Calling all veggies

[AndreG]

namaste,

to me, remembering the things in my life that i have helped in their passing away makes me humble, not to mention, it also reminds me of the impermanence of all things. not to mention, since all beings inter-are, then why not remember those in which you have helped pass on? maybe thats just me, but its a real humbling experience.

now, i dont always blow on my feet or tires and recite a mantra, but i do try to take time while meditating to think of all the beings that i harm or kill within my day due to my lack of complete mindfulness.

be well in peace

Thank you for sharing that. Well said.

Being aware, praying or meditating on those deaths might also make you tread more lightly day to day, more mindful of repercutions.

 

[Qi1]

Here's a thought. Suppose the cow is a Bodhisattva who would sacrifice it's own life for the benefit of other sentient beings. Who then am I to deny this sentient being the opportunity of generating good karma by sustaining me? Bearing in mind that this cow has been my mother and father who nutured and cared for me in previous lives. What a selfish act on my part! Akin to rejecting your parents support through school. Nope, instead you reckon you’re gonna save them the financial suffering and give school a miss.

A vegetarian lifestyle is the best one, but for those brought up eating meat it is difficult to give up. As we evolve we will surely move toward vegetarianism. As we learn more about protein and amino acids we will create foods that taste similar to meat products without containing meat. Tofu anyone ?

 

[AndreG]

A vegetarian lifestyle is the best one, but for those brought up eating meat it is difficult to give up. As we evolve we will surely move toward vegetarianism. As we learn more about protein and amino acids we will create foods that taste similar to meat products without containing meat. Tofu anyone ?

Who needs Tofu when you have Kale!

 

[friendofbill]

I find myself progressively trending to a vegetarian lifestyle, though I do not consider it a matter of spiritual importance -- only one of physical concern. I suppose I am drawn to it because I am studying Buddhist teaching, and find that eating meat, paticularly red meat, makes either meditation or contemplation more difficult.

but tofu I cannot take. It's worse than poi. I call it "zombie flesh."

 

[dauer]

I liek tofu!

 

[wil]

....I do not consider it a matter of spiritual importance....I .....find that eating meat, paticularly red meat, makes either meditation or contemplation more difficult.

I'm having an issue combining the beginning and the ending of your post...meditation and contemplation is not a spirtitual practice?

 

[citizenzen]

...I am studying Buddhist teaching, and find that eating meat, paticularly red meat, makes either meditation or contemplation more difficult.

As a vegetarian of 20+ years I'm not trying to talk you into eating meat. But I think that consuming it has little to do with making your meditation or contemplation more difficult.

That would be more a matter of what's between your ears and in your heart than what's in your stomach.

 

[AndreG]

As a vegetarian of 20+ years I'm not trying to talk you into eating meat. But I think that consuming it has little to do with making your meditation or contemplation more difficult.

That would be more a matter of what's between your ears and in your heart than what's in your stomach.

I disagree

If you are at ease in your body it is easier to be discplined in your practice and sit for long periods of time.

 

[iBrian]

I remember thinking a long time ago that the best spiritual diet would consist of nothing more than eating fruit.

That way you kill nothing - not even plants - and the seeds can be replanted and dispersed.

Never got around to trying it out, though maybe will one day.

 

[citizenzen]

If you are at ease in your body it is easier to be discplined in your practice and sit for long periods of time.

Imagine that you were the Buddha, traveling on the road, hungry for not having eaten in days. You stop by a house and ask for something to eat. The woman at the door says all she has is a porridge made from the vegetables and chicken on her farm.

Does the Buddha refuse her food because it contains chicken?

If he eats the food, does the fact that it contains chicken affect his practice?

I imagine that he eats the porridge and is thankful for the woman's generosity. He is thankful for the nutrition gained from the vegetables. He is thankful for the sacrifice that the chicken has made to help sustain him. And I imagine that his practice isn't affected negatively one bit for having eaten that flesh.

Protein is protein, vitamins are vitamins. The body doesn't care whether these come from animal or vegetable. It just needs them to survive. Any dis-ease over the source of these nutrients doesn't come from the body, it comes from our mind.

 

[AndreG]

Imagine that you were the Buddha, traveling on the road, hungry for not having eaten in days. You stop by a house and ask for something to eat. The woman at the door says all she has is a porridge made from the vegetables and chicken on her farm.

Does the Buddha refuse her food because it contains chicken?

If he eats the food, does the fact that it contains chicken affect his practice?

I imagine that he eats the porridge and is thankful for the woman's generosity. He is thankful for the nutrition gained from the vegetables. He is thankful for the sacrifice that the chicken has made to help sustain him. And I imagine that his practice isn't affected negatively one bit for having eaten that flesh.

Protein is protein, vitamins are vitamins. The body doesn't care whether these come from animal or vegetable. It just needs them to survive. Any dis-ease over the source of these nutrients doesn't come from the body, it comes from our mind.

First of all, protein is not protein, vitamins are not vitamins. The body DOES 'care' from what source these come from and it does react differently to 20g of protein from a big thick fatty piece of red meat and 20g of protein from almonds, or from an algae, or from a lettuce. To completely negate the body and say all dis-ease comes from our mind is ... well a bit ridiculous. I agree that intention plays a role in disease and how food and water are assimilated, however you can't just be grateful for lays potato chips, pray over them and all of a sudden it becomes a healthy food to eat. Lays potato chips will always be unhealthy and taxing on your body.

