B
Brother Rando
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Is it really a place of eternal punishment by being burned forever and ever as taught by Religion?
juantoo3
....whys guy.... ʎʇıɹoɥʇnɐ uoıʇsǝnb
OK, I'll bite.
For the sake of discussion, what precisely do you mean by the word "truth?" Before I ask about the "truth" about "hell," I first must understand what it is you are attempting to convey.
I would add here, for the sake of discussion, that when I say the word "truth," I mean factual reality, reproducible or at least demonstrable. I can show you. So if "hell" is "truly" a "place" as you claim, you should be able to show me on a map.
Can you show me hell? Have you been there?
For the sake of discussion, what precisely do you mean by the word "truth?" Before I ask about the "truth" about "hell," I first must understand what it is you are attempting to convey.
I would add here, for the sake of discussion, that when I say the word "truth," I mean factual reality, reproducible or at least demonstrable. I can show you. So if "hell" is "truly" a "place" as you claim, you should be able to show me on a map.
Can you show me hell? Have you been there?
A Cup Of Tea
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Steve have already talked to you about this.
If you don't understand what he is trying to tell you then perhaps you should start asking questions about this place.
juantoo3
....whys guy.... ʎʇıɹoɥʇnɐ uoıʇsǝnb
So is hell endothermic or exothermic?
Inquiring minds want to know...
Inquiring minds want to know...
That was a good story...
And dear brother Randi, me hopes you haven't yet another question where you think you know the answer and about to educate us on how wrong we are...
Its a fairly simple formula, you make a statement. "According to the teachings of my religion, hell is.... And we get this from the following scriptures which we interpret as.... Does your belief differ or agree?"
Asking a question you believe you know the answer to while setting others up for a fall...who teaches that?
Asking a question you believe you know the answer to while setting others up for a fall...who teaches that?
if a human is designed to live an eternity. His body cannot be served as an permanent ID, as when a body decays the continuity of the 'he' will be lost. Only a soul can play the role of an eternal ID. A body is just the image of a human. The soul is the true ID disregarding how many times you change your body/image throughout the eternity.
That's why a soul is referred to as immortal.
The end destiny of a human is either with God or he's not, there's no middle ground in between. Those rejected by God are said to be in a permanent separation from God. In such a separation God may no longer have any connection with them. On the other hand, they will not be able to benefit from any creations from God, including a peaceful place. God makes our place suitable for living creatures. This will no longer be the case in a permanent separation. Humans without God are on there own. Their living place will no longer be maintained by God. So as time goes by eternally, temperature may exceed what a human can live with, possibly as a result of what 'nature' itself is.
Our living place, that is planet earth, is not what 'nature' is. It's God made, and thus is suitable for living creatures to live. Outside this God-made comfortable place, temperature may be as high as whatever it should naturally be. So when put to such a 'natural' place where God's maintenance is absent, a human is naturally in a burning hell.
Justification is needed for God to pull humans out of that natural but hot place. This justification is the second crucifixion of Jesus Christ. If this justification won't happen (and it won't), humans will have to remain in that natural place without beneficial from anything from God.
Our problem is that we have assumed that the comfortable place (i.e., planet earth) we are living in is the 'nature' while hell is unnatural. However the opposite may be the truth.
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Maranguape
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Yes, but not the Christian hell. The hell from the Tanach which is called Sheol aka the grave. Also from this hell, once gone, no one will ever return. (II Samuel 12:23; Psalm 49:12, 20; Isaiah 26:14; Job 7:9; etc, etc...)
Maranguape
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By the word "Truth" I mean a statement that has been verified by eyewitnesses, or the result of logical approval. If you want to see hell aka Sheol, you can pay a visit to a cemetery and see what I am talking about. You don't even need a map as it is available to all.[/QUOTE]
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Y
Yessy
Guest
In aswer to the main question:
Man will not be able to comprehend the truth of hell or the need for it, unless they come to grips first with the Holiness of God.
In light of the Holiness of God, we see our sinfulness and the wrath of God towards sin.
Why would a community cast out poeple with the Ebola virus out of their midst...is it because they are heartless and cruel, or is it because they want to preserve life.
