M
mee
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LOL!! This is exactly the issue, Mee, and you don't see it.
You complain about Christianity splitting into factions and lauding themselves over one another - then you do exactly that!!
Are the JW's part of Christendom or not?
mee sees it very clearly
JW are no part of christendom , we are into the christianity that Jesus taught . we are into true christianity , without any manmade doctrines added on to it .
JW have cast off and away from them any babylonish teachings that made its way into the early christian congregations.
we have got out of it REVELATION 18;4 at the command from Jesus .
and yes its all in the bible .
and we like to stick to what the bible REALLY TEACHES
Jesus sheep will hear his voice and they always stick to what the bible teaches. Jesus explained:
"God loved the world so much that he gave his only-begotten Son, in order that everyone exercising faith in him might not be destroyed but have everlasting life." (John 3:16)
"God loved the world so much that he gave his only-begotten Son, in order that everyone exercising faith in him might not be destroyed but have everlasting life." (John 3:16)
God loves us so much that he gave his Son as a ransom, making it possible for us to be delivered from sin and death. (Ephesians 1:7)
The ransom is a precious gift from Jehovah, but he does not force us to accept it.
It is up to us to accept Jehovah’s gift. How?
By "exercising faith" in his Son. Faith, however, is not just words.
It is proved by actions, by the way we live. (James 2:26) We prove our faith in Jesus Christ by following him day after day. Doing so will bring rich blessings now and in the future,
By "exercising faith" in his Son. Faith, however, is not just words.
It is proved by actions, by the way we live. (James 2:26) We prove our faith in Jesus Christ by following him day after day. Doing so will bring rich blessings now and in the future,
M
mee
Guest
Indeed, as every faction will claim.
I mean, let's face it, various causes of factionalism are often based on differing interpretations of even the same passages!
how about this one
the Trinity—Whose Teaching?
What, then, about the teaching that Jehovah and Jesus are, in effect, the same God, as the Trinity doctrine proclaims?
In its issue of April-June 1999, The Living Pulpit magazine defined the Trinity this way:
"There is one God and Father, one Lord Jesus Christ, and one Holy Spirit, three ‘persons’ . . . who are the same or one in essence . . . ; three persons equally God, possessing the same natural properties, yet really distinct, known by their personal characteristics."
Where did this complex Trinity teaching originate?
The Christian Century, in its May 20-27, 1998, issue, quotes a pastor who acknowledges that the Trinity is "a teaching of the church rather than a teaching of Jesus."
Even though the Trinity is not a teaching of Jesus, is it consistent with what he taught?
Jesus taught that The Father was Superior to the Son
Jesus taught his disciples to pray: "Our Father which art in heaven, hallowed be thy name."
Our heavenly Father, whose name is Jehovah, is described in the Bible as being superior to his Son.
For example, Jehovah is "from everlasting to everlasting."
But the Bible says that Jesus is "the firstborn of every creature."
That Jehovah is greater than Jesus, Jesus himself taught when he said:
"My Father is greater than I." (Matthew 6:9; Psalm 90:1, 2; Colossians 1:15; John 14:28, King James Version)
Yet, the Trinity doctrine holds that the Father and the Son are "equally God."
The Father’s superiority over the Son, as well as the fact that the Father is a separate person, is highlighted also in the prayers of Jesus, such as the one before his execution:
"Father, if you wish, remove this cup [that is, an ignominious death] from me.
Nevertheless, let, not my will, but yours take place." (Luke 22:42)
If God and Jesus are "one in essence," as the Trinity doctrine says, how could Jesus’ will, or wish, seem different from that of his Father?
Hebrews 5:7, 8; 9:24.
Hebrews 5:7, 8; 9:24.
Furthermore, if Jehovah and Jesus were the same, how could one of them be aware of things of which the other was not?
