The Jewish Zohar Shekhinah and the Christian, & Mormon Holy Spirit

So. the only Righteous One is Christ and any righteousness any man has is ever and only by Christ. Same with anything that we have as our inheritance as children of God. It’s all by the Son of God in whom we have life, and eternal at that.
 
PricelessPearl said:
As long as one identifies as the outer man, a separate individual and separate from God, and thinks he has any power of his own and is doing anything of his own accord, then that one is the one destined for damnation..
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..well, I haven't said anything about who might or might not be going to hell. The Bible explains that though.
..so you do agree with me now then, that some people will be in an eternal hell?
..and do you agree with me that all of our souls are eternal?
 
muhammad_isa said:
@PricelessPearl Can you explain this, please?

38 The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one;
39 The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels.
40 As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world.

41 The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;
42 And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.
43 Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.
- Matthew 13 -
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Very good! Purification.
 
muhammad_isa said:
..well, I haven't said anything about who might or might not be going to hell. The Bible explains that though.
..so you do agree with me now then, that some people will be in an eternal hell?
..and do you agree with me that all of our souls are eternal?
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No, I don’t agree with you unless you mean some people may experience hell, which is an eternal state of consciousness.

We are immortal. And all incarnations of of the One Lord. The One who descended to give life to the many. We are all One. So anyone being thrown in hell would only be yourself.

The only way, as far as I can see, to play this game is to be love and to love.
 
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muhammad_isa said:
..well, I haven't said anything about who might or might not be going to hell. The Bible explains that though.
..so you do agree with me now then, that some people will be in an eternal hell?
..and do you agree with me that all of our souls are eternal?
Click to expand...
I don't know, but I rather do not believe in an eternal hell. That's not how it works. It is a most silly doctrine, regardless of someone's opinion from ancient times in ancient books. Yes, I have punished my children, but good Lord had I carried on stupidly with it for even more than 10 years I would have been downright heinous, know what I mean?
 
PricelessPearl said:
No, I don’t agree with you unless you mean some people may experience hell, which is an eternal state of consciousness.

We are immortal. And all incarnations of of the One Lord. The One who descended to give life to the many. We are all One. So anyone being thrown in hell would only be yourself.

The only way, as far as I can see, to play this game is to be love and to love.
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I don't even believe an eternal state of tormented consciousness will be allowed by God for an eternity. I do grasp the idea of being punished and having guilt for wrongs committed, etc. But eternal punishment? I just can't see that is all.
 
ScholarlySeeker said:
I don't even believe an eternal state of tormented consciousness will be allowed by God for an eternity. I do grasp the idea of being punished and having guilt for wrongs committed, etc. But eternal punishment? I just can't see that is all.
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Many are afraid to follow their intuition on these things, but thank God it is very reluctant to let us go. "Yeah, but...", "What about", "The law says", etc. But for those with a very strong intuition, it just says, "Son. Don't sell out, just keep following me." And at some point our feet are set upon new ground.
 
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Judaism often does not speak with one voice which is why Rabbi Donniel Hartman has quipped if someone says that he or she can provide THE authoritative stance of Judaism when it comes to “X”, get up and leave the room. This why I often note when I post that I am presenting A Jewish view, not THE Jewish view.

That said, I would note that, in the main, Judaism rejects the concept of an eternal hell.
 
ScholarlySeeker said:
I don't even believe an eternal state of tormented consciousness will be allowed by God for an eternity. I do grasp the idea of being punished and having guilt for wrongs committed, etc. But eternal punishment? I just can't see that is all.
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I don’t believe in eternal punishment. I am taking about a state of consciousness. Maybe’ a state isn’t the correct way to define it. Poverty is a state. Sickness is a state as is health. We enter states. We make them alive because we are the operant power. They are eternally conceivable as well as misconceptions of eternally real features of conscious being. For example, a feature of Consciousness is abundance (limitlessness) and we embody “make flesh” states ranging from excessive wealth to extreme poverty.

Anyway to enter hell is to fall into the depths of the subconscious mind.
 
ScholarlySeeker said:
I don't know, but I rather do not believe in an eternal hell. That's not how it works. It is a most silly doctrine, regardless of someone's opinion from ancient times in ancient books. Yes, I have punished my children, but good Lord had I carried on stupidly with it for even more than 10 years I would have been downright heinous, know what I mean?
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Yes, I quite understand why you would think that.
I used to think the same thing. I was raised as a Protestant,
and the idea of God punishing people AT ALL was alien to me.

