Jesus said. He said to follow him we must give up ourselves, crucify the lusts and desires of the flesh. Like I said, sacrificing all one's primary relationships is the crucifixion. Jesus promised that his yoke is easy and his burden light. That is exactly what I found. The yoke and burden did not disappear; there was still a yoke and there was still a burden, but they were bearable. He talked much about the kingdom of heaven. He said "The kingdom of heaven is within you." I realized that what I was given was the kingdom of heaven. It is the inner peace and joy and love the NT promises to the faithful. John talks about Christians being the children of light. That fits, too. It seems that the entire NT was written with this inner kingdom of heaven in mind. The church failed to get this and made rules to force this kingdom of heaven into being while all the time it is within us.
So I am like the man who found a field containing a pearl of great price, and sold everything he had in order to possess that field. I am also like the Israelites on their way to Canaan. Only the flooded river stood between them and the Promised Land. The priests had to place their trust in God and step into the water. Then the waters receded and the people crossed on dry land. I don't know where God is leading me; I only know that I must go forward. And it all started with the commitment to myself to find happiness at all costs.
RubySera_Martin
Well-Known Member
cavalier said:
You're welcome. You'll have to find God's will for your own life. We are not all made the same and we don't all have the same calling and life experiences. What is experienced as the crucifixion for one person may be like a bump in the road for another. All the best.
Every one has a religion this his or her own. For me God is something you believe in something you can always count on to guide you out of trouble, not any particular spirit, person (jesus for example) or diety. To me God is all things that are not material. The feelings within for example my dad always told me "To live, indeed, is not in our power, but to live rightly is"
M
mee
Guest
true worship has been restored and a great crowd from all nations are being gathered together rev 7;9-10
and its how they respond to the goodnews of the kingdom
matthew 24;14
its all happening especially in these the last days Daniel 12;4
and a great crowd from all nations are being gathered together rev 7;9-10 and its how they respond to the goodnews of the kingdom
matthew 24;14
its all happening especially in these the last days Daniel 12;4
You have no clue what "worship" is. So how can you proselytise such?true worship has been restored
and its how they respond to the goodnews of the kingdom
matthew 24;14
its all happening especially in these the last days Daniel 12;4
Salesman, selling the lottery for seats in heaven, except no one goes to heaven but you and 143,999 others. Willy Wonka and the chocolate factory.
Disgusting.
Dondi
Well-Known Member
M
mee
Guest
mee is hoping to be one of the great crowd that will get through the GREAT TRIBULATION REV 7;9-10 REV 7;14 AND THEN GO ON TO LIVE IN A PARADISE EARTH , MATTHEW 5;5 PSALM 37;11 PSALM 37;29
mee has no hope of living in heaven ,i will leave the little flock of 144,000 to go to heaven .
"Have no fear, little flock, because your Father has approved of giving you the kingdom."—LUKE 12:32.
i am one of the OTHER SHEEP JOHN 10;16 my hope is to live in a paradise earth.
and it feels a real good place to be
M
mee
Guest
what God really wants?
is Unity of Worship .
and guess what, he is acheiving that .
AROUND the globe there is a thrilling movement toward unity of worship.
It is bringing together millions of people of all nations, tribes, and languages. More are being gathered each year.
These are identified in the Bible as "witnesses" of Jehovah and are called "a great crowd." They render God "sacred service day and night." (Isaiah 43:10-12; Revelation 7:9-15)
yes we are living in thrillling times indeed,
Jehovah CAUSES TO BECOME
YES ITS ALL HAPPEWNING IN THESE THE LAST DAYS
"It must occur in the final part of the days [these last days] that the mountain of the house of Jehovah [his elevated true worship] will become firmly established above the top of the mountains [above any other type of worship], . . . and to it peoples must stream. And many nations will certainly go and say: ‘Come, you people, and let us go up to the mountain of Jehovah and to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will instruct us about his ways, and we will walk in his paths.’"—Micah 4:1, 2; Psalm 37:34.
AND ITS VERY GOOD
is Unity of Worship .
and guess what, he is acheiving that .
AROUND the globe there is a thrilling movement toward unity of worship.
