What is the Christian perspective of Muhammed (pbuh)?

Hi, DB-

In terms of your definition of prophet, I suppose I'd agree Muhammed was a prophet for his people. Many Christians see prophecy as more to do with the foretelling of things to come, in a way. Not divination, but the sharing of a vision from God of what could come to pass. So you see Isaiah, for example, prophesying what is interpreted by Christians to be the coming of the Messiah, our Christ.

As for not knowing about Muhammed, I know a bit about him and Islam. I have taught comparative religion, including Western comparative religions, so I spent about three weeks teaching on Islam. I'm just not understanding what you are looking for. You asked what we thought of him, and I said I thought he was a spiritual leader for his people. I'm not sure what more you're looking for?
 
You cannot say you "show more respect to him then Christian itself" when you do not conserve any of his words. You only show respect to a character in a book, who happens to be named for him, but has little connection to him really.
 
Hi path of one,

thank you, sister, for your time and for replying.....Muhammed has prophecies too.....he was in connection with God, and it was natural for him to foretell coming events.......

you are wondering about what I wanted from my question.....you know? you confused me with your question:confused::eek:......Actually, Iwas expecting you to tell me the main things that you disagree about concerning Muhammed and Islam, as we do when you ask us about our view about Jesus(pbuh) and Christianity.....I need to know how you clearly and frankly see Muhammed(pbuh) and Islam to have a clear idea about your view, but as you said earlier, I may find different views among Christians

Thank you, sister, and m sorry for troubling you.......you are a caring person
sis, DB
 
That's OK- it is no trouble. I was just confused. I already said what I thought of Muhammed. As for Islam, I think it is a beautiful religion that, like all other religions, has unfortunately been misused by people in power (just as Christianity and the others have as well).

I don't really disagree with other religions, in general. I'm too much of a universalist for that. I believe that all people who are sincere in their efforts to connect with God/the Divine will do so and be saved through Christ whether they are Christian or not. That is a very liberal Christian viewpoint but it is not uncommon. There are other Christians who believe differently. We're a pretty diverse group.

There are, indeed, things that I learned from Islam and found great beauty and truth in, and I can go into some detail if you like. I walk a "path of one" and weave the goodness I find in any faith into my own, but at the heart of my spiritual walk is first, God and Christ and second, the Earth and all her beings.
 
Muhammad is one of the people the Bible warned us about:

1 John 2:22-23
"22Who is the liar? It is the man who denies that Jesus is the Christ. Such a man is the antichrist—he denies the Father and the Son. 23No one who denies the Son has the Father; whoever acknowledges the Son has the Father also."

Galatians 1:6-9
"I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting the one who called you by the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel— 7which is really no gospel at all. Evidently some people are throwing you into confusion and are trying to pervert the gospel of Christ. 8But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned! 9As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let him be eternally condemned!"
 
dailogue is the best said:
concerning your last question about what i meant by "if you believe the prophet is sensual"...Actually,through my reading to some Orientalists writings and movies, I unfortunately discovered that they give the prophet Muhammed a picture of a man of lusts and desires.that what i meant. you know? They are attacking blindly and immorally,unfortunately.....
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I think some people like thinking of the Quran, Mohammed and Islam as sex-obsessed. But most Muslim men only have one wife and polygamy is a lot more common in some other modern religions like Mormonism/LDS than Islam. I used to go to web sites that made comparisons between Mohammed and Jesus, some of them had this perception of Mohammed -- that of a sex-obsessed prophet.

But I soon realised that this was just a desire that particular individuals had of wanting to see Mohammed a particular way. They wanted to see Mohammed as a sex-obsessed prophet, so they came up with a description, pulling quotes from the Quran and hadiths, to create a picture of a sex-obsessed prophet.

It was unrealistic to think that Islam was about a sex-obsessed prophet, particularly if Muslims I met in the real world didn't think of him that way. My disappointment with a lot of the Mohammed vs. Jesus comparisons I found on web sites was that they often made Mohammed look decadent. A lot of Islam vs. Christianity comparisons focus on dogmatic aspects of the two religions. But I think there are much deeper issues.

dailogue is the best said:
In reality, I m thinking: What the result shall I come with from this post?Are the Christians ignorant about the prophet Muhammed? Do they care to know about him or not?........................:confused:.just questions, and I m wondering :confused:because honestly I was expecting a lot of discussion and questions based on your readings about Muhammed(pbuh), but I found nothing.....
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I didn't know Mohammed was really that important in Islam, so important that you'd want to know about his personal life. Wasn't he just a messenger? Perhaps I'm wrong in this regard, that learning and knowing about Mohammed might enhance my understanding of Islam?