Second of all, we aren't wandering monks, trodding down dusty roads surrounding by pristine land able to eat whatever we come across. Contemporary agriculture practice and food is far from the chicken and veggies you talk about.
We are:
A) blessed to have the choice to eat organic whole foods
B) blessed to have the choice to nourish ourselves without killing animals

And we should take full advantage of those blessings.

If the Buddha walked by a slaughterhouse and peeked into the windows, I am betting he would not accept anything coming from that farm.

 

[citizenzen]

First of all, protein is not protein...

But do you see what you did? You described this meat source as "big", 'thick", "fatty" and "red"... none of these fit the scenario I put forth. You added those words. You want to turn meat into a villain. You might as well have included the words "poisonous" and "evil" because that is what you want to believe.

I believe that eating meat is unnecessary. I believe it is wasteful and hurtful to those animals that we enslave to feed us. But what your are describing is a projection of your mind and not a clear view of what is really there.

Do you think that Inuits who historically got much of their nutrition from animal sources were incapable of achieving enlightenment?

 

[iBrian]

blessed to have the choice

Exactly - it's choice, and it's a personal decision.

You deride the value of meat, yet gram for gram aren't both lean red, white, and fish meat proteins more useful, easily digested, and nutritious, than the equivalent from vegetable sources? Especially if we're talking about organic and local product as opposed to factory farmed animals?

Also, nuts proportionally contain a lot of protein - but also a lot of fats. Someone who got all their protein from nuts alone might find themselves facing other health issues?

As ever, variety and moderation are simple truths when it comes to diet.

The bizarre thing is that this discussion is being continued by vegetarians, who for the most part, regard diet as personal choice.

I just personally find evangelising diet choices to be somewhat sanctimonious, especially as there are so many different facets of any individual's modern life that can easily subjected to criticisms from so many ethical angles - that I think someone who stands on their soapbox about vegeatarian (or vegan) issues really needs to demonstrate white-than-white credentials.

 

[wil]

my understanding is that there are too things about protiens...first we get a lot more in our diet than is required or beneficial for us, second that meat protien isn't nearly as easily digestable as vegetable protiens.

 

[Gatekeeper]

I quit eating meat a couple weeks ago. I'm feeling better, and have more energy now. What I hate are the jokes that I have become the butt end of. Yeah, my friends are giving me a hard time. Pft, I don't criticize them for eating meat, so I'm not sure what they have to be so critical of my decision not to. Boggles my mind, actually.

To each their own I guess, as for me .... I am meat free and will stay this way. I doubt we'll be eating other animals beyond the pearly gates, so why the hell should I eat other animals now? Makes since to me to rely on fruits and veggies, nuts and berries, grain and milk products. There's plenty to eat besides meat, no?

As far as getting an appropriate amount of protein in my diet ....What do you all think about those chocolate protein powders? I drank them years ago when I was trying to build muscle, and liked them very much.

GK

 

[wil]

If you eat a variety of fruits, veggies and grains you will get all you need. No need to supplement with protien....B-12 on the other hand is harder to aquire. If you are still eating dairy you should get a sufficient amount, if you are not you'll need to supplement.

 

[friendofbill]

I disagree

If you are at ease in your body it is easier to be discplined in your practice and sit for long periods of time.

That is the rationale for my statement. So long as we inhabit bodies, we cannot discount the effect of that body on anything we do, including meditation and/or other spiritual practices. And I have found that consuming reasonable amounts of fish or chicken has little effect in that regard (though others report such an effect from any meat whatever), but red meat does introduce a heaviness and arouse discordant vibrations in the body, which in turn interfere with meditation.

Jai Ram
Art

 

[wil]

That is the rationale for my statement. So long as we inhabit bodies, we cannot discount the effect of that body on anything we do, including meditation and/or other spiritual practices. And I have found that consuming reasonable amounts of fish or chicken has little effect in that regard (though others report such an effect from any meat whatever), but red meat does introduce a heaviness and arouse discordant vibrations in the body, which in turn interfere with meditation.

Jai Ram
Art

The key is listening and awareness of your body...

 

[AndreG]

But do you see what you did? You described this meat source as "big", 'thick", "fatty" and "red"... none of these fit the scenario I put forth. You added those words. You want to turn meat into a villain. You might as well have included the words "poisonous" and "evil" because that is what you want to believe.

I believe that eating meat is unnecessary. I believe it is wasteful and hurtful to those animals that we enslave to feed us. But what your are describing is a projection of your mind and not a clear view of what is really there.

Do you think that Inuits who historically got much of their nutrition from animal sources were incapable of achieving enlightenment?

Yes you are right about me projecting, thanks for pointing that out.

However I stand by my point that today's meat is far from Inuit's meat of yesterday and the Buddha's chicken soup. I firmly believe a vegetarian diet is healthy for mind, body, spirit and environment, and that a diet heavy in meat and animal products is not, therefore a vegetarian diet WOULD create an easier space to 'be'

 

[kentauros]

As a vegetarian for the last nine years, I have to say that no amount of meat, however received, would sustain me. That is due to the fact that it would make me violently ill, as it would to any other vegetarian that has been that way for a while. So, any possible sustenance would be wasted.

I would hope, too, within the context of the original question, that the Bodhisattva would know this about vegetarians as well