My spiritual beliefs - what does this make me?

[pghguy]

Where does this leave me?

I’m currently trying to determine where I belong on the religious spectrum. For some time, I’ve been giving this much thought and would like the input of others.

I was raised Catholic and technically still am but am searching for truth, answers and meaning.

Here’s where I am in my self reflection and evaluation:

1. I’m not sure I agree with the idea of organized religion but rather spirituality. I think in many ways, the institution of religion has become too legalistic and mechanical and has lost its true purpose and meaning.

2. I do believe in God, and only one God but possibly with several incarnations – likely including Jesus Christ. I think Allah, Yahweh, Jehovah…are also the same God just with a different name.

3. I feel closer to God in a park overlooking a Sunset, checking out flashes of lightning or watching the first snowfall of the season than in any specific building. Not that I have anything against churches, temples or other religious structures.

4. I thing science and religion can and do coincide. For example, God created man in His or Her image but this does not discount that this could have happen over tens of thousands of years via the means of evolution.

5. I believe there is a plan for our lives and no life is without meaning or purpose.

6. I think God is omnipresent and within all of creation.

7. I think God gave humans the innate wisdom and ability to distinguish right from wrong and has given us guidelines along the way to help us be in touch with those skills.

8. I believe that there are some truths that are not universal but rather individual and that truth does not necessarily have to be the same for everyone.

9. I feel that there is something primitive ingrained within us that can lead to greater connection and understanding in the universe.

10. I see God as gender neutral. God is both He and She and neither all at the same time. God’s is unclassifiable is such terms and to label God in these terms would be to believe that God is limited.

11. I think we are to have an individual connection with God rather than a collective one and that God has granted us the ability to give our lives meaning.

12. I feel that God is the ultimate judge of our eternal destiny and that few if any of us are enlightened enough to know on what criteria we will be judged. This also means that many of the ideas taught to us by organized religions may be off track.

13. I feel that no religion has cornered the market on God.

14. I believe that people are inherently good by their nature and only become evil through corruption, indoctrination and other means.

 

[citizenzen]

2. I do believe in God, and only one God but possibly with several incarnations – likely including Jesus Christ. I think Allah, Yahweh, Jehovah…are also the same God just with a different name.

I will agree with you here and I think this is one of the fun cornerstones of interfaith: we're all "tapping into" the same thing that is then split through the prism of culture.

I spent all my life thinking that monotheism meant not only do you believe in one God, but that only one God exists. It was, in my mind, a great device for bringing people of the world together: We may be of different faiths, but ultimately we all believe in the same thing.

It really came as a shock to me (I was pretty naive) when I first began chatting in religious forums to find many people didn't share that belief. For many, monotheism simply means I believe in one God, and you believe on one God, but those Gods are not the same God... which sounds a lot like polytheism to my ears.

 

[citizenzen]

I will agree with you here and I think this is one of the fun cornerstones of interfaith:

While it may be "fun" I actually meant to say fundamental.

 

[pghguy]

While it may be "fun" I actually meant to say fundamental.

I got the gist of what you meant. Anyway, it also seems like Jesus himself was rather anti-establishment when it came to organized religion. He didn't really care what people thought when we worked miracles on the Sabbath and such. While of course, this was a violation of Jewish law. And, he also went against the legalistic and mechanical thought when it came to the whole turn the other cheek idea.

Regardless of if you are Christian or not, or believe in miracles or not, the essence of the message is what matters.

 

[Saltmeister]

1. I’m not sure I agree with the idea of organized religion but rather spirituality. I think in many ways, the institution of religion has become too legalistic and mechanical and has lost its true purpose and meaning.

8. I believe that there are some truths that are not universal but rather individual and that truth does not necessarily have to be the same for everyone.

12. I feel that God is the ultimate judge of our eternal destiny and that few if any of us are enlightened enough to know on what criteria we will be judged. This also means that many of the ideas taught to us by organized religions may be off track.

13. I feel that no religion has cornered the market on God.

I agree with these ^^

11. I think we are to have an individual connection with God rather than a collective one and that God has granted us the ability to give our lives meaning.

14. I believe that people are inherently good by their nature and only become evil through corruption, indoctrination and other means.

11. I was thinking more of an individual connection that is part of a collective one.

14. a) corruption: What do you mean by corruption?

b) indoctrination: yes

c) other means: examples?

It really came as a shock to me (I was pretty naive) when I first began chatting in religious forums to find many people didn't share that belief. For many, monotheism simply means I believe in one God, and you believe on one God, but those Gods are not the same God... which sounds a lot like polytheism to my ears.

It sounds like a multi-monotheistic universe. You follow your God, I follow my God.......

