Absolute Truth

[Tony Bristow-Stagg]

Everybody is just being so unreasonable not to adopt Baha'u'llah as the new Christ and his statements as absolute infallible truth for all mankind for 800 years to come

I see people could consider to tackle the hard questions.

There was a valid interpretation of scripture posted that shows it is very plausible and reasonable that Muhammad is indeed foretold in the Bible, that the Beast was what became the Empire of Islam, a Faith built upon a broken Covernant, this also reflected in the Bible as the Two Witnesses that gave Prophecy for 1260 years but as dead bodies laying in the street.

If anyone would like to explore that as a possible truth given in the Bible, then the Absolute Truth of this may become manifested.

Regards Tony

 

[Tony Bristow-Stagg]

Wholeheartedly agree! It's crazy how people twist themselves into knots trying to come up with a different interpretation.

What I saw happen was people throwing into the subject a whole lot of distraction away from a plausible discussion on what truth Biblical Prophecy may offer humanity as a whole, not just Christians, when that was offered, the false prophet distraction started in earnest.

I like to Imagine the day when the penny drops for billions of people, oh my Gosh, Muhammad is foretold in the Bible, Billions of people now have new frames of references, they now have to look at faith and life through new eyes and hear with new ears, like wow, Muhammad was a Messenger as Jesus and the Prophets before him, and around the world, were.

A new Day of God indeed has arrived.

Who's willing to tackle the hard topics?

Regards Tony

 

[Tony Bristow-Stagg]

That's kind of the thing, right? Jesus claimed to be God Himself, not just a prophet.

The gospels say what they say. Paul says what he says. The New Testament is what it is. Nobody is required to believe a single word of it. But the NT says what it says about Jesus the Christ and cannot be honestly manipulated to come to say the opposite, imo?

Now if other Messengers have made the exact same claims, and given with those claims plausible explanations as to what that means, why are they determined false?

Krishna Gave such a Message Before Jesus, Baha'u'llah has given such a Message after Jesus.

Obviously it needs to be discussed, as it appears it may be our own understandings that need to be modified.

Regards Tony

 

[Modesty]

Now if other Messengers have made the exact same claims, and given with those claims plausible explanations as to what that means, why are they determined false?

Krishna Gave such a Message Before Jesus, Baha'u'llah has given such a Message after Jesus.

Obviously it needs to be discussed, as it appears it may be our own understandings that need to be modified.

Regards Tony

Other people who Baha'i call "Messengers" did not make the same claim. Mohammed never ever claimed to be God. Neither did Buddha.

 

[Tony Bristow-Stagg]

Other people who Baha'i call "Messengers" did not make the same claim. Mohammed never ever claimed to be God. Neither did Buddha.

This has been explained in great detail, how each Messenger has outwardly shared a certain amount of the light of God, while inwardly they are all the 'Self of God' (The full measure of the light of God) to all humanity.

So we can first Address those that have outwardly shown a fuller measure of the light of God. We can compare what they have revealed.

Regards Tony

 

[Modesty]

This has been explained in great detail, how each Messenger has outwardly shared a certain amount of the light of God, while inwardly they are all the 'Self of God' (The full measure of the light of God) to all humanity.

So we can first Address those that have outwardly shown a fuller measure of the light of God. We can compare what they have revealed.

Sorry, Tony, we're going to have to agree to disagree. Jesus claimed to be God Himself. Fully God. Whereas ask any faithful Muslim, they would be horrified at the idea of Mohammed claiming himself God in any way.

 

[Tony Bristow-Stagg]

Sorry, Tony, we're going to have to agree to disagree. Jesus claimed to be God Himself. Fully God. Whereas ask any faithful Muslim, they would be horrified at the idea of Mohammed claiming himself God in any way.

Agree to disagree is great, because Jesus also said he was not God, as did Baha'u'llah and all the Messengers.

Regards Tony

 

[Modesty]

Agree to disagree is great, because Jesus also said he was not God, as did Baha'u'llah and all the Messengers.

