Changing Sexual Orientation Is Possible, New Research Says

Ive been reading these posts and I am puzzled.......

BobX I didnt think you were sick and needed any scientists or medical help to overcome you r condition. ......... You are doing just fine, I reckon. If you are sick go to the doctors but if not mate, just ignore the people trying to "cure" you and enjoy your life as you know it was meant to be lived. To me homosexuality isnt a disease just as me being a self opinionated middle aged brunette isnt a disease. its me. and I like me.LOL
 
Homosexuality Is It A Sin?

I know this thread may seem controversal and some may be offended by what might be said in this thread. But i do think this is something that has to be discussed...

The purpose of this thread is not to single out or come down upon homosexuals. I have never written a thread entitled: "Is Stealing a Sin for New Testament Believers?" or, "Is Bearing False Witness a Sin?" or, "Is Murder a Sin?" So why "homosexuality? Because more and more, the media, entertainment, the government, the Church, the general population the world, no longer believes it is a sin to be discriminated against, whereas even the basest of nations have laws against stealing, false witness, and murder.

So, my purpose here is not to judge, but to specifically establish whether homosexuality is a sin or not a sin for Believers in Christ under the New Covenant.

Over the years I have received some bizarre reasons from the gay community regarding why they don't think homosexuality is a sin. Here is an example I received from a self-professed lesbian:

"Also, don't you find it interesting that when Jesus walked the earth, he never once brought up the subject? If it was such a sin, it would be one of the Ten Commandments, don't you think?"

No, I don't think so at all.

Jesus did not address child-molestation either; neither is it one of the Ten Commandments. Neither did Jesus address drug abuse, nor pornography, smoking, spousal abuse, or torture. Does this fact therefore condone such sins and atrocities? Are we to assume therefore that none of these are wrong or sinful? I hope we are not foolish enough to believe that if something is not mentioned in the Bible, then it shouldn't be considered a sin.

"For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even [1] their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: And likewise also [2] the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompense [penalty] of their error which was meet [due]" (Rom. 1:26-27).

When Isaiah tells us to:

"Cry aloud, spare not, lift up your voice like a trumpet, and show my people their transgression, and the house of Jacob their sins" (Isa. 58:1).

Should I just keep my mouth shut on this subject?
 
Re: Homosexuality Is It A Sin?

Homosexuals are going to fry like a Frito in the skillet of Hades. The Bible is clear on that. So the only question left concerns how one should treat a person who is destined for the Lake of Fire. Are they a neighbor who we have to, however begrudgingly love? They're surely not bretheren. Of course the Golden Rule applies to all. Does it depend on their level of penitence? Should we encourage them with the carrot of our kindness so long as they seem penitent? Is their punishment lessened by penitence which fails to change their behavior? If they mean well, and are trying their best to go straight, but die having been unable to because of their own weakness of will, do they get any kind of a break? To what extent are we commanded, or bound to exhort them? At what point do exhortations become stumbling blocks?

What, then, should we do? What is the reasonable limit of our duty toward recidivist sinners? We know what they should do, but what are our obligations toward them?

Chris
 
Re: Homosexuality Is It A Sin?

How are we to be sexually gratified? Here's the Scriptural teaching.

"For I would that all men were even as I myself. But every man hath his proper gift of God, one after this manner, and another after that. I say therefore to the unmarried and widows, it is good for them if they abide even as I. But if they cannot contain [remain sexually pure and virtuous], let them marry: for it is better to marry than to burn [Gk: puroo-'inflamed with lust']" (I Cor. 7:7-9).

So what would the homosexual say to this? Well at least some of them would totally agree. Why do you think that they are trying to get same-sex marriage legalized? Yes, they would agree with Paul-let's get MARRIED.

Back up a few verses for God's answer as to who should be married to whom:

"Nevertheless, to avoid fornication [Gk: porneia], let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband" (I Cor. 7:2).

Heterosexual men are just as weak when it comes to lusting after women, as homosexuals are when it comes to lusting after members of the same gender. The ONLY way that I know of to break these sins and have victory over them is for God to empower you with a greater motivation to live righteously than to live un-righteously. If what you desire to be is "good," then there is only One Source:

"And also that every man should eat and drink, and enjoy the good of all his labor, It is the gift of God" (Ecc. 3:13).

