Dor
Bible Thumper
Well you know I read lots on here and on liberal board that definately in no way honors God or promotes Christianity in fact Id say it does just the oposite.
Oh thats right me saying that is intolerant.
Well you know I read lots on here and on liberal board that definately in no way honors God or promotes Christianity in fact Id say it does just the oposite.
Oh thats right me saying that is intolerant.
juantoo3
....whys guy.... ʎʇıɹoɥʇnɐ uoıʇsǝnb
Why are you being this way Dor? Do you think for a moment I agree with everything everyone posts? I can just as easily walk away, or not read posts by certain people, or not participate, or take my gripes elsewhere and see how the grass at other online comparative religion forums is so much greener when there are no manners or mutual respect and tolerance.
Do I see things posted that I believe are hereical and anathema here? Yes. Should I separate myself from everyone here because of it? You tell me...how is that promoting peace, how is that peacemaking? That is apathy, and that is lukewarm spew.
C
cyberpi
Guest
Dor,
Are you saying that someone like me implies that you do not belong posting here, or are you saying that someone like me who reports that Jesus is not God with bible scripture... is posting in the wrong forum? Two very different concepts.
I consider that words only add and reflect mostly on the mind of the speaker of them, and that any and all opposing viewpoints are warranted. Yours included. Whether I think a belief is true or not, the existance of a belief is always in truth very real in someone's mind and in the world.
I have been called a spade, I think by yourself or FS, but I am resolute to not to dig up what I consider to be weeds. (nobody but moderator can) Good thing I'm not a moderator. Instead with every post I plant my own variety of thorny little roses... which I realize some people will see as weeds.
In my opinion, someone like mee or yourself has the opportunity to speak for themselves relative to identifying any unsporting or falsely authoritative comments. I find that mee and Silas are both confident in their beliefs and are not bothered by any rash unsporting or falsely authoritative comments. That said, I fully support the moderators or anyone to jump in, help identify them, or to say when they think any dissonance is clogging a bitstream.
Are you saying that someone like me implies that you do not belong posting here, or are you saying that someone like me who reports that Jesus is not God with bible scripture... is posting in the wrong forum? Two very different concepts.
I consider that words only add and reflect mostly on the mind of the speaker of them, and that any and all opposing viewpoints are warranted. Yours included. Whether I think a belief is true or not, the existance of a belief is always in truth very real in someone's mind and in the world.
I have been called a spade, I think by yourself or FS, but I am resolute to not to dig up what I consider to be weeds. (nobody but moderator can) Good thing I'm not a moderator. Instead with every post I plant my own variety of thorny little roses... which I realize some people will see as weeds.
In my opinion, someone like mee or yourself has the opportunity to speak for themselves relative to identifying any unsporting or falsely authoritative comments. I find that mee and Silas are both confident in their beliefs and are not bothered by any rash unsporting or falsely authoritative comments. That said, I fully support the moderators or anyone to jump in, help identify them, or to say when they think any dissonance is clogging a bitstream.
M
mee
Guest
so getting back to if God loves everybody,
God’s love is seen in the gift of His Son, I John 4:9, 10
M
mee
Guest
Furthermore, the world is passing away and so is its desire, but he that does the will of God remains forever. 1 John 2;17good counsel indeed
M
mee
Guest
those who do the will of God will remain forever.
In those early days of the Christian congregation, some had abandoned the light, some being disfellowshipped and others just drifting away to the darkness outside....Matthew 25:30; Philippians 3:18; Hebrews 2:1; 2 John 8-11. so 1 john is counsel indeed.
YO-ELEVEN-11
Watcher
Yep.
A parent will always love their children even if that child is the worse thing on the planet. The Love is always thier though.
S
Silas
Guest
I dont think we as fallen people really know what love is. Futhermore, to suggest that God loves Satan is not only ignore scripture, but to make light of God's infinite holiness.
YO-ELEVEN-11
Watcher
So I guess Jesus does not set the right example then.
Matthew 5:44
I think that it's not the satan that GOD hates, but "it's" action.
Proverbs 6:16-19.
I could be wrong though.
S
Silas
Guest
YO-ELEVEN-11
So I guess Jesus does not set the right example then.
