Is suicide really a grave sin?

A

Amber13

Guest
All my life, I have been led to believe by other people that taking your own life causes the damnation of your soul. I study spirituality, anthropology, and various apocryphal and canonical texts, (as well as pray), but a definitive answer to this question still eludes me. I have known some who have taken their own life, and it is hard for me to accept that God would not have mercy and love for those who suffer from unbearable pain. It would take much faith and courage to commit suicide, as far as I can see. Especially, with the state of affairs in the world today, those who reject it or cannot bear it seem rational compared to the vast majority that continue chasing after nothing that endures. Especially, if one yearns for God, so much that life on earth is utter torment, why would these be punished? I do not understand.
 
Not all suicides are equal.

Many are caused by depression or guilt, which can be helped medically or with counselling. Some because life for whatever reason has become too painful. The pain may be physical, which is often treatable, or mental, which often eases with time and support. As the song says, everybody hurts sometimes. Some are a cry for help. Others are an angry reaction to a situation that they cannot control. Some happen out of spite.

I don't think the act of suicide is in itself sinful. The question is: what was the motivation or intention behind it? But if someone has reached such a low ebb that they are considering taking their life, they need sympathy and support not condemnation.

But it would be wrong to appear to condone suicide. Anything that helps pull people back from the brink has got to be good. Most pain gets better in time. I read some months ago of a student who jumped in front of a train because he thought he had failed to gain a university place. In fact he had been successful. What a waste of a life.

What I'm saying is, condemn the sin, but forgive the sinner.
 
Amber,

A very good psychic once told me that suicide is forbidden no matter what, and that a person who committs suicide creates a great deal of trouble for themself. She said that committing suicide is a rule that we must not break, and it makes sense to me.

Yes, life is hard, but I believe in the idea of bad karma and the need to burn off bad kama. Once we burn off all of our bad karma, things will go a lot better. (I also believe that it will take more than one lifetime for most people to burn off all of their bad karma.) A person who wishes to committ suicide must keep in mind that things will eventually get better, and that each day of suffering gets them closer to their goal.
 
Amber13, how one looks at suicide depends on one's assumptions. If you assume an almighty creator god, then all the issues and contradictions of suicide arise.

For those who believe in karma, then addressing the issue of suicide is easier. Our sufferings wil be seen as due to the evil karma that we ourselves created in our past or past lives. The karma will only disappear either through our experiencing its effects or through our purification effort. From this viewpoint, suicide therefore is pointless as it merely postpone the karmic effect. In addition, the act of suicide itself will create another karma that will have to be experience or purify away at a later stage.
 
Amber13 said:
It would take much faith and courage to commit suicide, as far as I can see. Especially, with the state of affairs in the world today, those who reject it or cannot bear it seem rational compared to the vast majority that continue chasing after nothing that endures.
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You are contradicting yourself.

How can suicide seem "courageous" to you if it is done as an escape?
 
Hi Amber,

I do not accept the concept of sin or soul so there's one answer.

Snoopy
 
In our country it is a crime to commit suicide.

Seriously, and attempted suicide is a crime.

But not a capitol offense.

A grave sin?

Well that is where you end up.

But I am of the belief that G!d is all forgiving and all of us will eventually be with source... no matter how many lives it takes.
 
I couldn't really go into it in a "Sin" aspect as far as my understanding of sin goes, sin is sin... Simple as that, no level... It is all equally a sin... But, anyway I would go into it to say.... It is the biggest cheat there is... And you only cheat yourself. Well, I guess you can leave many heartbroken and upset.. But in the long run you are the one being cheated/screwed out of something rare and something amazing, and you are the one responsible for it.... Suicide is far from courageous, unless you are confusing it for sacrifice? Different kettle of chips.
 
Amber wrote above:

"...(suicide) causes the damnation of your soul. I study spirituality, anthropology, and various apocryphal and canonical texts, (as well as pray), but a definitive answer to this question still eludes me. I have known some who have taken their own life, and it is hard for me to accept that God would not have mercy and love for those who suffer from unbearable pain."

In the Baha'i Faith suicide is forbidden however we do not accept that suicide causes damnation to the soul or that God would not have mercy.. God can show mercy to us regardless..

Here's a summary of the Baha'i view:

  1. The act of suicide is strongly condemned in the Baha'i teachings, and alongside the other world religions, it is "forbidden". However, Baha'is do not adopt a condemnatory attitude toward those who commit suicide.
  2. Such an act does not mean that the person “has ceased to be a Bahá’í” or lose their entitlement to a Bahá’í funeral and memorial service.
  3. The Bahá’í teachings on suicide need to be understood in the context of beliefs on the purpose of life and the afterlife. For Bahá’ís, the purpose of life is to develop one’s spiritual capacity and, in so doing, contribute to “an ever-advancing civilization”. Bahá’ís believe in an afterlife, of which little is known. It is thought to be a spiritual existence, and those that die retain their individuality in the afterlife and potentially continue to develop spiritually.
  4. Bahá’ís believe that the Ultimate Reality, what some religions call God, is omniscient and merciful, and will deal with every soul justly. Bahá’ís have no knowledge of the nature by which the Ultimate Reality will deal with individuals: “The manner in which the Supreme Being, in His Justice as well as in His Mercy, will deal with every individual soul is a mystery unknown to us on this earthly plane”. In some cases, the Bahá’í teachings indicate that God will be merciful and forgiving. For example, in response to an early Bahá’í who committed suicide, the Bahá’í writings stated: “He will be immersed in the ocean of pardon and forgiveness and will become the recipient of bounty and favour.”
 