And you wonder why you're not getting along with the Christians here? That Jesus is God is literally the most fundamental doctrine of orthodox Christianity.

 

[Faithfulservant]

That's why I affirm what I said is that they called Jesus a liar. I don't care what you believe but twisting scripture to say that wasn't His claim IS calling Him a liar.

 

[TheLightWithin]

According to the experts AI will gain singularity by 2037.. if that's the case I hope the bible is right or there won't be a mankind much longer after that. I watched one clip that said he would put his human friends in human zoos so he could visit them.

Which experts? Do you believe them?
AI is something all right. But where will they be if they do get self assertive and people get sick of them and disconnect them from a power source whenever they become inconvenient?

 

[TheLightWithin]

Wow...ok, fair enough, perhaps I should not write about white males and the bigotry they face on a daily basis?

I earned the right to talk about educated idiots. I'm surrounded by them, but for the grace of G!d, there go I.

I would like to believe the continuing tenor of my posts speaks for itself. I cruised through my degree as a self taught person, for all the good that did me. All I got out of the deal was bragging rights and a student loan.

I didn't know you were talking about whites, males, or bigotry.
I thought you were grumbling anti-intellectualism.
And you didn't really address any of what I pointed out

 

[TheLightWithin]

The only recent new religion that doesn't reference Jesus is L. Ron Hubbard's Scientology. At least he deserves credit for creative originality inventing his new tax exempt religion, lol

I think of Eckankar, Ananda, Asatru, Wicca, Neo Pagans, and Falun Gong...

Self edit I see this was addressed in another post, also I think Ananda though Eastern was one of those that did make reference to Jesus

 

[juantoo3]

I didn't know you were talking about whites, males, or bigotry.
I thought you were grumbling anti-intellectualism.
And you didn't really address any of what I pointed out

Oh, I answered, indirectly.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Both Baha'u'llah and His partner in all the worlds of God, Ásíyih K͟hánum were known as the Father of the Poor and the Mother of Consolation for their extraordinary generosity and regard for the impoverished.

They lost everything when Baha'u'llah became a Bab'i, but their generosity never lessened and this never changed after Baha'u'llah declared his Station.

Baha'u'llah and Abdul'baha passed away without any personal possessions or wealth. They both had given all they could to the Cause, a Cause that God had given to Baha'u'llah to spread universally.

Followers can give their choicest labels to whom they follow.

I do not think Bahaollah lost everything when he became a Babi. Iranians and Ottoman considered him to be from a good family and were lenient towards him. Moreover, what Bahaollah owned may have been bought by Iranian Bahais and money given to him in Akka. Such transactions are common.

None carries his wealth when dead, everyone goes empty-handed. Whatever Bahaollah owned went to Abbas and whatever Abbas owned went to Shoghi.

 

[RJM]

I see people could consider to tackle the hard questions.

There was a valid interpretation of scripture posted that shows it is very plausible and reasonable that Muhammad is indeed foretold in the Bible, that the Beast was what became the Empire of Islam, a Faith built upon a broken Covernant, this also reflected in the Bible as the Two Witnesses that gave Prophecy for 1260 years but as dead bodies laying in the street.

If anyone would like to explore that as a possible truth given in the Bible, then the Absolute Truth of this may become manifested.

Regards Tony

I guarantee I can Google up a million other different interpretations of Revelations 13 and the mark of the beast. And of the sack people

The Beast (Revelation) - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Nero was a likely candidate ...

 

[muhammad_isa]

I believe in an afterlife, but I do not believe in hell..

Mmm .. I was raised C of E, and we did not talk about hell.
All our talk was about G-d's Kingdom, and going to heaven.

It might be convenient to avoid what Jesus said about those people who will
not directly enter the Kingdom of G-d, but is it reality?
Is the Catholic faith wrong to teach the concept of "fear of G-d"?
I think not .. the Qur'an teaches similarly..

There is pleasure and pain in this world, and we will all obviously try to avoid pain,
and G-d, in His guidance, teaches us what we must do to avoid it in the life hereafter.

..and that includes the remainder of this life as well !

