Hi! Ready to be poked again?
Im not a scholar per se but i do have the ability to learn when applying myself. I wanted to go back to this as the Koine Greek is important in studying the NT. I use The Blue Letter Bible to do this and as its Saturday i had time to do this justice. Please forgive me as I'm doing this on my phone and its not the most efficent way to go between screens.
Im picking this post to reply to because im not up for tackeling the whole reasoning you provided. I dont follow a list of theologians and scholars as i believe the Holy Spirit will teach me what He wants me to know in my study of scripture. Also not wanting to be influenced by wrong teaching. I do find that learning Koine Greek helps me to understand nuances of what English fails to provide.
So what i found in the text provided below is that Aionios is also used to describe an everlasting God who is eternal as well as His Power His Glory the Holy Spirit etc... So it can mean eternal as listed in Strongs as used 42 times in the NT
As an example of eternal:
Mark 3:29 But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal G166 damnation:
Hebrews 6:2 Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal G166 judgment.
Jude 1:7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal G166 fire.
I so very much apologize for the exhaustive copy and paste below but i wanted to show what i was referencing for my points. I also added the strongs for aion as it is the root word and a link to see the quite lengthy Vines expository dictionary entry.
Vine's Expository Dictionary: View Entry
TDNT Reference: 1:208,31
Strong's Info
Strong’s Definitions
αἰώνιος aiṓnios, ahee-o'-nee-os; from
G165; perpetual (also used of past time, or past and future as well):—eternal, for ever, everlasting, world (began).
KJV Translation Count — Total: 71x
The KJV translates Strong's G166 in the following manner: eternal (42x),
everlasting (25x),
the world began (with G5550) (2x),
since the world began (with G5550) (1x),
for ever (1x).
Outline of Biblical Usage
Thayer's Greek Lexicon
Concordance Results
Vine's Expository Dictionary of New Testament Words
| 2 | Strong's Number: g166 | Greek: aionios |
Eternal:
"describes duration, either undefined but not endless, as in
Rom 16:25;
2Ti 1:9;
Tts 1:2; or undefined because endless as in
Rom 16:26, and the other sixty-six places in the NT.
"The predominant meaning of
aionios, that in which it is used everywhere in the NT, save the places noted above, may be seen in
2Cr 4:18, where it is set in contrast with
proskairos, lit., 'for a season,' and in
Phm 1:15, where only in the NT it is used without a noun.
Moreover it is used of persons and things which are in their nature endless, as, e.g., of God, Rom 16:26; of His power, 1Ti 6:16, and of His glory, 1Pe 5:10; of the Holy Spirit, Hbr 9:14; of the redemption effected by Christ, Hbr 9:12, and of the consequent salvation of men, Hbr 5:9, as well as of His future rule, 2Pe 1:11, which is elsewhere declared to be without end, Luk 1:33; of the life received by those who believe in Christ, Jhn 3:16, concerning whom He said, 'they shall never perish,' Jhn 10:28, and of the resurrection body, 2Cr 5:1, elsewhere said to be 'immortal,' 1Cr 15:53, in which that life will be finally realized, Mat 25:46; Tts 1:2.
"Aionios is also used of the sin that 'hath never forgiveness,' Mar 3:29, and of the judgment of God, from which there is no appeal, Hbr 6:2, and of the fire, which is one of its instruments, Mat 18:8; 25:41; Jud 1:7, and which is elsewhere said to be 'unquenchable,' Mar 9:43. "The use of aionios here shows that the punishment referred to in 2Th 1:9, is not temporary, but final, and, accordingly, the phraseology shows that its purpose is not remedial but retributive." * [* From Notes on Thessalonians by Hogg and Vine, pp. 232, 233.]
Strong’s Definitions
αἰώνιος aiṓnios, ahee-o'-nee-os; from G165; perpetual (also used of past time, or past and future as well):—eternal, for ever, everlasting, world (began).
KJV Translation Count — Total: 71x
The KJV translates Strong's G166 in the following manner: eternal (42x), everlasting (25x), the world began (with G5550) (2x), since the world began (with G5550) (1x), for ever (1x).