Matthew 5:44
We ought to love our enemies. But, loving our enemies will not ensure that they will be forgiven and therefore saved. There are three reasons for loving our enemies in scripture:
1. It reflects God's grace. God loved His enemies by sending His Son to die for them.
2. Loving our enemies may lead to a sinner's salvation.
3. Loving our enemies may serve as a means for greater condemnation of the enemy who sees our love and still chooses to persecute us. "Indeed, more coals will be heaped upon his head."
I think that it's not the satan that GOD hates, but "it's" action.
Proverbs 6:16-19.
God does not love people the same. In fact, God hates all evildoers (Psa 5:5). That said, God does has a special covenantal love for all of his people in Christ. He loves them with an everlasting love (Jeremiah 31:3) and sent His Son into the world to give his life as a randsom for His bride, namely the Chruch, i.e., believers in the Lord Jesus Christ (Ephesians 5:25-27). The fact that God hates and the fact that we cannot understand why, lies within the fact that we are fallen people and are yet subject to sin's effects. The fact that God does hate people are seen throughout scriptures and yet we wrestle with it because we dont understnad it. Many read into the scriptures to try and make sense of it, but again, we have no real understanding. God's thoughts arent ours and our ways arent His - He is so much more higher; in fact, infinitely so. God hates because He is love. Anything opposite to His infinitly Holy and Loving nature is cause for His wrath, and rightly so! There is nothing in Satan to attract God's love, therefore God does not love Satan. Likewise, there is nothing in the sinner but sin, and if God loves one over another, for example, a Jacob over an Esau, it is because God has chosen to do so for His own name's sake and because He determined it good.
So I guess Jesus does not set the right example then.
Matthew 5:44
We ought to love our enemies. But, loving our enemies will not ensure that they will be forgiven and therefore saved. There are three reasons for loving our enemies in scripture:
1. It reflects God's grace. God loved His enemies by sending His Son to die for them.
2. Loving our enemies may lead to a sinner's salvation.
3. Loving our enemies may serve as a means for greater condemnation of the enemy who sees our love and still chooses to persecute us. "Indeed, more coals will be heaped upon his head."
I think that it's not the satan that GOD hates, but "it's" action.
Proverbs 6:16-19.
God does not love people the same. In fact, God hates all evildoers (Psa 5:5). That said, God does has a special covenantal love for all of his people in Christ. He loves them with an everlasting love (Jeremiah 31:3) and sent His Son into the world to give his life as a randsom for His bride, namely the Chruch, i.e., believers in the Lord Jesus Christ (Ephesians 5:25-27). The fact that God hates and the fact that we cannot understand why, lies within the fact that we are fallen people and are yet subject to sin's effects. The fact that God does hate people are seen throughout scriptures and yet we wrestle with it because we dont understnad it. Many read into the scriptures to try and make sense of it, but again, we have no real understanding. God's thoughts arent ours and our ways arent His - He is so much more higher; in fact, infinitely so. God hates because He is love. Anything opposite to His infinitly Holy and Loving nature is cause for His wrath, and rightly so! There is nothing in Satan to attract God's love, therefore God does not love Satan. Likewise, there is nothing in the sinner but sin, and if God loves one over another, for example, a Jacob over an Esau, it is because God has chosen to do so for His own name's sake and because He determined it good.
C
cyberpi
Guest
Silas, at best you sound to me like a member of the Westboro Baptist Church.
YO-ELEVEN-11
Watcher
Well you did ask me what I thought and believed.
I can only tell you what I "think" and "believe".
Something puzzles me though.
What do you mean by this statement?
Is that the same thing as "someone" or "something" you love to hate?
S
Silas
Guest
What I meant by that statement is basically this: God is Love, therefore He hates anything opposite to most perfect attribute. For instance, a person who has a great love for children cannot and will not, love child molestors.
C
cyberpi
Guest
Silas, perhaps if you could find a way to divide the person (or soul) from the act or the sin within your vernacular. Surely a person can change?
S
Silas
Guest
"[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Can the Ethiopian change his skin, or the leopard his spots? then may ye also do good, that are accustomed to do evil" (Jer 13:23).
The problem with man acording to the Bible, is that He is born dead in sins and alienated from God. He is a slave to his sin nature and though he can be moral and do good, he cannot do any good in the spiritual realm (where God is concerned). Therefore, change is not in man's best interest, he needs more - He needs a ressurrection. As Jesus put it, "unless a man is 'born again' he cannot see the kingdom of God."
