I believe in good!

[otherbrother]

Back on topic more directly: What's What's good to believe?

Not taking life is good.
Not taking what's not given is good.
Not conducting wrongly in fleshly manners is good.
Not speaking what's not true is good.
Not speaking with intention to break beloved apart is good.
Not speaking using harsh and ugly words is good.
Not speaking on useless topics is good.
No greedy intention is good.
No harmfull intention is good.
No deluded intention is good.

And the base of all good is right view, e.g believing that good doing merits, is good.

Once in this right wheel, it's a spiral upwardly. Once out of this wheel, downwardly.

“Good” seems connected to that which is sustainable in terms of helping humans in general survive and thrive. Probably also closely related to the concepts of growth and actualization of potential, as both aid in survival and wellness/prosperity almost along the lines of the sports adage “the best defense is good offense.” And these concepts require an understanding of dynamics, interactions of multiple factors over time. I think the Biblical prophecy of the “Tree of Life” was about a stage of knowledge development in which we understand life’s dynamics. It’s “good” to have an open mind that can figure out how things interact. The prefrontal cortex plays a big role. It’s good to use it so we don’t lose it (its functionality, and possibly even its structural integrity?) .

 

[Dhammañāṇa Bhikkhu]

“Good” seems connected to that which is sustainable in terms of helping humans in general survive and thrive. Probably also closely related to the concepts of growth and actualization of potential, as both aid in survival and wellness/prosperity almost along the lines of the sports adage “the best defense is good offense.” And these concepts require an understanding of dynamics, interactions of multiple factors over time. I think the Biblical prophecy of the “Tree of Life” was about a stage of knowledge development in which we understand life’s dynamics. It’s “good” to have an open mind that can figure out how things interact. The prefrontal cortex plays a big role. It’s good to use it so we don’t lose it (its functionality, and possibly even its structural integrity?) .

Good householder,
it's important to understand that beings are heir of their own deeds. It's not really possible to help others to do the right thing to gain than fruits. One can, for example, give something own, but it's total in the sphere of the other one whether able to take and able to make use. Teachings about right and wrong likewise.
It's not required, not even possible to see through the net of cause and effect, yet it's total enough to have strong faith in doing good. What ever doesn't harm another, has no intent for such, is already the highest gift one can give.
Doing good has to be taken on trust till a certain state of mind is gained to see it's effect clearly by oneself.

It's good to have strong faith that the gain of a human birth, not stupid, near of people of integrity, is the effect of having done good in the past, would came along if not, and knowing the worth of one's heritage, one doesn't waste it off, but makes more and refined from it.

 

[otherbrother]

Good householder,
Naivety or illusion, not knowing, isn't a protection, but not only a fault but the root cause of suffering.
If once joy is beyond craving for sensuality, when one is freed from the bonds in the sensual world, when ever breaking apart from this world, would be a matter of worry at all.
Not being related to something beyond sensuality, breaking apart is hard.

Sensuality is related to reaction. If only an understanding of surface and fairly static qualities of ordinary physical reality, we tend to react to whatever things come our way. But if we can sense underlying patterns and begin to more reliably predict outcomes, then we can RESPOND and be effective co-creators of “reality,” life. We can be what Abraham Maslow called “self actualizers.” But any given “self” in this relatively broken up world is incomplete, lacking wholeness, high integration (and, therefore high “integrity”), and quantum coherence. So love, the ability to reach into an other, helps restore the quantum entangled nature of a deeper reality behind/within the surface characteristics of ordinary physical “reality.” Loving an other is a connection to the so called “other (deeper?) side.”

 

[Dhammañāṇa Bhikkhu]

Sensuality is related to reaction. If only an understanding of surface and fairly static qualities of ordinary physical reality, we tend to react to whatever things come our way. But if we can sense underlying patterns and begin to more reliably predict outcomes, then we can RESPOND and be effective co-creators of “reality,” life. We can be what Abraham Maslow called “self actualizers.” But any given “self” in this relatively broken up world is incomplete, lacking wholeness, high integration (and, therefore high “integrity”), and quantum coherence. So love, the ability to reach into an other, helps restore the quantum entangled nature of a deeper reality behind/within the surface characteristics of ordinary physical “reality.” Loving an other is a connection to the so called “other (deeper?) side.”

...and a good tool to neglect to see one's own fault, to restrain, and to work out own defilement...
Just believe in good doing, good householder. Who ever focus on fruits or is eager in this or that creation, naturally tends to forget himself, doesn't see the harm for himself and others, delight in any object other than be aware of his bodily, verbal and mental deeds.

Believing in good is not going after desired, but simply puting doing good always above ideas and desire. It's a secure fence.