I have a rather vague picture of what Mohammed did during his time as a prophet. It's been a while since I've read the stories. I have been exposed to it before, but perhaps the reason why I have forgotten most of the stuff I read is because I didn't see much value in remembering the details.:D I could only have remembered if it was important. A Muslim remembers because he thinks about why such details are important to Islam. Since I didn't have that much interest in how Islam worked and what it meant, such details weren't important to me. But that was a while ago.

If there was a reason why I didn't have many questions to ask or if I didn't discuss Mohammed's personal history, it was because of two reasons. One was that I had only a vague idea of Mohammed's personal history. The second was that I didn't think I had anything useful at the time to introduce to the discussion.

On the other hand, what I said about Jesus might put things in context. The question might be, what did Mohammed do that was different to what Jesus did?
 
Hello, Pico..
thank you for giving your view about Muhammed, supported by citation....I ll try to reply.....

You know what? when Muhammed began to call for Islam in the Arabia peninsula, the pagan Arab there, who saw in Muhammed's mission threat to their economical affaires as they were selling idols, startred attaking Muhammed verbally and physically. they called him mad, poet, possessed and soothsayer, BUT they couldnt NEVER EVER called him a liar, despite all their hatred....you know why? because Muhammed lived among them....he spent all his youth among them before he was ordered by God to call people to Islam.....he lived among them, and during this period, he was known by his high morals and standards, they used to call him "the sincere", ...that's why when he began asking people to worship the only and the one God, they couldn't accuse him of lying......even in his jokes, Muhammed used to say nothing, but truth. how come?(look at Islam forum, JOKES thread by Ahanu)


Muhammed is nt anti-Christ,unless you mean against the Trinity....then, you accuse a lot Christians being anti-Christ because there a lot of Christians who are monotheists.

Hey, dear path of one,

thanks for the information....I m very grateful....May God hold you protectively in the palm of His hands throughout all your life (throughout all your path of one :))


Hi, saltmeister

I have a feeling that Christians now no longer fall an easy prey to stereotypes.....this is proofed by you, Saltmeister....May God bless you, brother.......

yes, what Muhammed brought is the same as all prophet brought because they come from one source God. God says:" not an apostle did we send before thee without this inspiration sent by Us to him: that there is no god but I: therefore worship and serve Me(21:25)

My best wishes

sis, DB
 
Muhammad said Christ was never crucified. Historical scholarship has overwhelming evidence otherwise.

Someone isn't telling the truth here...
 
I wouldn't call the evidence "overwhelming"; but in any case, it can only go to show that people thought Jesus was crucified, and said so. The Qur'an says that it certainly seemed to everyone that that is what happened.
 
hi, Pico

yes, it is true that Muhammed said that Jesus wasnt crucified....but you have to know that Muhammed didnt say it by his own, but through the Quran which is God's revelation.....so, Muhammed said nothing of his own.....he is a messanger....he didnt live that period with Jesus.....

eventough we,Muslims, can accept that Jesus was crucified, but did not die on the cross......this issue can be discussed between Muslims and Christians....the issue is very important, and interesting....if you are interested, I can give you some arguments that Jesus didnt die on the cross

cordially,
sis, DB
 
dailogue is the best said:
...yes, it is true that Muhammed said that Jesus wasnt crucified....but you have to know that Muhammed didnt say it by his own, but through the Quran which is God's revelation.....
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Jesus "appearing" to be crucified believed by Muslims is silmilar to the Gnostics beliefs (in new testament apocrypha).

Why does Islam believe that Jesus was not crucified?

Does Islam believe Jesus is the Messiah? If not why do they believe he will return? I remeber speaking to a friend (who is a Muslim) this question sometime ago, but i can't remember what he said...

dialogue is the best said:
I can give you some arguments that Jesus didnt die on the cross
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Please...If you will. It is much obliged...
 
Crucifixion of Jesus

A minority of Muslims believe that Jesus was crucified on the cross, so His body was put to death, but not the religion/spirit of Christ.

Or, some Muslims say Jesus survived the crucifixion and died soon afterwards.

Some Muslims say Jesus survived the crucifixion and bodily ascended into heaven.

Some Muslims say that it was not even Jesus on the cross, but someone else!

So which group should one believe?

Oh, and depending on your translation of the Quran, the meaning of this event will change. For example, Surah 3:55.
 