However, I came to see that that is not the reality that we live in. Why would Almighty God allow us to suffer now,
but not in a life hereafter? What sort of logic is that?
Secondly, the Bible teaches that Jesus taught that .. so why would that be?
Thirdly, we need to consider the nature of souls. We know that Almighty God is spiritual and cannot be created or destroyed, so what about our souls that belong to Him?
 
PricelessPearl said:
Does God send people there for all eternity? No.
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That's right, Almighty God does not "send" anybody anywhere !
That is the problem here .. it's one of comprehension.

You have agreed that our souls are eternal [ at least, as regards to going to heaven ]
..but you seem to be saying that our souls do not HAVE to be eternal when it is a case of failure [ i.e. going to hell ]

You want to make your own idea of reality, to fit in with an intuitive feeling that God will only let us suffer in this life,
but not the next .. because He is "only Loving" .. so ignoring what is taught in Matthew.

What about the parent that loves his child, but the child refuses to listen?
That parent will be dismayed, but reality is as it is .. and the parent has to accept that the child will be lost, and suffer.
 
Perhaps purgatory is wanting to say sorry, but it's too late
 
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Can sophistrist Mao tse Tung apologise and reparate the pain of 70 million deaths -- when he comes before (his own) judgement, and to understand the damage?
 
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RJM Corbet said:
Perhaps purgatory is wanting to say sorry, but it's too late
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I'm not sure what you are saying here.
..but I would agree that it is not a case of just "ending up in heaven or hell." .

Many people will be purified in hell, and then go to heaven for eternity .. is that what you mean?
Nevertheless, that does not mean that nobody will be in hell for ever. Matthew tells us so.
..and of course, the devil [ whatever you think he is ] will be [ or is ] in the worst problem.

beelzebub was the demon of gluttony, and a good friend of satan :(
Praise God .. Ramadan starts tomorrow night in the UK, I believe.
Fasting is not compulsory for those who have acute or chronic illness.

According to a 2012 Pew Research Centre study, there is widespread Ramadan observance,
with a median of 93 percent across the thirty-nine countries and territories studied.
There is a famous hadith that states that "satan is locked up in Ramadan"
 
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muhammad_isa said:
That's right, Almighty God does not "send" anybody anywhere !
That is the problem here .. it's one of comprehension.

You have agreed that our souls are eternal [ at least, as regards to going to heaven ]
..but you seem to be saying that our souls do not HAVE to be eternal when it is a case of failure [ i.e. going to hell ]

You want to make your own idea of reality, to fit in with an intuitive feeling that God will only let us suffer in this life,
but not the next .. because He is "only Loving" .. so ignoring what is taught in Matthew.

What about the parent that loves his child, but the child refuses to listen?
That parent will be dismayed, but reality is as it is .. and the parent has to accept that the child will be lost, and suffer.
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No we don’t agree.
For me, there is only God in this world. God is the only One playing every single part. We are all masks of the One Lord. All points of expression of One Indivisible Consciousness. The One Lord is Jesus Christ and as it says in scripture that Christ died and descended into hell and then rose, Christ is the only One to ever descend into hell - EVER. We have life in the Son of God and no other way. Period! Everything thing else is delusion; death; being asleep.

As for the next life, I don’t believe we live once. We are life itself. So as for suffering, Jesus Christ is the only One who ever suffers- He took upon himself the sins of the world. God is the only one willing and moving in us. We are his temples.

God purifies is in the fires of life, of tribulations and trials.

Is there a point we reach when we abide fully in the Son of God, fully in his joy and peace and righteousness- sanctified, purified, holy and blameless? We are already there. Because we are Him.
 
PricelessPearl said:
God is the only One playing every single part..
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You make it sound like a game. I see it as a lot more serious.

PricelessPearl said:
As for the next life, I don’t believe we live once. We are life itself. So as for suffering, Jesus Christ is the only One who ever suffers
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I suppose it depends what you mean by suffers .. of course I believe that Jesus suffered more than others .. he ascended to heaven to be with God .. and he will return as we can see from the scriptures .. he is the Messiah.

How you can say that nobody else ever suffers, I cannot for the life of me understand why. o_O
 
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