 

[otherbrother]

...and a good tool to neglect to see one's own fault, to restrain, and to work out own defilement...
Just believe in good doing, good householder. Who ever focus on fruits or is eager in this or that creation, naturally tends to forget himself, doesn't see the harm for himself and others, delight in any object other than be aware of his bodily, verbal and mental deeds.

Believing in good is not going after desired, but simply puting doing good always above ideas and desire. It's a secure fence.

The notion of an individual “self” is, of course, real, but LESS real than interconnectedness. From a collective unconscious source of knowledge, in which we are interconnected beings (“spiritual”) more than we are isolated beings, “good” means what allows that deeper nature to become implanted in, integrated with, surface reality. With depth integration comes sustainable moral action. Morality emerging from spirituality, instead of a morality without deep roots. “The wise man built his house upon the Rock (upon a deep convergent base of overall reality.)”
An overall reality that has depth is a concept that functions as though it were true/real, even though we have no precise way of discerning ultimate reality because it remains partly beyond our ability to comprehend. But if it bears “good fruit,” then it is at least a meaningful myth that is worth keeping. That’s my (metaphysical) story, and I’m sticking to it!
And I’m not on an isolated philosophical/theological island with that metaphysical notion. The Eastern (Veda?) concepts of Causal, Subtle, and Gross “bodies conforms to an overall reality with depth. Deepest zone being Causal, Mind. Intermediate zone being Subtle energy (quantum), And surface reality being (where “classical objects,” a quantum theory term, reside) Gross.

 

[Dhammañāṇa Bhikkhu]

The notion of an individual “self” is, of course, real, but LESS real than interconnectedness. From a collective unconscious source of knowledge, in which we are interconnected beings (“spiritual”) more than we are isolated beings, “good” means what allows that deeper nature to become implanted in, integrated with, surface reality. With depth integration comes sustainable moral action. Morality emerging from spirituality, instead of a morality without deep roots, “The wise man built his house upon the Rock (upon a deep convergent base of overall reality.)”
It’s a metaphysical concept that functions as though it were true/real, even though we have no precise way of discerning ultimate reality because it remains partly beyond our ability to comprehend. But if it bears “good fruit,” then it is at least a meaningful myth that is worth keeping. That’s my (metaphysical) story, and I’m sticking to it!

So let's make a rock out of mythos, put things upright:

Right Virtue, moral, good householder, is rooted in right resolve.

And what is right resolve? "Being resolved on renunciation, on freedom from ill-will, on harmlessness: This is called right resolve.”

Right resolve is rooted in right view.

What's right view?
There is the case where a certain person is not covetous. He does not covet the belongings of others, thinking, 'O, that what belongs to others would be mine!' He bears no ill will and is not corrupt in the resolves of his heart. [He thinks,] 'May these beings be free from animosity, free from oppression, free from trouble, and may they look after themselves with ease!' He has right view and is not warped in the way he sees things: 'There is what is given, what is offered, what is sacrificed. There are fruits & results of good & bad actions. There is this world & the next world. There is mother & father. There are spontaneously reborn beings; there are brahmans & contemplatives who, faring rightly & practicing rightly, proclaim this world & the next after having directly known & realized it for themselves.'
Eg. gratitude, seeing goodness, debts, sacrifices.

Right view is rooted in faith.
Faith is rooted in right, good association.

Sro wrong association leads to lack of faith (in liberating, good), lack of faith to wrong view, wrong view to wrong resolve, wrong resolve to wrong virtue, wrong virtue to wrong effort... wrong mindfulness, ...wrong concentration, ... wrong (no) release.

 

[Yahweh kid]

I believe the world is evolving to a more peaceful place...

Only till the next big war. Global peacefulness has been declining for years now.

 

[Dhammañāṇa Bhikkhu]

Only till the next big war. Global peacefulness has been declining for years now.

Till? No place not at war, and largest ongoing slayings of life everywhere. Hardly an ace not made plane. Blindness in regard of suffering is amazing.

What do blind think why there are people going after spirituality? Because there can be even such as heavens in the sensual world?

The naive believe of peace in it is the end of any spirituality and by it just increase of conflict.

 

[Yahweh kid]

Till? No place not at war, and largest ongoing slayings of life everywhere.

I agree, but I believe there were more people killed in past wars than today, but that could change in a blink of an eye. Nuclear is no toy.

 

[Dhammañāṇa Bhikkhu]

I agree, but I believe there were more people killed in past wars than today, but that could change in a blink of an eye. Nuclear is no toy.