What do you mean by these Gods not being the "same God?" Do you mean they are not the same kind of God (although it might still be the same person) or actually different people and not one person?

While it may be "fun" I actually meant to say fundamental.

When it comes to religion, I don't believe in fundamentals. To me, it's all relative. It's a question of what's more important at particular stages in the journey. It's a matter of judgment. Nothing is eternal or universal (except maybe for God).

 

[citizenzen]

When it comes to religion, I don't believe in fundamentals. To me, it's all relative. It's a question of what's more important at particular stages in the journey. It's a matter of judgment. Nothing is eternal or universal (except maybe for God).

But you went full circle there.

You say there isn't anything fundamental, yet at the very end you say "except maybe for God".

But God was exactly what I was talking about. And I talked about the relative aspects as I said this single source is viewed differently through the prism of each culture.

So I guess you disagree with me... while agreeing with me.

Except maybe...

 

[Saltmeister]

But you went full circle there.

You say there isn't anything fundamental, yet at the very end you say "except maybe for God".

But God was exactly what I was talking about. And I talked about the relative aspects as I said this single source is viewed differently through the prism of each culture.

So I guess you disagree with me... while agreeing with me.

Except maybe...

I don't expect everyone else to think of God as eternal. The idea of God being eternal isn't so important to me. There are far more important things than that, meaning that it isn't fundamental. I was just honouring tradition.

 

[pghguy]

I agree with these ^^



11. I was thinking more of an individual connection that is part of a collective one.

14. a) corruption: What do you mean by corruption?

b) indoctrination: yes

c) other means: examples?

Corruption - In this case, would be something like getting a taste of power either directly or indirectly and then choosing that power as a means to get what you want regardless of the consquences for others.

Other things that lead to evil - jealousy, indifference, selfishness... all of which may be human instinct to some level but we are able to control them if we choose. It's the lack of choosing to do so, especially consistently, that leads to evil, and not necessarily the concepts themselves. For example, anger may be a basic human emotion but when you choose to let anger consume you, evil comes from it.

 

[citizenzen]

I don't expect everyone else to think of God as eternal.

Nah... He's just a temp God.

The real God's on maternity leave.



God as eternal... who ever thinks that?

 

[Saltmeister]

God as eternal... who ever thinks that?

Do a search on Google.

 

[citizenzen]

Do a search on Google.

I'll find people who believe in a flat Earth that way as well.

I'm not sure you want to use "shows up in a Google search" as a selling point.



But there I go... trying to "win" an argument again.

 

[shawn]

pghguy:
My spiritual beliefs - what does this make me?
Where does this leave me?

What your list says to me is that you have developed an open and questioning mind and that you have lived enough to have seen through a few of the veils.
In life we need to be committed to be (IMO) lifelong learners.
Even cherished beliefs which we can and do form emotional and sentimental attachments to (which can be very strong) can be proved to be quite wrong, so it is good to cultivate a mindset that is prepared for such an event.
Less of a shock that way.

 

[citizenzen]

In life we need to be committed to be (IMO) lifelong learners.

Yep. You're never "made".

You spend your entire life being remade.

 

[Saltmeister]

Yep. You're never "made".

You spend your entire life being remade.

Made. Sold. Used. Thrown away. Recycled.

 

[path_of_one]

You sound like another open-minded person to me. I agreed with most of what you said.

If you mean, what kind of religious/spiritual identity is closest to your list of beliefs, I'd guess Unitarian Universalist.

You might try the Belief-O-Matic for fun (and profit- J/K). Just Google it. It's amusing at times to see what comes up in your top 5.

 

[17th Angel]

Why try and fit in? Just be yourself and believe what you will... Putting a label on it does that make it more valid or something?

 

[Snoopy]

You might try the Belief-O-Matic for fun (and profit- J/K). Just Google it. It's amusing at times to see what comes up in your top 5.

I was going to suggest that PoO; without doing it myself I would never have become a scientologist.

s.

 

[17th Angel]

The guy that screamed at the scientologist... Is doing another documentary tonight on TV...

 

[Thomas]

Hi pghguy —

As a Catholic, I thought I'd pop in some probably contrary views!

1. I’m not sure I agree with the idea of organized religion but rather spirituality.

In my view humanity is a community, of which the individual is a constituent part. The whole thrust of the Abrahamic Traditions is towards salvation of the collective, not just humanity but 'the whole world' — which in another sense is the sacralisation and deification of the Cosmos — rather than the survival of individuals amid the shipwreck of the human race ...

I think the issue is clouded today by differing ideas of what constitutes 'spirituality'.