"EVERY good gift and EVERY perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning" (James 1:17).

We will continue to pray for all those who desire to come out of the bondage and slavery of "...the sin which does so easily beset us...." (Heb. 12:1).​
 
Re: Homosexuality Is It A Sin?

Azure24 said:
I know this thread may seem controversal and some may be offended by what might be said in this thread. But i do think this is something that has to be discussed...
Click to expand...
This subject has been discussed already, many many times, even very recently. So recently there is the temptation to merge this with that most recent thread just to keep from clogging the board with this one subject that seems to consume some people's minds. Or perhaps we should make a board dedicated to this subject alone?

For or against ultimately doesn't matter- guide your life in the manner you deem most wise. It is not for a man to judge another anyway, certainly not to act as jury and executioner.

Otherwise, let it go. Just let it go. Let G-d do the judging.

Let's argue about the evolution vs creation debate instead...
 
Re: Homosexuality Is It A Sin?

I agree. I think we should just merge it with the already very long recent homosexuality thread. It gets tiring for the rest of us to respond over and over.
 
That was a sh itty thing to do Juan. Azure's thread wasn't spam, and it didn't violate any of the terms of service. It's just that you're personally bored with a perennial topic, so you took it upon yourself, in your imperial wisdom, to spare the old timers yet another thread on the topic of homosexuality. Are we now the walled garden of the old farts? I still remember how I was treated when I arrived here. I see not much has changed. You people don't understand what customer service means. You think this forum is your private coffee clutch. What a crock of sh it.

Chris
 
OK, that's two for, and one against. Any more votes?

Yes, I'm personally bored with the topic. I'd guess I'm not the only one.

That and the fact that most of the relevent information is already in this other thread for anybody who cares to look, including the views of the "other" side, it seemed to me right to bring it all together.

If I goofed, it wouldn't be the first time. I can't please everyone so I don't even try anymore.
 
Re: Homosexuality Is It A Sin?

China Cat Sunflower said:
Homosexuals are going to fry like a Frito in the skillet of Hades. The Bible is clear on that. So the only question left concerns how one should treat a person who is destined for the Lake of Fire. Are they a neighbor who we have to, however begrudgingly love? They're surely not bretheren. Of course the Golden Rule applies to all. Does it depend on their level of penitence? Should we encourage them with the carrot of our kindness so long as they seem penitent? Is their punishment lessened by penitence which fails to change their behavior? If they mean well, and are trying their best to go straight, but die having been unable to because of their own weakness of will, do they get any kind of a break? To what extent are we commanded, or bound to exhort them? At what point do exhortations become stumbling blocks?

What, then, should we do? What is the reasonable limit of our duty toward recidivist sinners? We know what they should do, but what are our obligations toward them?

Chris
Click to expand...

Dude. Are you being ironic here? I just can't tell.
 
You don't understand Juan. You effectively killed the thread. Look at the front page of Christianity. Do all of these topics have a burning importance which demands the removal of yet another Homosexuality topic? Threads which generate no interest naturally slide off the front page never to be seen again. Why then would you exert an extra effort to remove a topic which is perfectly "legal" and appropriate under the COC? Are you now the style editor?

Look, I'm not unaware of the pattern of the poster's recent threads. It's the same-o-same-o-same-o to death. I'm tired of those seven or eight topics too. But I invested a post because sometimes I have a little extra to toss off at lost causes. Look, I get pissed when my posts are moved. If you guys blogged on the political scene you'd understand. Page exposure and timing are everything, and you get predatory about it because it's a fast game. If you want to keep attracting people here you have to accept that it's an ever present present, and these perennial digs at Christianity are forever going to be a part of people's introductory process into the dialog. There has to be a way for newbies to constantly come on board and talk about newbie things. Get it straight: we want new people. We need to accommodate them. We can't expect them to settle for being referred to our previous discussions. They want to talk about things that are just now occurring to them. The interfaith conversation starts from absolute zero every day. Stop being a Pharisee.

Chris
 
Well, Juan and Chris and everyone else, here's my input, for what it's worth:

This is quite a long thread to wade through on the topic, and if you are just coming to it or just starting to post on homosexuality, it may be a bit much to be asked to read and digest. Not to mention quite a bit of it is digressions and personal attacks and unsavory bits. A new start on the topic with a slightly different focus wouldn't be such a bad idea.
 
