something better

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Quahom1 said:
Maybe a little of both...

There are victims, and there are victors...We choose our paths ;)
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I'd be with you and Alex on the issue of action rather than playing the victim, and I'm not much of a soldier. ;)

I also see the world as being in the dry docks and needing repair.

I think God saves me, but He does it through giving me the Spirit and a brain that can conceive of creative action, goal planning, and innovation. Instead of telling God that what He's given me is not enough, and could he please come do more since what He's done so far is just not enough... I embrace what He's given and am thankful and dedicated to using it.

To be honest, I find the other alternative- the sort of "I can't make things better. You do it."- to be (1) a cop out and (2) ungrateful and demanding. I figure God has given us all these wonderful gifts- the earth, Jesus, the Bible, my brain/mind, my body, my life, the Holy Spirit. Who am I to complain it isn't enough and couldn't He just fix it all for me? I mean, at what point do we look around and start getting to work rather than just whining things aren't what we want them to be?

I was raised to step up to the plate and get stuff done, not hang around complaining about stuff.

And all I know is that if/when Jesus comes back in person to clean things up, I want Him to find me working. I don't want Him to come back and find me just lounging around complaining whilst refusing to DO what He said to do- that is, to make peace, to feed and heal and clothe others, to show compassion, to share Him through using my body as a vessel. I don't want Him to find a lukewarm, lazy person.

Maybe all this action orientation vs. passivity is not a soldier thing, but a work ethic thing...
 
path_of_one said:
I don't want Him to find a lukewarm person.

Maybe all this action orientation vs. passivity is not a soldier thing, but a work ethic thing...
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Not sure, cause if jesus came back he would find a very lukewarm person in me, for many reasons...

I save lives when that chance arrises, not because I pray to get into someone or somethings good books... I don't do it for another notch on my belt. Nor to get on the VIP list to club Heaven. (Names not down you ain't comin' in mate!) I just do it cause it is what I feel driven to do. People need help... OUR help, YOUR help... Who are we to deprive another being of it? You can see this as a sinking ship, a land of confusion and hatred... But, there is always hope, and while people believe there is hope there will be, and the more that are motivated and inspired to join hand in hand with people of such a maner that hope can only grow and become reality. (Peace now, is better than a peace promised on an unset date.)

So if jesus comes back... I'll say (which he would know as he can see into people?) I don't do this for you.. I don't do this to get in your good books, I don't do this in fear of going to some magical land of eternal fire lol... I do it for those that need it.

You know? Not sure if I get my point across correctly? Why do something because you are... I can't think of the word to express correctly what I mean... Why pretend? Out of fear of XYZ happening... I am this... Or Out of a promise of freebies and goodies I am this... Neither of those should sway you, you should be I am this because I am this... Not because I am tempted by rewards or scared by punishments.... Would you still give a rats butt about others if there was no reward or no punishment? Think we should ask ourselves this... Sorry I probally am making not much sense or not too clear...
 
It makes sense to me, Alex. And I think Jesus advocates that perspective- that is, the point of doing good is not to avoid hell or attain heaven- it's that we do good because that's what we are supposed to do. That's what we are created to do. Intent matters. I think this is why Jesus said that some would call to Him "Lord, Lord- we did this in Your name!" and He would respond that He never knew them, and that they should depart from Him. I think it matters whether our motivation is truly altruistic. Agape love is not self-serving, though it benefits the soul.
 
Alex P said:
Not sure, cause if jesus came back he would find a very lukewarm person in me, for many reasons...

I save lives when that chance arrises, not because I pray to get into someone or somethings good books... I don't do it for another notch on my belt. Nor to get on the VIP list to club Heaven. (Names not down you ain't comin' in mate!) I just do it cause it is what I feel driven to do. People need help... OUR help, YOUR help... Who are we to deprive another being of it? You can see this as a sinking ship, a land of confusion and hatred... But, there is always hope, and while people believe there is hope there will be, and the more that are motivated and inspired to join hand in hand with people of such a maner that hope can only grow and become reality. (Peace now, is better than a peace promised on an unset date.)

So if jesus comes back... I'll say (which he would know as he can see into people?) I don't do this for you.. I don't do this to get in your good books, I don't do this in fear of going to some magical land of eternal fire lol... I do it for those that need it.

You know? Not sure if I get my point across correctly? Why do something because you are... I can't think of the word to express correctly what I mean... Why pretend? Out of fear of XYZ happening... I am this... Or Out of a promise of freebies and goodies I am this... Neither of those should sway you, you should be I am this because I am this... Not because I am tempted by rewards or scared by punishments.... Would you still give a rats butt about others if there was no reward or no punishment? Think we should ask ourselves this... Sorry I probally am making not much sense or not too clear...
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Perfect sense. It's a hard row to hoe, let alone explain to many. Some are just designed to look out for others, simply because...that is the way they are made. not everyone understands that, but there are a few that do. Some just know their life calling before others do.