Hello, everybody,

I told that I will give you some arguments against Jesus's crucification, or in other words Jesus's dying on the cross.

you have to know that the reliable source for that for any Muslim is the Quran( which is, by the way, God's Words, and not Muhammed. Muhammed is just a messanger. If you want to discuss with a Muslim, you have to discuss on this basis): "....but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for a surety they killed him not(4:157)"

Ahmed Deedat, a South African comparative-religion researcher, presnts thirty points extracted from the Christian Scriptures themselves,trying to prove that Jesus's life was not taken on the cross. The title of Deedat's book is "Crucifixion or Crucifiction"

Now, I ll state only four points. Deedat argues that Jesus life wasnt taken on the cross because he was fastened to the cross only three hours, and this time is too short for a crucified man to die in.

another point:" Jews doubted his death: they suspected that he had escaped death on the cross. That he was alive"

another point:Jesus was burried in a very "big roomy chamber: close at hand, and big and airy for willing hands to come to the rescue. Providence was out to keep Jesus alive"

another point: Jesus, after his getting out from the grave,"forbade Mary Magdolene to touch him "Touch me not" for this reason that it would hurt, because he was alive"

another point:"Mary Magdoline was not afraid on recognizing Jesus because she had seen signs of life before(when they were burying him). She was looking for a Jesus who was alive"

These are some of Deedat's arguments. What do you think?

my best wishes,
sis, DB
 
dailogue is the best said:
Hello, everybody,

I told that I will give you some arguments against Jesus's crucification, or in other words Jesus's dying on the cross.

you have to know that the reliable source for that for any Muslim is the Quran( which is, by the way, God's Words, and not Muhammed. Muhammed is just a messanger. If you want to discuss with a Muslim, you have to discuss on this basis): "....but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for a surety they killed him not(4:157)"

Ahmed Deedat, a South African comparative-religion researcher, presnts thirty points extracted from the Christian Scriptures themselves,trying to prove that Jesus's life was not taken on the cross. The title of Deedat's book is "Crucifixion or Crucifiction"

Now, I ll state only four points. Deedat argues that Jesus life wasnt taken on the cross because he was fastened to the cross only three hours, and this time is too short for a crucified man to die in.

another point:" Jews doubted his death: they suspected that he had escaped death on the cross. That he was alive"

another point:Jesus was burried in a very "big roomy chamber: close at hand, and big and airy for willing hands to come to the rescue. Providence was out to keep Jesus alive"

another point: Jesus, after his getting out from the grave,"forbade Mary Magdolene to touch him "Touch me not" for this reason that it would hurt, because he was alive"

another point:"Mary Magdoline was not afraid on recognizing Jesus because she had seen signs of life before(when they were burying him). She was looking for a Jesus who was alive"

These are some of Deedat's arguments. What do you think?

my best wishes,
sis, DB
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Jesus was on the cross for six hours. Prior to that His visage was removed from the scourging He received by the Roman Guards with the Cat 'o Nine tails whip (that means His skin was torn from his muscle to the point that He was not recognizable). He then was forced to carry a 250 lbs beam for several miles as He was continuosly beaten to move faster. In short, Jesus' energy and blood were whipped away from Him. Then He was pierced throu the wrist and ankle bones (where the arteries for the hands and feet lie). The spikes were made of rusty Iron, which introduced Ferrous oxide into Jesus' blood stream (highly toxic in concentrated doses). Compound that with the inability to fully inflate one's diaphrahm to get oxygen to freshen the little bit of blood that is left in the body...I think you'll understand why He died in hours instead of days. As was the custom, the Guards were about to break Jesus' leg bones so that He would die faster, when they discovered He was already dead.

Jews doubted everything. That is an opinion, not a fact.

Roman Guards were posted at the entrance of Jesus' tomb to keep all intruders out, under pain of death. Centurians of the Guard were known to disembowel any soldier that fell asleep on watch, and send the endtrails to the family...They let no one in to the tomb (of earthly nature).

Mary M. was forbidden from touching Jesus because the transfiguration was not yet complete. Jesus being incorruptable, could not have a corrupted human being, taint His transfiguration.

Remember, Jesus took on the sins of man, past, present and future. There was a lot of damage done to Him in the way of taking on man's sin. It was going to take awhile for Him to become pure and perfect in body.

Let's keep on exploring this avenue DB.

v/r

Q
 
Quahom1 said:
As was the custom, the Guards were about to break Jesus' leg bones so that He would die faster, when they discovered He was already dead.
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When you're crucified, you hang there and your lungs are stuck in the inhale (or is it exhale?) position. You need to press up on your feet in order to breathe (tearing the flesh till the ankle/leg bones rest on the spike). Breaking the legs makes it so they can't do that and suffocate.

When someone experiences hypovolemic shock (lack of blood in the body)--as Jesus was from the flogging--and dies, a clear fluid forms a membrane around the lungs, and heart. John records Jesus being stabbed with a spear after he died to make sure he was dead and claimed seeing water and blood come out. He had no idea of fluid forming around the heart and lungs, he just recorded what he saw.