Jesus, for instance, said regarding the time of the world’s judgment: "Concerning that day or the hour nobody knows, neither the angels in heaven nor the Son, but the Father."—Mark 13:32.
so yes you are right, there are different interpretations ,but the right interpretation harmonizes the bible throughout .
but the trinity doctrine makes for confusion not harmony.
BlaznFattyz
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not at all. you may be confused; however, christianity is not regarding the nature of God.
No one has ever seen God; but if we love one another, God lives in us and his love is made complete in us. We know that we live in him and he in us, because he has given us of his Spirit. And we have seen and testify that the Father has sent his Son to be the Savior of the world. If anyone acknowledges that Jesus is the Son of God, God lives in him and he in God. And so we know and rely on the love God has for us.
And no greater is this for one to lay down his life for another, and that is what God has done, who sent the Word of God, His Son to die for our sins. As the scriptures point out, In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning. Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. In him was life, and that life was the light of men. The light shines in the darkness, but the darkness has not understood it. The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the One and Only, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.
And this is how you can recognize the Spirit of God: Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the anti-christ, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world.
Therefore, if we have the Spirit, then we have the Son, and if we have the Son, then we have the Father, because all of them are the one true living God that loves us and sent his Son to redeem us, and who sent the Holy Spirit to comfort us, so the promises of Christ remain true, that He is everlasting, ever present and true. For He says, "Surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age."
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What has throwing a stone got to do with trinity causing confusion??
M
mee
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No one has ever seen God; quote]
but Jesus has seen him because Jesus has lived in heaven before he came to earth , and NOW ,Jesus is back in heaven and he is a reigning king in Gods heavenly kingdom daniel 2;44 daniel 7;13-14
and it was GOD (Jehovah)that sent his son to the earth as JOHN 3;16 informs us. the bible is good for setting things straight.
Jesus, responding to a question by Thomas, said: "If you men had known me, you would have known my Father also; from this moment on you know him and have seen him," and, in answer to a question from Philip, Jesus added: "He that has seen me has seen the Father also." (Joh 14:5-9)
Again, Jesus’ following explanation shows that this was so because he faithfully represented his Father, spoke the Father’s words, and did the Father’s works. (Joh 14:10, 11; compare Joh 12:28, 44-49.)
It was on this same occasion, the night of his death, that Jesus said to these very disciples: "The Father is greater than I am."—Joh 14:28.
That Jesus’ statement about seeing the Father was meant to be understood figuratively and not literally is evident from his own statement at John 6:45 as well as from the fact that John, long after Jesus’ death, wrote:
"No man has seen God at any time; the only-begotten god who is in the bosom position with the Father is the one that has explained him."—Joh 1:18; 1Jo 4:12.
the bible is good for setting things straight
BlaznFattyz
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"If you have seen Me, you have seen the Father!" John 14:9
Therefore, God the Father in heaven cannot be seen by man; however Christ who is the Word of God, who is God has seen him. The Word of God humbling himself to be among us was man and God, that is how a man can die for our sins yet be the Saviour, an attribute only belonging to God. That is why one can say if you have seen Jesus, you have seen the Father, because he is God who has redeemed us as Lord and Saviour.
M
mee
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BlaznFattyz
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M
mee
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Mee is throwing stones at the "prostitute faith" called the trinity...of which most Christians belong to...
Doctrines as interpretations from Man - and these interpretations among all factions as open to criticism from all sides.
In other words, I'm sure there are plenty of criticisms that could be thrown against JW doctrines and their basis for interpretation as they are.
In which case, stone throwing at other Christian factions as simply self-defeating - isn't it better to try and move oneself closer to God, rather than invest so much time decrying other people's beliefs?
It would be preferable not to call faith's into question.Doctrines as interpretations from Man - and these interpretations among all factions as open to criticism from all sides.
In other words, I'm sure there are plenty of criticisms that could be thrown against JW doctrines and their basis for interpretation as they are.
In which case, stone throwing at other Christian factions as simply self-defeating - isn't it better to try and move oneself closer to God, rather than invest so much time decrying other people's beliefs?