I'll tell you a little secret. I was an ANGRY young man, who could not find my place, until I put on a uniform. Then everything fell into place. I had a positive outlet for my rage, and each time I could make a difference in another's life, my rage subsided a bit. Why? Because I could see a change in other's lives. My sense of Justice was served. We can make a difference, I found.

And I learned to touch, gently, the face of another...

You have changed 17th/Alex. And I'm glad to see the other side of you. I'd shake your hand and grip your arm, were we physically closer.

v/r

Q
 
path_of_one said:
It makes sense to me, Alex. And I think Jesus advocates that perspective- that is, the point of doing good is not to avoid hell or attain heaven- it's that we do good because that's what we are supposed to do. That's what we are created to do. Intent matters. I think this is why Jesus said that some would call to Him "Lord, Lord- we did this in Your name!" and He would respond that He never knew them, and that they should depart from Him. I think it matters whether our motivation is truly altruistic. Agape love is not self-serving, though it benefits the soul.
Click to expand...

I was having issues trying to explain it lol... I am glad it came over ok. I Agree with what you're saying. But to a degree it is self serving I think. Not in a selfish way lol (confused.com) Sacraficing whatever out of love and concern for another be it time, be it a risk to your own life, be it your own materialistic items, what ever the sacrafice, it improves you, self. And spreads that love and you become surrounded by it, and you notice that those that you help seem to change their slant on things, and become more ready to sacrafice XYZ for another/others. Selfless enhances self. :P Your character can be seen and your true colours are on show.

Quahom1 said:
Perfect sense. It's a hard row to hoe, let alone explain to many. Some are just designed to look out for others, simply because...that is the way they are made. not everyone understands that, but there are a few that do. Some just know their life calling before others do.

I'll tell you a little secret. I was an ANGRY young man, who could not find my place, until I put on a uniform. Then everything fell into place. I had a positive outlet for my rage, and each time I could make a difference in another's life, my rage subsided a bit. Why? Because I could see a change in other's lives. My sense of Justice was served. We can make a difference, I found.

And I learned to touch, gently, the face of another...

You have changed 17th/Alex. And I'm glad to see the other side of you. I'd shake your hand and grip your arm, were we physically closer.

v/r

Q
Click to expand...

Awesome post Q, thank you for sharing that. You found your purpose huh? Realising -you- can make a difference must of felt amazing. :)

*Gives a digital handshake!* Although shaking is for strangers! *Gives a digital hug!!!* A manly power hug of course!
 
Alex P said:
I was having issues trying to explain it lol... I am glad it came over ok. I Agree with what you're saying. But to a degree it is self serving I think. Not in a selfish way lol (confused.com) Sacraficing whatever out of love and concern for another be it time, be it a risk to your own life, be it your own materialistic items, what ever the sacrafice, it improves you, self. And spreads that love and you become surrounded by it, and you notice that those that you help seem to change their slant on things, and become more ready to sacrafice XYZ for another/others. Selfless enhances self. :P Your character can be seen and your true colours are on show.



Awesome post Q, thank you for sharing that. You found your purpose huh? Realising -you- can make a difference must of felt amazing. :)

*Gives a digital handshake!* Although shaking is for strangers! *Gives a digital hug!!!* A manly power hug of course!
Click to expand...
hugs allowed (but not for too long) lol :o You I think, are just getting started. Man are you going to have a full life...
 
path_of_one said:
I'd be with you and Alex on the issue of action rather than playing the victim, and I'm not much of a soldier. ;)

I also see the world as being in the dry docks and needing repair.

I think God saves me, but He does it through giving me the Spirit and a brain that can conceive of creative action, goal planning, and innovation. Instead of telling God that what He's given me is not enough, and could he please come do more since what He's done so far is just not enough... I embrace what He's given and am thankful and dedicated to using it.

To be honest, I find the other alternative- the sort of "I can't make things better. You do it."- to be (1) a cop out and (2) ungrateful and demanding. I figure God has given us all these wonderful gifts- the earth, Jesus, the Bible, my brain/mind, my body, my life, the Holy Spirit. Who am I to complain it isn't enough and couldn't He just fix it all for me? I mean, at what point do we look around and start getting to work rather than just whining things aren't what we want them to be?

I was raised to step up to the plate and get stuff done, not hang around complaining about stuff.

And all I know is that if/when Jesus comes back in person to clean things up, I want Him to find me working. I don't want Him to come back and find me just lounging around complaining whilst refusing to DO what He said to do- that is, to make peace, to feed and heal and clothe others, to show compassion, to share Him through using my body as a vessel. I don't want Him to find a lukewarm, lazy person.

Maybe all this action orientation vs. passivity is not a soldier thing, but a work ethic thing...
Click to expand...
sometimes a "soldier" wears no uniform...
 
Alex P said:
I was having issues trying to explain it lol... I am glad it came over ok. I Agree with what you're saying. But to a degree it is self serving I think. Not in a selfish way lol (confused.com) Sacraficing whatever out of love and concern for another be it time, be it a risk to your own life, be it your own materialistic items, what ever the sacrafice, it improves you, self. And spreads that love and you become surrounded by it, and you notice that those that you help seem to change their slant on things, and become more ready to sacrafice XYZ for another/others. Selfless enhances self. :P Your character can be seen and your true colours are on show.
Click to expand...