It is bringing together millions of people of all nations, tribes, and languages. More are being gathered each year.
These are identified in the Bible as "witnesses" of Jehovah and are called "a great crowd." They render God "sacred service day and night." (Isaiah 43:10-12; Revelation 7:9-15)
yes we are living in thrillling times indeed,
Jehovah CAUSES TO BECOME
YES ITS ALL HAPPEWNING IN THESE THE LAST DAYS"It must occur in the final part of the days [these last days] that the mountain of the house of Jehovah [his elevated true worship] will become firmly established above the top of the mountains [above any other type of worship], . . . and to it peoples must stream. And many nations will certainly go and say: ‘Come, you people, and let us go up to the mountain of Jehovah and to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will instruct us about his ways, and we will walk in his paths.’"—Micah 4:1, 2; Psalm 37:34.
AND ITS VERY GOOD
Dharmaatmaa
Well-Known Member
It is bringing together millions of people of all nations, tribes, and languages. More are being gathered each year.
Christians as I know are the most hating other viewpoints than any other religion or philosophy! You lie when say another. And I being a theosophist and Buddhist want to say - Love to God is much elder than Christianity itself!
And if people weren't aware of Christ because they had a misfortune to be borne in Islamic or Buddhist country - should they go to hell, then? No. God is much more kind and clever than Christians.
Why Christendom, when so beautiful religions exist nearby?! We must study them all to be able to choose every good from each one.
Christians as I know are the most hating other viewpoints than any other religion or philosophy! You lie when say another. And I being a theosophist and Buddhist want to say - Love to God is much elder than Christianity itself!
And if people weren't aware of Christ because they had a misfortune to be borne in Islamic or Buddhist country - should they go to hell, then? No. God is much more kind and clever than Christians.
Why Christendom, when so beautiful religions exist nearby?! We must study them all to be able to choose every good from each one.
N
Nick_A
Guest
While all the "sheep" obeyed the shephard, there was one who was wayward. And the shephard went in search of that one.what God really wants?
is Unity of Worship .
and guess what, he is acheiving that .
AROUND the globe there is a thrilling movement toward unity of worship.
It is bringing together millions of people of all nations, tribes, and languages. More are being gathered each year.
These are identified in the Bible as "witnesses" of Jehovah and are called "a great crowd." They render God "sacred service day and night." (Isaiah 43:10-12; Revelation 7:9-15)
yes we are living in thrillling times indeed,
Jehovah CAUSES TO BECOME
"It must occur in the final part of the days [these last days] that the mountain of the house of Jehovah [his elevated true worship] will become firmly established above the top of the mountains [above any other type of worship], . . . and to it peoples must stream. And many nations will certainly go and say: ‘Come, you people, and let us go up to the mountain of Jehovah and to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will instruct us about his ways, and we will walk in his paths.’"—Micah 4:1, 2; Psalm 37:34.
AND ITS VERY GOOD
God wants the individual to come into personal relationship with him. There is no "unity" of worship. That's called a "Fan club". Read that as "Fanatics" where everyone thinks the same thing.
We are different from each other, and if we each have a personal relationship with God, then God delights in those differences with us. Why? Because he made us that way, each unique. And he wants to be there with us as we discover our uniqueness.
He likes to see each tree up close, never mind the forest...
T
Tao_Equus
Guest
Nice sentiment. The universe is indeed benevolent to us. Otherwise we would simply never have existed. But no two things in this universe are identical so it would seem if this does have a creator then it would appear to value uniqueness. Flocks of sheep bleating out human dogmas as truths should be funny, crazy behaviour but its too widespread in its negatives to laugh. Valuing and researching the wide implications of uniqueness however is a human achievement as important as any. And one we should always exercise.
N
Nick_A
Guest
Once you get rid of the Mormons everything will become just lovely and the birds will sing once again.
Now that is a rational statement.
If it weren't for a medic who happened to be Mormon, I'd be deaf and crippled, if not dead. So you can understand why I don't share your sentiments. (oh, it's called the bends, happens to divers). And he shared Christ and his faith with me, while I healed.
I think that's what God really wants. Diversity but with a common thread between us.