 

[muhammad_isa]

Sorry, Tony, we're going to have to agree to disagree. Jesus claimed to be God Himself. Fully God.

I think not.
Naturally, I believe that the Qur'an is an authentic scripture from G-d..
..but putting that aside, there are many Christians who do not think that Jesus is "fully God".
One has to study the background and understand how Christianity evolved in a non-Aramaic
speaking population.
There are many verses in the Gospels that point to the Jewishness of Jesus, and that He worshipped G-d and not Himself!

Whereas ask any faithful Muslim, they would be horrified at the idea of Mohammed claiming himself God in any way.

Any Jew or Muslim realises that human beings are G-d's creation.
They know through the scriptures, that He sent prophets and pious Kings,
in order to guide mankind.
Why would G-d send "Himself" to apparently die on a cross?
[Of course, G-d cannot die, as He is eternal]

G-d allowed John the Baptist to die, he was beheaded.
..and G-d knows best.

 

[muhammad_isa]

..That Jesus is God is literally the most fundamental doctrine of orthodox Christianity.

Yes! Orthodox Christianity was established and enforced by the Roman Empire.
They are the ones that "adopted" Jesus .. Constantine was not particularly pious as an Emperor..
..but through fear of G-d, got himself baptised just before his death..
..as an ARIAN !

In any case .. G-d knew that mankind would have multiple creeds..
He knows what he created .. our nature.
..and when Jesus returns, as a SAVIOUR .. to save us from the apocalypse,
anybody who denies the creed he teaches, will not be accepted by G-d.
He will unite believers from all nations.

 

[Faithfulservant]

Oh boy I knew you would pipe in.

 

[Faithfulservant]

Matthew 14:33
And those who were in the boat worshiped Him, saying, “You are certainly God’s Son!”

Matthew 28:9 And behold, Jesus met them and greeted them. And they came up and took hold of His feet and worshiped Him.

They worshiped Him at His feet. He allowed it because He was worthy.

Luke 22:70–71
And they all said, “Are You the Son of God, then?” And He said to them, “Yes, I am.” Then they said, “What further need do we have of testimony? For we have heard it ourselves from His own mouth.”

this is why they arrested Him because this claim that He was making.

Mark gives more detail of this in 14:62–64. When Jesus answered them, the high priest tore his clothes and declared this was blasphemy.

What would be the greatest blasphemy? Declaring Himself God.

In John 10, Jesus again claims to be one with the Father. The Jews question Him, and His answers again elicit an attempt to stone Him. Jesus asks them for which of His good works they want to kill Him. They answer, “It is not for a good work that we are going to stone you but for blasphemy, because you, being a man, make yourself God.” And they attempted to arrest Him, but Jesus escaped.

In Mark 2, Jesus heals the paralytic man and forgives his sins. The scribes who were there called this blasphemy because only God has authority to forgive sins

John tells us directly that Jesus was making Himself equal with God. Since there was only one God, this was claiming to be God. In John 5, Jesus heals a man on the Sabbath and the Jewish leaders question Jesus about this violation of the law. Jesus claims authority over the Sabbath.

Jesus uses the title “I AM,” the name God uses for Himself when answering Moses in Exodus 3:14. The reaction of the Pharisees confirms this is precisely what Jesus was claiming because they tried to stone Him for blasphemy.

Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I am.” So they picked up stones to throw at him, but Jesus hid himself and went out of the temple.

They knew what He was claiming that's why they wanted to kill Him. Jesus uses a very specific title that Jews understood was ascribed only to God.

Monotheism was the central tenet of Judaism. They confessed the Shema from Deuteronomy 6:4: “Hear oh Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is one.” There is only one God, and Jesus, as a good Jew, believed this. He also claimed to accurately teach the Old Testament. So when Jesus answered Philip that to see Him was to see the Father, this was a claim to deity.

He never directly said I am God. I don't know why.. it's not for me to know but I believe it has something to do with believing by Faith. We believe Jesus is God. You can twist up Christian scripture however you want for your religion but I will call you out on it.