Good householder might not see being aside of human one, as well as not seeing human killed even before leaving the womb. By far, far more humans are killed by their parents then in wars and what one sees as crime. It's to doubt that there had been time where more slaying of being and destroying on habitats had been done in visible past, and it's natural that such comes back.

And that labor is outsourced doesn't mean that burdens and misery aren't done for just that sake.

 

[Yahweh kid]

Good householder might not see being aside of human one, as well as not seeing human killed even before leaving the womb. By far, far more humans are killed by their parents then in wars and what one sees as crime. It's to doubt that there had been time where more slaying of being and destroying on habitats had been done in visible past, and it's natural that such comes back.

And that labor is outsourced doesn't mean that burdens and misery aren't done for just that sake.

I do believe we are living in an evil world, but hopefully the good will conquer the darkness of this world at some time. Christians believe that this will happen when Jesus Christ comes back to rule. True peace will be present.

 

[otherbrother]

So let's make a rock out of mythos, put things upright:

Right Virtue, moral, good householder, is rooted in right resolve.

And what is right resolve? "Being resolved on renunciation, on freedom from ill-will, on harmlessness: This is called right resolve.”

Right resolve is rooted in right view.

What's right view?
There is the case where a certain person is not covetous. He does not covet the belongings of others, thinking, 'O, that what belongs to others would be mine!' He bears no ill will and is not corrupt in the resolves of his heart. [He thinks,] 'May these beings be free from animosity, free from oppression, free from trouble, and may they look after themselves with ease!' He has right view and is not warped in the way he sees things: 'There is what is given, what is offered, what is sacrificed. There are fruits & results of good & bad actions. There is this world & the next world. There is mother & father. There are spontaneously reborn beings; there are brahmans & contemplatives who, faring rightly & practicing rightly, proclaim this world & the next after having directly known & realized it for themselves.'
Eg. gratitude, seeing goodness, debts, sacrifices.

Right view is rooted in faith.
Faith is rooted in right, good association.

Sro wrong association leads to lack of faith (in liberating, good), lack of faith to wrong view, wrong view to wrong resolve, wrong resolve to wrong virtue, wrong virtue to wrong effort... wrong mindfulness, ...wrong concentration, ... wrong (no) release.

A lot harder to not be something than to be it though. The “spiritual” approach to morality is based on what might be called “Breathable Being.” The base of moral action is closer to loving intent than right thinking, although certainly not antithetical to right thinking. And love and interconnected being is more sensed than thought. But sensed at a very deep (closer to Ultimate Reality, God) level. Yes, sense and sensuous can be superficial and fickle. But deeply sensed being is the most trustworthy and transformative “rock” in my opinion. But right thinking might also lead to whole being because it helps avoid psychologically and physically unhealthy behaviors and situations. The upward spiral you seemed to describe.

 

[otherbrother]

If I read you right (and that’s a big if!), you prefer a more left brain approach, and I a more right brain approach. But of course we need BOTH. So maybe our views complement each other’s?

 

[otherbrother]

By virtue of God/Good, the Cosmos has order and purpose and meaning, but is itself limited and contingent by its imperfections inherent in the material domain – at an extreme view, creation is 'a necessary evil' to catch and arrest the fall of the (eternal) soul from the contemplation of God/Good.

This certainly matches my own sense that we are here on assignment to pull creation towards the Godly good (or, if you like deities, a more Godly good) . Liked your comment that perhaps God is the face of good. Also interesting that, according to you, Plato saw Good as more transcendent yet than God. That seems similar to my thinking here. Why not tap into patterns or archetypes woven into Creation? Then if a sense of a divine being occurs, great. But why not focus on being divine, trusting that overall reality allows for that. Go for it! Don’t wait for a middle man.

 

[Craz]

Getting hit by a bus, dying, isn't a problem, yet deluded mind and wrong view, especially when abounding a good live gained, is. Even it dying on a cross.

@Dhammañāṇa Bhikkhu

This reminded me of someone I met in my home town who was dressed similarly to the "Jesus" in the video. So he told me that he left his wife, given up all his possessions including $300000 and came to my town(in UK) because God had told him to. He was the 2nd coming and he expected everyone to recognise him, which wasn't happening.

I listened to him attentively and said , "So, what you are really saying is that you would like me to give you 50pence for a cup of coffee". He nodded and I gave him a lot more than 50pence and told him to get some food, rest and go back to his wife. I also told to go to the American embassy to get a passport(he had give it away).
I never saw him again.

 

[Dhammañāṇa Bhikkhu]

@Dhammañāṇa Bhikkhu

This reminded me of someone I met in my home town who was dressed similarly to the "Jesus" in the video. So he told me that he left his wife, given up all his possessions including $300000 and came to my town(in UK) because God had told him to. He was the 2nd coming and he expected everyone to recognise him, which wasn't happening.