Re: Homosexuality Is It A Sin?

Pathless said:
Dude. Are you being ironic here? I just can't tell.
Click to expand...

The Bible says that homosexuals are going to hell. I can dig up the verse if you want it. So I'm asking how Christians feel about how they should treat people who they know are going to hell. Do they fall under the "love your enemies" clause? Are they a "neighbor"? What do these things actually mean in the real world? This has a practical application. Let's say you have a gay family member. Now you may be stuck in a conundrum where you cannot, in good conscience, condone their activities, and you feel compelled to testify to what is right, but you find that overt judgmentalism is pushing them away. How do you find that happy medium between speaking up for what is right and not alienating the audience? That begs the question of when can one just love and not be remiss in their duty to the truth? I think that a lot of people are torn apart trying to find the answer to this question.

Chris
 
If one thinks that a homosexual act is sin (myself I do not think so in and of itself), I think there are lots of principles that override the "duty to tell the truth." Judge not, take the log out of your own eye, him without sin cast the first stone, mercy not sacrifice, and above all love your neighbor.
 
Hi Laurie,

I'm kinda asking: where does the "world" start? You know: "in the world, but not of the world." The "world" starts pretty close by if you're Amish! Homosexuals, to most of us, are out there in the world. A philosophical reading of the NT material as regards our obligation to the "world" seems to center on a sort of "live and let live", pragmatic outlook. But the rhetoric surrounding the political expression of the "Christian" position on homosexuality seems centered mostly on a perceived obligation to state what is tangential to an article of faith. If called upon, one is compelled by his faith to confess what he believes to be true. In people's real lives attitudes about homosexuality depend largely upon one's exposure to real homosexuals. People without gay friends have an imagined stereotypical caricature, and people who have gay friends have the same stereotypes plus a couple of real examples. Gay people live in mytholand, where they rave all night and design the future.

Chris
 
Re: Homosexuality Is It A Sin?

Lunamoth i am not judging anyone here, allow me to quote myself...

Azure24 said:
So, my purpose here is not to judge, but to specifically establish whether homosexuality is a sin or not a sin for Believers in Christ under the New Covenant.
Click to expand...

The Bible clearly states Homosexuality is a sin.....

Azure24 said:
"For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even [1] their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: And likewise also [2] the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompense [penalty] of their error which was meet [due]" (Rom. 1:26-27).
Click to expand...

Some foolishly bury their heads in the sand and suggest that nothing immoral is actually mentioned here. Does it sound to you that leaving the natural use of something and using it in a way that is against nature burning in their lust, is a good thing? No, I think not. Okay, but can we determine exactly what it is that was being misused and against nature? Yes, we certainly can.

Paul mentions:

"...their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature..."

Do you think Paul is referring to the improper use of their ears? Did they change the natural use of their eyes? Maybe it was their hands? Did these men and women in question here start using their feet in an unnatural way?

The men who were doing likewise also as the women "burned in their lust one [man] toward another [man], MEN WITH MEN..." Okay, lest someone suggest that this is merely human companionship and doesn't involve SEX then please tell me...
 
Oh, and i'd just like to say i'm not particularly new here... Yes I remeber the old thread (which I did not post) but i thought it was best not to revive it, oh well....
 
"For this cause..." you cite, but you do not cite the previous verse explaining for *what* cause. According to Paul, God turns people gay because they worship nature-deities. That has nothing to do with my case. Now, since I am not a Bible believer (and frankly have no respect at all for people who have no moral sense of their own and have to look in an old book to figure out what they think is right or wrong), I can just say that Paul was totally ignorant about sexuality and leave it at that; it is not surprising that a book from primitive times contains a lot of ignorance as well as some insights.
Now if you believe that the old book is inerrant, then I suppose you have to say that, back then, God did turn some Greeks gay because of their Zeus-worship-- but what does that have to do with anybody now? Even in the case of gay people who are into Paganism (I know some such), the cause-and-effect is in the other direction: they didn't turn to Paganism first, and then "become" gay; rather they turned to Paganism because Christianity shoved them out.
 
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