The Blue Letter Bible
Lexicon :: Strong's G165 - aiōn
Strong's
Red Letter
αἰών
Transliteration aiōn (Key)
Pronunciation ahee-ohn'Listen
Part of Speech masculine noun
Root Word (Etymology)
From the same as ἀεί (G104)
Greek Inflections of αἰών
Dictionary Aids
Vine's Expository Dictionary: View Entry
Strong's Info
Strong’s Definitions
αἰών aiṓn, ahee-ohn'; from the same as G104; properly, an age; by extension, perpetuity (also past); by implication, the world; specially (Jewish) a Messianic period (present or future):—age, course, eternal, (for) ever(-more), (n-)ever, (beginning of the , while the) world (began, without end). Compare G5550.
KJV Translation Count — Total: 128x
The KJV translates Strong's G165 in the following manner: ever (71x), world (38x), never (with G3364) (with G1519) (with G3588) (6x), evermore (4x), age (2x), eternal (2x), miscellaneous (5x).
G165 - αἰών aiṓn, ahee-ohn'; from the same as ; properly, an age; by extension, perpetuity (also past); by implication, the world; specially (Jewish) a Messianic period (present or future):—age, course, eternal, (for) ever(-more), (n-)ever, (beginning of the , while the) world (began, without...
www.blueletterbible.org
For Vines expository dictionary for aion
Matthew 25:46 And these will go away into eternal (
aionios) punishment (
kolasis), but the righteous (
fikaios) into eternal (
aionios) life."
The following is a heavily reduced note from Appendix I of "
A Larger Hope" by the theologian Ilaria Ramelli
Appendix I: The Meaning of Aionios
Terms for Eternity surveys the uses of two ancient Greek adjectives—aiénios and aidios, commonly translated as “eternal’—from their earliest occurrences in poetry and pre-Socratic philosophy down through the Septuagint (and a thorough comparison with the Hebrew Bible), the New Testament, and the Christian theologians, from the earliest to Maximus the Confessor (6th century).
The monograph examines the rise of the idea of infinitely extended time (generally denoted by aidios), and Plato’s innovative introduction of a concept of a timeless eternity, which in Platonic technical vocabulary—and only there—was denoted by aion, with aidnios meaning
“eternal” in the sense of “transcending time.”
In all the rest of Greek literature, however, and—what is most relevant to us here—in the Greek Bible, aionios has a wide range of meanings, but does not denote absolute eternity.
Since only aionios, and never aidios, is applied to the punishment of humans in the afterlife, Origen could find support in the biblical usage for
his doctrine of universal salvation and the finite duration of hell.
And so it goes on ...
basically the Greek term, translated as 'eternal', has a range of meanings, but eternal is not one of them. As an example, it derives from the noun aeon, which means age, but it was universally understood that such an age was usually dependent upon what was being talked about, and aeon in that regard meant a lifespan – the aeon of a Mayfly being a day, of humans 70 years ...
So what happened? The Latin used
eternus for
aeon – and that does mean eternity.
There's more interesting stuff, and if you want me to post more, I happily will, but don't want to bore you with stuff I find really, really interesting! Sorry, I'm a nerd in that sense ...
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I highlighted the greek for punishment,
kolasis, because that, too, is relevant.
Clement of Alexandria applied a distinction between
timoria and
kolasis – the first term implies a retributive punishment, whilst the latter is therapeutic punishment. Clement argues that God applies healing and refining punishments, but never retributive punishment – that is, God applies punishment towards a positive end, whereas retributive punishment is punishment for its own sake – revenge.
Clement, like his pupil Origen, and our brother-n-Christ
@wil, saw a distinction between the sinner and the sin. The latter must be hated, but the sinner must be loved, because they are God's creature. Origen and later St Gregory of Nyssa will go on to say that we all bear the image of God, which sin can occlude and cover, but never extinguish or cancel.
Basically the New Testament scribes and later theologians saw the punishment of sin as a kind of medical procedure, a healing process, a coming-to-the-light.
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Anyway, that's the start. Keep poking me, and I'll keep on responding.
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