Quahom1 said:
Mary M. was forbidden from touching Jesus because the transfiguration was not yet complete. Jesus being incorruptable, could not have a corrupted human being, taint His transfiguration.
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I don't understand why then Jesus let Thomas put his hand through the holes in his hands and in his side then o_O
 
Saltmeister said:
Sometimes God doesn't have to say anything. Sometimes human minds are adequate in knowing and understanding the work that he wants them to do, without being told. After Jesus was gone, Paul, Peter, James and John continued his mission using his life and sayings to guide them.

There was no "science" or "magic formula" telling them what to do. They relied on their natural intuition to guide them. Jesus' life and sayings were what gave them direction and purpose. But in the meantime, they needed to tell others what to do with themselves. So the New Testament recorded not just what Jesus said and did, but also what the apostles said and did. We needed two examples on how to live: Jesus himself and the lives of his disciples, apostles and early followers. It is like when you use the hadiths to interpret the Quran.

God had already given all of them inspiration to get started. So here I am not really giving Paul, Peter, James and John all of the credit. God created them, he created their minds and hearts, he sent Jesus to them and who in turn, by what he said and did, gave them the inspiration to do what they did. It was really God who conceived it all and set it all in motion. He didn't need to say and do that much after He had sent Jesus. God put them all up to it.

Paul, Peter, James and John were secondary messengers in this regard. Sure it wasn't God speaking, but God had sent them too, indirectly. God had implicitly sent anyone who built over the foundation that had been laid (Jesus). That means that if I build over the foundation, God has implicitly sent me too.



Hey, islamis4u. I didn't say Jesus was God in my post. Nor did I say anything about worshipping him!!! I just talked about how the life and sayings of Jesus and the apostles were important in Christianity. I don't consider this line of argument important at this stage. Please remind me later if it becomes relevant.:)

By the way, what's nouzbillah?
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Your whole belief depends on this thing that Naouzbillah Jesus(pbuh) is God. If we say it was not their then on which pillar the teachings of Paul, Peter, James and John stand on?

Nouzbillah is said when we say anything unpleasant or unpleasantness happens.
 
The traditional Muslim interpretation of Surah 4:157

DB, you said:

yes, brother, we Muslims believe in all the plots that were made against Jesus, and how he suffered for the sake of God as all prophtes did....yet, we dont believe that he died on the cross....first, because God tells us in the Quran that he didnt.....it is the same God,who sent all prophets, Jesus, tells us that Jesus wasnt crucified and the Jews didnt manage in killing him.
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Could we not consider another interpretation of this vague passage?

Surah 4:155-158 (trans. Yusuf Ali)

(They have incurred divine displeasure): In that they broke their covenant; that they rejected the signs of Allah; that they slew the Messengers in defiance of right; that they said, "Our hearts are the wrappings (which preserve Allah's Word; We need no more)";- Nay, Allah hath set the seal on their hearts for their blasphemy, and little is it they believe;-That they rejected Faith; that they uttered against Mary a grave false charge;That they said (in boast), "We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah";- but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not:-Nay, Allah raised him up unto Himself; and Allah is Exalted in Power, Wise. . .
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Surah 2:154-157 (trans. Yusuf Ali)

And say not of those who are slain in the way of Allah: 'They are dead.' Nay, they are living, though ye perceive (it) not. Be sure we shall test you with something of fear and hunger, some loss in goods or lives or the fruits (of your toil), but give gladtidings to those who patiently persevere, Who say, when afflicted with calamity: "To Allah We belong, and to Him is our return":-They are those on whom (Descend) blessings from Allah, and Mercy, and they are the ones that receive guidance.
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In the Koran it is clearly stated that those who believe in Allah will not die. Even if they are killed. Likewise, Jesus was crucified, but it appeared to them (the Jews) that He was slain. So God hardened their hearts in allowing them to think that they succeeded in killing Jesus. DB, do you believe that I am perverting the text of the Koran by interpreting it in this way?
 
wil said:
If you'll indulge me, consider starting a thread in Islam asking what Muslims feel about the Bahai and their prophet, I'll bet you get similar responses to that question there as you get to this question here.
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But if you ask Baha'is how we feel about Muhammad, Jesus, Moses, or Abraham, we'll say, we believe! We love Muhammad, Jesus, Moses, and Abraham!
 
Ahanu it is pointless stating here what it says in the Quaran...As it says in the Bible Jesus was crucified.

What I would like to ask you though (and all Muslims reading this) is why was Jesus crucified in the Islam perspective? Because according to Christians he was crucified for claiming he was the Son of God (mostly).
 
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