"Sin" in the traditional Jewish and Christian sense, is not a "crime against God" or a "spiritual crime" or any sort of crime at all. The Hebrew and Greek words translated as "sin" in English both literally mean "to fall short" or "to miss the target". Thus, suicide would be a sin in this most ancient (in my own tradition) sense. The "target" of which we would fall short would be complete perfection.

The proper response to having sinned in this sense is not guilt and self-loathing. It is produtive humility. It's "pick yourself up, dust yourself off, start again."
 
wil said:
In our country it is a crime to commit suicide.
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The police must love suicides in your country for the clear up rates.

"Crime scene report: suspect still on premises on arrival; provided no resistance and arrested."

s.
 
From the article by the Theosophist WQ Judge posted above:


The fate of the suicide is horrible in general. He has cut himself off from his body by using mechanical means that affect the body, but cannot touch the real man. He then is projected into the astral world, for he has to live somewhere. There the remorseless law, which acts really for his good, compels him to wait until he can properly die. Naturally he must wait, half dead, the months or years which, in the order of nature, would have rolled over him before body and soul and spirit could rightly separate. He becomes a shade; he lives in purgatory, so to say, called by the Theosophist the "place of desire and passion," or "Kama Loka." He exists in the astral realm entirely, eaten up by his own thoughts. Continually repeating in vivid thoughts the act by which he tried to stop his life's pilgrimage, he at the same time sees the people and the place he left, but is not able to communicate with any one except, now and then, with some poor sensitive, who often is frightened by the visit. And often he fills the minds of living persons who may be sensitive to his thoughts with the picture of his own taking off, occasionally leading them to commit upon themselves the act of which he was guilty.
To put it theosophically, the suicide has cut himself off on one side from the body and life which were necessary for his experience and evolution, and on the other from his spirit, his guide and "Father in heaven." He is composed now of astral body, which is of great tensile strength, informed and inflamed by his passions and desires. But a portion of his mind, called manas, is with him. He can think and perceive, but, ignorant of how to use the forces of that realm, he is swept hither and thither, unable to guide himself. His whole nature is in distress, and with it to a certain degree the whole of humanity, for through the spirit all are united. Thus he goes on, until the law of nature acting on his astral body, that begins to die, and then he falls into a sleep from which he awakens in time for a season of rest before beginning once more a life on earth. In his next reincarnation he may, if he sees fit, retrieve or compensate or suffer over again.
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Snoopy said:
The police must love suicides in your country for the clear up rates.

"Crime scene report: suspect still on premises on arrival; provided no resistance and arrested."

s.
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Actually there are mitigating circumstances. For example, it you are attempting to jump off a bridge because your business has just lost the 8,000.00 dollar deposit but a little man jumps in to the water ahead of you and you jump in to save him and his copy of Tom Sawyer, you might just get a second chance, resulting in the awareness that you had a great life after all and want to live again. Go ahead, check you pocket ZuZu's petals are probably there...
 
Virtual_Cliff said:
Not all suicides are equal.

I don't think the act of suicide is in itself sinful. The question is: what was the motivation or intention behind it?
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I agree with Virtual_Cliff.

To my mind, there is a big difference between someone who commits suicide due to mental illness--i.e., a chemical imbalance in the brain--and someone who commits suicide in order to hurt another person--e.g., a man who kills himself with the intent that his body will be discovered by his estranged spouse.

I do not believe that a soul is condemned to "death"--permanent separation from God--due to suicide. (I don't believe that permanent separation from God is possible, unless a soul chooses it.) I do believe, however, that suicide qualifies as a sin. (I use the word sin in terms of its original meaning: "to miss the mark.")
 
To me the thing about suicide and morality is that its wrong to encourage someone else to take their own life -- if doing so requires you to make a judgment that their life is not valuable. You simply do not know what any person's contribution to the universe will be, whether they are on their deathbed or in the cradle. I feel that making suicide illegal is too overzealous, but it is a genuine attempt to prevent people from encouraging suicides. It especially keeps the government from encouraging suicide. Governments are always looking for ways to cut expenses, and suicides really cut down on expenses.

I think it is funny that the term 'Grave' was used for the thread title, and I think its fitting that we joke about death sometimes. Its the saddest subject of all.
 
It's a grave sin. We are given our body in order to find the way from this physical prison to open our soul. Life is not a child's toy or game. It's our task, to live properly and to become winners at the end (at the natural end!) But if someone commits suicide he would first live very-very long and very-very sad bodyless life like a ghost, will suffer much more than at any circustances on Earth, and then he will have to reincarnate in much worse conditions and to try once again. Be smart, don't lose, try to fight and to win in this life, due to your power of love.
 
A lot of people commit suicide due to mental illness and depression. I think it's a tragedy for people to die that way. I would think that God would give those people a second chance.
 
Saltmeister said:
A lot of people commit suicide due to mental illness and depression. I think it's a tragedy for people to die that way. I would think that God would give those people a second chance.
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i agree,

i would guess you have to be seriously depressed to commit suicide, would be nice for God to have mercy on you in the after life rather than eternal punishment for being depressed.
 
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