I think one can generalise two forms: One is religious, and comprises the language of the great mystics and the spiritual traditions. The other is a relative newcomer, and is the contemporary notion of 'interiority'.

The former is founded on a relation of dependence upon the transcendental Absoloute; the latter is autonomous and an exploration of one's own psychic richness.

The religious dimension encompasses both, whereas the interior dimension focusses purely on the cosmic self — thus one can find philosophers, artists and theosophists who enjoy a profound psychic life, go quite far in cosmic mysticism (or spiritualism) but never engage in, nor indeed necessarily believe in, the idea of a God or Absolute.

I suggest the latter is what is largely regarded as spirituality today, and assumes that is what is meant in the works of the great mystics, which is a fundamental misreading.

I think in many ways, the institution of religion has become too legalistic and mechanical and has lost its true purpose and meaning.

This is an inescapable facet of any community, religious or otherwise — it's a problem of human nature, not of institutions per se (they simply reflect human nature). It is no excuse not to engage, however. One can always criticise, and the same applies to the medical profession, but people still go to the doctor when they're sick.

2 I do believe in God, and only one God but possibly with several incarnations – likely including Jesus Christ. I think Allah, Yahweh, Jehovah…are also the same God just with a different name.

Generally, yes ... with the proviso that there is only one 'Incarnation', although many might embody the spirit.

3. I feel closer to God in a park overlooking a Sunset, checking out flashes of lightning or watching the first snowfall of the season than in any specific building. Not that I have anything against churches, temples or other religious structures.

As do I when looking at the stars ... but beware of sentimentalism. It is we who wonder at nature, nature does not impart that sense to us ... remember tsunamis, cancer and epidemics are all part of the same process. Most people never give God a second's thought, until nature emerges in her less endearing aspects ... and yet many mystics assert that this is a vaible 'way to God' ...

... but then again, I have felt closer to God in a Church, than anywhere else.

4. I thing science and religion can and do coincide. For example, God created man in His or Her image but this does not discount that this could have happen over tens of thousands of years via the means of evolution.

I agree that they coincide, but they are not the same thing. The major problem today is science assumes an authority it does not possess, and speaks about things it knows nothing about (a la Dawkins). People, dazzled by technology, have bought the package in all good faith. I reckon there are more people in the West today who have a 'blind faith' in science than have a blind faith in God.

5. I believe there is a plan for our lives and no life is without meaning or purpose.

So do I, but it's not a given. It has to be worked at. And the plan is not mine, nor can I determine how the plan plays out.

6. I think God is omnipresent and within all of creation.

So do I. But creation is not God.

7. I think God gave humans the innate wisdom and ability to distinguish right from wrong and has given us guidelines along the way to help us be in touch with those skills.

Yep.

8. I believe that there are some truths that are not universal but rather individual and that truth does not necessarily have to be the same for everyone.

Then that is contingent and epheral. All contingent truth is relational to and dependent on Universal Truth.

9. I feel that there is something primitive ingrained within us that can lead to greater connection and understanding in the universe.

Yep. The gift of self. Currently, the culture of the West is heading in entirely the opposite direction. So much for 'progress'.

10. I see God as gender neutral. God is both He and She and neither all at the same time. God’s is unclassifiable is such terms and to label God in these terms would be to believe that God is limited.

Not necessarily. That is true if one adopts a fundamentalist attitude, and there's plenty of that around! If one looks at the metaphysics, then one is looking at something else altogether.

11. I think we are to have an individual connection with God rather than a collective one and that God has granted us the ability to give our lives meaning.

Again, we are individuals of one nature — human nature — so the nature is higher than the individual, and the connection comes via the nature, an individual is just one instance of a single nature that enjoys a divine connection.

The aspect of 'original sin' that is overlooked is the fault lies in the universal nature, on in the individual, but as su h all individuals are subject to it.

12. I feel that God is the ultimate judge of our eternal destiny and that few if any of us are enlightened enough to know on what criteria we will be judged. This also means that many of the ideas taught to us by organized religions may be off track.

Well, the detail is there in the Scriptures ... but I do accept that how Scripture is interpreted is another matter.

13. I feel that no religion has cornered the market on God.

I feel that God has cornered the market on religion.

14. I believe that people are inherently good by their nature and only become evil through corruption, indoctrination and other means.

Then the nature is corrupted, else people would be proof against corruption?

Thomas

 

[Dragonseer]

You might try the Belief-O-Matic for fun (and profit- J/K).... It's amusing at times to see what comes up in your top 5.

I second this idea.

I've taken the Belief-O-Matic quiz several times over the past eight years; my top five results have never been the same, which, IMO, shows that my beliefs are evolving.