I can understand that. I think I was trying to say the same thing, but the words are problematic. I think it's kind of the issue that what is superficially self-serving (bad behavior or inaction, concern for "self") is actually detrimental to the self in the long-term. What is superficially altruistic is actually the best thing for the self in the long-term. But it is good for the self as in the Self-- not the self as in our ego. Which is why intent matters- if we are altruistic yet still egoic, we will not transform into something better, because our focus is all wrong.

I don't know if any of that made a ton of sense. It's hard to explain.
 
path_of_one said:
.... intent matters- if we are altruistic yet still egoic, we will not transform into something better, because our focus is all wrong.
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The Buddhist literature says merit is not added by virtuous deeds that are done for selfish reasons.

Someone said "altruism is covert selfishness." Pure selflessness is indeed a rare thing, but there are those who are capable of something very close to it. It is beyond trying to get rid of negative karma and storing up positive karma. It's zero karma and in that sense beyond good and evil.
 
juantoo3 said:
If you honestly and sincerely do not believe that I am tasting of the Lord and taking refuge in Him, then I am wasting my efforts.
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i dont think i mentioned that you were not tasting of the God of the bible , after all people are at various stages in their spiritual knowledge and understanding
 
Alex P said:
if I were in a situation where lives were indanger, I would refuse to take the victim role. I would sacrafice my efforts to help more surivive.. If I die but in my efforts many are saved then I can die well, if I allow myself to be saved and not attempt to help the others on this sinking ship I will not die, but when I die I will die with regret. quote]


yes your concience would be clear , saving souls is good in more ways than one .

To illustrate:

Imagine that you are a crewman on a sinking ship. The captain orders you to warn the passengers and direct them to the lifeboats. Will you ignore that command and concentrate on saving just yourself? Certainly not.


Others are depending on you. Their lives are at stake. You are morally obligated to carry out your commission to help them.


and getting back to something better for today,

Jesus commanded his disciples to GO and make disciples matthew 28;19-20 and then that in turn will lead on to some thing better for them and those who listen to them. even EVERLASTING LIFE JOHN 17;3



Jesus followers have been divinely commissioned to sound a warning.

Jehovah will soon bring an end to this entire wicked system of things.

Millions of lives hang in the balance.

Would it be right for us to ignore the peril to others and be concerned only about saving ourselves?

Of course not. We are morally obligated to help save the lives of others.—1 Tim. 4:16.

If, now, I am declaring the good news, it is no reason for me to boast, for necessity is laid upon me. Really, woe is me if I did not declare the good news!
1 corinthians 6;19
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mee said:
i dont think i mentioned that you were not tasting of the God of the bible , after all people are at various stages in their spiritual knowledge and understanding
Click to expand...
That's one small step for man, one giant leap for mee...
 
Quahom1 said:
That's one small step for man, one giant leap for mee...
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To presume to know the heart of man is folly. There are no degrees of understanding or knowledge.

Each human being is born with the innate knowledge written in their hearts. That comes straight from the Bible. What there are degrees of is "acceptance" of the truth of God, not mee's truth, but the universal truth.

By convoluting the truth and dismissing other's beliefs of the truth mee only adds to the brokenness of the human spirit. That only slows the progress of healing and coming closer to God, for each human being.
 
The 17th-century English poet John Milton, In his epic poem Paradise Lost,

he wrote that God created the earth to be a paradise home for the human family.
That original Paradise was lost.
However, Milton believed that it would be restored—that a redeemer in the person of Jesus Christ would one day "reward his faithful, and receive them into bliss . . . in Heaven or Earth."
Milton confidently declared: "For then the Earth shall all be Paradise.":)



What happened to the hope of a paradise earth?
Is our earthly existence meant to be only a passing phase?
As the first-century Jewish philosopher Philo held, is it to be just "a brief, often unfortunate, episode" in a journey to a spirit realm?

Or did God have something else in mind when he created the earth and put humans on it in paradise conditions?

Can mankind find genuine spiritual fulfillment and bliss right here on earth? Why not examine what the bible says about this subject? You may well conclude, as millions already have, that to hope for a restored earthly paradise is reasonable indeed.
 
I thought the timing was nice with miltons work... Began to write about "satan's" failed rebellion... Just around the time he had experienced his failed rebellion... Ironic...


-edit-

Anyone seen the advert on this thread?? lol.... "Learn arabic like a secret agent...."
 
Dramatic,earth changing events are near, those events will pave the way for the most wonderful conditions the world has ever experienced


psalm 37;10-11
better times are just ahead:)
 
mee said:
When paradise is restored ,earth will be cured of its fever:) then it will be better .
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No mee, the purpose of knowing God is to begin healing now, right now, not some time in the future. Then it would be a waste of the life and opportunity we've been given NOW.
 
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