Even if just one drop of poison is put into a litre of clean water, the water is no longer clean and pure and life giving.
For God to be the perfect source of goodness and Life, he needs to stay undefiled.
For Him to be one with defilement He would no longer be pure.
We are either one with Him or we are to go where He is not, and Hell is everything He is not.
Unless the understand the problem of sin and defilement and the Holy One's position of utter seperateness therefrom, we will never be able to comprehend what hell is or why it is there.
Man will not be able to comprehend the truth of hell or the need for it, unless they come to grips first with the Holiness of God.
In light of the Holiness of God, we see our sinfulness and the wrath of God towards sin.
Why would a community cast out poeple with the Ebola virus out of their midst...is it because they are heartless and cruel, or is it because they want to preserve life.
Even if just one drop of poison is put into a litre of clean water, the water is no longer clean and pure and life giving.
For God to be the perfect source of goodness and Life, he needs to stay undefiled.
For Him to be one with defilement He would no longer be pure.
We are either one with Him or we are to go where He is not, and Hell is everything He is not.
Unless the understand the problem of sin and defilement and the Holy One's position of utter seperateness therefrom, we will never be able to comprehend what hell is or why it is there.
Sooo....
You must be sinless to get into heaven otherwise you will defile G!d?
Must be pretty.quiet.... And her holiness pretty lonely....wait...lonely.is.a.human trait...G!d wouldn't be affected by that...
But defiled....hmmm.... G!d can be defiled by us lowly creations...the omnipotent is not immune? can't hire an exterminator? IMA gonna have to pull his G!dcard.
Good point. In the sense that darkness is the absence of light, hell is to be totally, eternally deprived of God's presence? That definitely would be hell. Eternity? What is eternity? Time is a material/physical dimensional experience?
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Craz
Well-Known Member
I think many people live their lives in the state of hell as depicted in "The Great Divorce" by C.S. Lewis
There's purgatory too.
But to follow the analogy: darkness is the lack of light, not it's opposite. So if you close yourself into a safe, and tape up all chinks, there will be no light, absolute darkness. It can't get darker. But strike a match, and that place is no longer totally dark. Light a candle, light a lamp, a sun, ten million suns -- light just increases -- there's no limit.
Heat is the same. Absolute zero is the limit of cold, where no heat exists at all, where atoms stop moving. It can't get colder. But as a single atom begins to jiggle, warmth exists. Or, to be more correct, it is the warmth/energy that excites movement in the atoms. And warmth increases -- a kettle, a stove, a furnace, a sun, ten million suns, etc. No limit.
Thus 'No man shall see my face and live.'
So by analogy, satan is the lack of God. And hell is probably a cold place, not a hot one? So being incapable of either receiving or emitting any heat energy, it's neither endo nor exothermic?
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Craz
Well-Known Member
Oops I didn't realise this was in the Christianity section.
In Lewis's book he describes many (living) people I have met, including myself ... sometimes.
The phrase 'learning to see things in a different light' comes to mind.
I prefer the 'purgatory' description of human existence -- for most? Although there are some whose lives are truly hell?Oops I didn't realise this was in the Christianity section.
In Lewis's book he describes many (living) people I have met, including myself ... sometimes.
The phrase 'learning to see things in a different light' comes to mind.
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I don't know about this, in the sense that existence is a progress toward, but never actually reaching, a final state of full knowledge of God?
20 kids in a classroom, some love the teacher, school, just excited to learn...others would rather be somewhere else, some hate the teacher and think she is mean and out to get them.
Choices, attitudes, some are in heaven, others hell, or purgatory...of their own creation.
Choices, attitudes, some are in heaven, others hell, or purgatory...of their own creation.
Purgatory could be for instance the terrible regret of an alcoholic/drug addict mother, now reformed, but who can never repair the brain damaged child she gave birth to?
It's just an example. You can say: 'I' didn't know or understand what I was doing at the time' and know that God forgives you ... but it can't undo the damage caused to the innocent one you love most?
It's just an example. You can say: 'I' didn't know or understand what I was doing at the time' and know that God forgives you ... but it can't undo the damage caused to the innocent one you love most?
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