I listened to him attentively and said , "So, what you are really saying is that you would like me to give you 50pence for a cup of coffee". He nodded and I gave him a lot more than 50pence and told him to get some food, rest and go back to his wife. I also told to go to the American embassy to get a passport(he had give it away).
I never saw him again.

Sadhu, that's a good deed.

 

[otherbrother]

God must be reached by mystical experience.

The Arrival



“Your package has arrived.”

You asked, now receive.

Just go to your door.

It has arrived—

Not coming, ARRIVED,

Not being delivered by a

Savior or

Owner of the means of production.



Maybe though

Someone could offer an

Example of how to

Open your door,

Leave you feeling inspired,

Anointed?

Still, it’s left up to

YOU to open it.



In fact, the means of

Delivery

Means little.

If, however, you insist on

Knowing,

It’s a therapeutic game of

Simulation.

To play, imagine the

Door opening.

The game delivers

Your package,

Automatically, but in the most

Natural of ways,

By Mind Itself.



No middle man or woman

Needed.

No mailing or email

Address necessary,

No postal stamp,

No fee,

Not even the name of the

Recipient is required.

All bypassed.

Just play.



What is in your package?

No one knows exactly,

Not even you.

If you can’t handle THAT,

Don’t even check.

It would just act like a particle or a

Wave badly broken in a box.

All that is required is

Going to and through

Your Door.

Just play the game.

You’ll love it.

You’ll love.



It puts Reality TV

To shame.

No boss. No

Apprentice.

No framework or platform to

Preside over you.

This game has its own

New content.

It’s a hoot!

It’s a reboot.



Nothing diabolical;

No, it’s

Dialectical,

But played in the key of

Synthesis,

Recreating out of

Who knows where—

Thesis and

Antithesis

Just going along for the ride.

“Another dimension,

Another dimension”

Here, popping into, through

Creation,

As though it has a

Mind of its own,

And you don’t own it,

But it’s yours for free

Because it’s free.



Arrived.

 

[otherbrother]

For me ideals and peace cannot coexist, a pragmatism must be established such as freedom without harm to others.

You must choose peace over good to have the most good outcome.

Dao Yin, I was thinking today that perhaps the number one “good” thing is wholeness. When we individually or collectively are operating out of a base of wholeness (which may be what we mean by “God?”) the highest degree of positive potential can flow. Partness or brokenness tends to limit potential in the long run, even though it might lead to a temporary focus (blinders on) that seems effective, but it will lack sustainability, like the foolish man that builds his house upon the sand. Your emphasis on peace is very close to “wholeness,” because it seems to be the affect/feeling that signifies a state of wholeness. Also the spiritual concept of abundance is related to both wholeness and peace because when all the parts of a person or system are open to being used and therefore capable of acting with greater harmony (than if some parts had to compete/fight for a chance to be used), the of resources would lead to a feeling of grace and peace. “Relax, the system has an abundance of resources to deal with this particular life situation, no matter how difficult it may seem. This too would be associated with a sense that “God” (Wholeness?) will help us. So, add “faith” to the things connected to wholeness.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Live in your own make-believe world.

 

[otherbrother]

I find it amazing at times...the bliss ...the connection with the allness...that occurs when outward appearances when percieved circumstances aren't "good"

And then poetry comes out...

Bliss...awareness...circumambulation...

And scene

Yes, When “bad” outside, we can, and often DO, go deep inside to a convergent zone not clearly knowable that we may call “God.” The naturally convergent, interconnected, nature of that deep zone functions as a base of Wholeness which then can be applied to the brokenness and deficit/lack of the “bad” situation. Joy or happiness would be a feeling associated with resolution of the problems of brokenness or deficit/lack. Peace would be the feeling of operating consistently from the deep base of Wholeness. Should that be the case, then “bad” doesn’t seem as bad, since we have this sense that the wholeness will prevail, and the badness is less real than it appears to be at first glance. “God” is with us. And if we come to the conclusion that all things flow out of this base, out of Deep and Whole, then we are reassured that what we come to call “good” will prevail. But at some point we realize that the come and go “good” we experience on the surface is also less real than the wholeness and peace of the Deep.
The duality of good and bad kind of converges into something that is more real than either. From a struggling and suffering point of view that we have on the physical surface, this certainly would seem like a sustainable goodness (“Heaven?”). But if we learn to go deep, the good heaven is not a thing that will COME— it has already ARRIVED, now here. To the degree that we do this consistently, we bring heaven to earth. We recreate Creation into a more spiritual form. We integrate not only our individual in and out, but ALL in and out. We have done God’s, Deep’s, work.