[/FONT]
C
cyberpi
Guest
Silas,
I suggest that Jesus was able to separate a person from his sin... he took a sinner and forgave him. Not just any sinner, but those who sought forgiveness. Is it Love to forgive, and was the sinner separated from his sin? As I see it, Jesus loved a sinner, forgave a sinner, and separated a person from his sin. Was a person not healed for it?
While that vernacular might be different, are YOU able to separate a person from his sin? If you can't then I see something missing. I'm not advising against rebuking what you think is wrong and I'm not advising forgiving freely, but when you are personally wronged can you separate a person from his sin... to love a person? I submit that it is important to repent, but also important to forgive.
Silas do you think that Jesus was born again prior to physical death and resurrection, or that Jesus was in the kingdom of God while walking on Earth? It seems like seeing heaven and being there are two different things... do you agree?
I suggest that Jesus was able to separate a person from his sin... he took a sinner and forgave him. Not just any sinner, but those who sought forgiveness. Is it Love to forgive, and was the sinner separated from his sin? As I see it, Jesus loved a sinner, forgave a sinner, and separated a person from his sin. Was a person not healed for it?
While that vernacular might be different, are YOU able to separate a person from his sin? If you can't then I see something missing. I'm not advising against rebuking what you think is wrong and I'm not advising forgiving freely, but when you are personally wronged can you separate a person from his sin... to love a person? I submit that it is important to repent, but also important to forgive.
Silas do you think that Jesus was born again prior to physical death and resurrection, or that Jesus was in the kingdom of God while walking on Earth? It seems like seeing heaven and being there are two different things... do you agree?
S
Silas
Guest
I suggest that Jesus was able to separate a person from his sin... he took a sinner and forgave him. Not just any sinner, but those who sought forgiveness. Is it Love to forgive, and was the sinner separated from his sin? As I see it, Jesus loved a sinner, forgave a sinner, and separated a person from his sin. Was a person not healed for it?
What do you mean by "separate a person from his sin?" Do you mean that Christ changed a sinner into a saint by granting him repentance and faith, or something else?
While that vernacular might be different, are YOU able to separate a person from his sin? If you can't then I see something missing. I'm not advising against rebuking what you think is wrong and I'm not advising forgiving freely, but when you are personally wronged can you separate a person from his sin... to love a person? I submit that it is important to repent, but also important to forgive.
I agree with you. It is of the utmost importance to forgive! God, however, doesnt forgive just because He's good. He says that He will by no means clear the guilty and that justice must be met. Therfore, in Love and Justice, God put forth Christ as the atoning scrifice for sinners. Christ suffered God's wrath to both show God's justice, and to justifiy sinner's through Him. "Whosoever will believe upon Him, shall not perish."
Silas do you think that Jesus was born again prior to physical death and resurrection, or that Jesus was in the kingdom of God while walking on Earth? It seems like seeing heaven and being there are two different things... do you agree?
I believe that Jesus is God. Christ said, "Before Abraham was, I am." Christ is eternal, he has no begining and end. In fact, He is the begining and end. All things were created by Him and for Him. All things are sustained by His power and He is governing the universe by the word of His power. He is God!
What do you mean by "separate a person from his sin?" Do you mean that Christ changed a sinner into a saint by granting him repentance and faith, or something else?
While that vernacular might be different, are YOU able to separate a person from his sin? If you can't then I see something missing. I'm not advising against rebuking what you think is wrong and I'm not advising forgiving freely, but when you are personally wronged can you separate a person from his sin... to love a person? I submit that it is important to repent, but also important to forgive.
I agree with you. It is of the utmost importance to forgive! God, however, doesnt forgive just because He's good. He says that He will by no means clear the guilty and that justice must be met. Therfore, in Love and Justice, God put forth Christ as the atoning scrifice for sinners. Christ suffered God's wrath to both show God's justice, and to justifiy sinner's through Him. "Whosoever will believe upon Him, shall not perish."
Silas do you think that Jesus was born again prior to physical death and resurrection, or that Jesus was in the kingdom of God while walking on Earth? It seems like seeing heaven and being there are two different things... do you agree?
I believe that Jesus is God. Christ said, "Before Abraham was, I am." Christ is eternal, he has no begining and end. In fact, He is the begining and end. All things were created by Him and for Him. All things are sustained by His power and He is governing the universe by the word of His power. He is God!