M
mee
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The most notorious example of spiritual prostitution is "Babylon the Great, the mother of the harlots and of the disgusting things of the earth."—Re 17:5;
BlaznFattyz
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im not sure where this is going, but i get the feeling it is very disrespectful to christianity.
M
mee
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babylon the great is..... the worldwide empire of false religion ...... and it is very disrespectful to true christianity.
christianity is what Jesus taught .
so the question is WHAT IS FALSE RELIGION
Ironically, it is religion—specifically the religious organizations and leaders who have promoted ideas contrary to God’s thoughts. (Mark 7:7, 8)
As a result, many people have been deceived into believing that they worship the true God, while in reality they offend him.
False religion is directly responsible for this sad situation.
Flee From "Babylon the Great" revelation 18;4
Consider how the Bible book of Revelation describes false religion.
It is portrayed as a drunken prostitute who has power over many kingdoms and their peoples.
This figurative woman commits fornication with many kings and is drunk with the blood of God’s true worshippers. (Revelation 17:1, 2, 6, 18)
She has a name written on her forehead that matches her filthy and repulsive conduct.
The name is "Babylon the Great, the mother of the harlots and of the disgusting things of the earth."—Revelation 17:5.
The Scriptural description of Babylon the Great fits the world’s collective body of false religion.
Although the thousands of religions are not formally united as one world organization, they are inseparably joined in purpose and deed.
As depicted by the immoral woman in Revelation, false religion has tremendous influence over governments.
Resembling a woman not faithful to her marriage vows, false religion has prostituted herself by forming alliances with one political power after another.
"Adulteresses, do you not know that the friendship with the world is enmity with God?" wrote the disciple James. "Whoever, therefore, wants to be a friend of the world is constituting himself an enemy of God."—James 4:4.
This mixing of false religion with the governments has resulted in much human suffering.
That Jehovah hates false worship is clearly seen from what happens to Babylon the Great.
Revelation 17:16 states: in symbolic launguage the following things
The ten horns that you saw, and the wild beast, these will hate the harlot and will make her devastated and naked, and will eat up her fleshy parts and will completely burn her with fire
First, a huge beast mauls her to death and eats up her fleshy parts. Then, whatever remains of her is completely burned.
Correspondingly, soon the world governments will take such action against false religion.
God will make it happen. (Revelation 17:17)
Babylon the Great, the world empire of false religion, is doomed to destruction.
"She will never be found again."—Revelation 18:21.
What position should true worshippers take regarding Babylon the Great?
In no uncertain terms, the Bible commands: "Get out of her, my people, if you do not want to share with her in her sins, and if you do not want to receive part of her plagues." (Revelation 18:4)
Those who want to be spared must get out of false religion before it is too late.
so then back to the thread theme,
JESUS WAS SENT BY GOD yes that is what the bible REALLY teaches
.JOHN 3;16-17
Jesus Christ—Sent by God?
NEARLY everyone today has heard of Jesus Christ.
His influence on history has been greater than that of any other human.
Indeed, the very calendar used in most parts of the world is based on the year he is thought to have been born!
As The World Book Encyclopedia says: "Dates before that year are listed as B.C., or before Christ. Dates after that year are listed as A.D., or anno Domini (in the year of our Lord)."
So Jesus was not an imaginary person.
He really lived as a man on earth.
"In ancient times even the opponents of Christianity never doubted the [actual existence] of Jesus," notes the Encyclopædia Britannica.
So just who was Jesus? Was he really sent by God?
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Doctrines as interpretations from Man - and these interpretations among all factions as open to criticism from all sides.
In other words, I'm sure there are plenty of criticisms that could be thrown against JW doctrines and their basis for interpretation as they are.
In which case, stone throwing at other Christian factions as simply self-defeating - isn't it better to try and move oneself closer to God, rather than invest so much time decrying other people's beliefs?
Thank you for elaborating