Religious Beliefs and Morality

Pl
Faithfulservant said:
Firstly the letters of Paul is not Scripture just because earthly "fathers" says so. If I take the words of Paul out of context, please explain how you see his mockery of commandments of the Most High in context. If Paul says "I am what I am" does the Set-Apart Ruach not cry out for you?
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Faithfulservant said:
Sorry I'm still not buying into TS2009. 116 verses removed from Psalms is a deal breaker for me. I think maybe you have fallen into apostasy? What you are saying sounds religious to me and I am not a religious person I have a deep personal relationship with my Lord. I am a sinner that recognizes a need for a Savior. I know that Jesus died for the sins of the world He would not allow His Word to become so unrecognizable that the entire church age would fall into it. He told His disciples to go out into the world and share the gospel and that is what was done. Starting with the Book of Acts and ending with Revelation. Anything that teaches another gospel than John 3:16 is a false gospel. Imo
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Like I said before if you are looking for a perfect translation to build your faith upon you will build your house on sand. My brother you can accuse me all you want it wont have an effect. I also used to do that when I followed a religion instead of a Saviour. That was the first thing He showed me to notice the beam in my eye and He is the only one that can set us free from that.

Paul did not write Yochanan 3:16
Paul on the other hand himself speaks of his gospell and him being the father and the believers his children and commands people to imitate him and "put on" "Christ". The Word on the other hand says we need to be renewed from inside.....That is the whole purpose of sending us the Set-Apart Ruach
 
RJM said:
To me this emphasises the distinction between following the spirit of the law or just the written letter of the law, and . All tribes had mores to protect and increase the strength of the tribe. But divine law goes beyond and sometimes seems to contradict natural law. Christ demonstrated the true eternal divine law of Spirit. He showed to see beyond the letter of the law, for fear of retribution or damage -- to an inner understanding. In parables like the good Samaritan, Christ extended God's love beyond the tribe, to all humanity.

The printing press arrived at the same time as Martin Luther. When Luther added one word to scripture -- changing 'by faith' to 'only by faith' there was an outcry. The Book of Isaiah buried with the Dead Sea scrolls more than 2000 years ago, is identical to the text we have today. Could it be the Scripture 2009 version that is really guilty of changing the Bible?

This reminds me of the parable about the 'religious professional' standing in the high place in the temple thanking God that he is not like other people -- the cheaters, sinners and adulterers. He thanks God that he is not like the tax collector who stood at a distance and dared not even lift his eyes to heaven as he prayed. Instead, he beat his chest in sorrow, saying, ‘O God, be merciful to me, for I am a sinner.'

Christ says: "I tell you, this sinner (not the other) returned home justified before God. For those who exalt themselves will be humbled, and those who humble themselves will be exalted.”(Luke 18:9-14)

That's not what Paul is saying, in context. He is talking about the written text as the shell of the nut, which itself is dry wood. imo

Isn't that exactly what Paul is explaining: it is the Spirit of the law that gives life?

Paul was the first Christian writer, before the gospels. He spent time with Peter and James; they accepted him. A person can choose to disbelieve that Paul was knocked off his horse and blinded by the revelation from the risen Christ that he received -- but others believe that's the way it happened. It is as @muhammad_isa says, a matter of belief?

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"The spirit of the law" - What does this mean as the law is not a "being" but from the Creator.
The law is not to be interpreted but to obey.

I agree to some extend on the parable of the good Samaritan as it is about the lesser commandment of loving the way He loves us and not how people have been taught.

From what I have seen, there is enough proof that Martin Luther was a Rosicrucian and that the reformation was a controlled opposition. That and is why prophecies does not differentiate between the daughters when it comes to the feast days as an abomination to the most High.

Off course the Book of Isayah is the same, they did not find an english version though?
And not one copy of any Bible I have read is translated 100% correctly.
The commandment is not against changing the Bible but changing the written words of the Almighty.

Not sure where I have said that I do not sin. But yes that parable is why we need to ask for the heart of stone to be removed so we can know His will and not our own and seek His righteousness and not our own.

There is only belief in One that can save us and it is not Paul. The other apostles knew why Paul was sent as one can learn from Scripture that The Word shared more with them than was written.
And as you will notice the real apostles were not boasting or even accusing them as he did.

I do not choose to disbelieve in Paul, I choose to believe in The Word.

I know it is hard to grasp, but we will go in circles as I have gone through this many times before. Re-Read Paul's letters and test every word against that of The Word....
 
restored&adopted said:
I know it is a lot to chew on and His Scripture is so wonderful to search out.
I have also thought of that at some point. Mattias may not have been His choice?
And surely if they have received the indwelling of the Set-Apart Ruach they would not have needed to cast lots.

But Yahusha said to the apostles that they won't see Him anymore as He is going to His Father.
Yet Paul says he saw Him and there are no witnesses that speaks for themselves regarding this? In Scripture we learn that there are always at least 2 witnesses and the Water nor the Ruach witnesses for Paul.
Also Mattias was already following Yahusha even if he was not one of the 12 and did not knew all that the 12 knew.
Paul on the other hand went to Arabia for 3 years to receive his teaching....

Regarding the Name of the Father and the Son, as Scripture says it is for kings to search out.
I do not want to cause panic or confusion so will rather go into a PM discussion if you want to discuss it more.
All I will say here is that we know that there is one name under the heavens by which we should be saved and that leads to the Name above Names.
And it is not a specific pronounciation and mere calling out with our mouths but mainly in our spirit.
Even if we are deceived He cannot be deceived.
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Paul never actually saw Jesus though and never claimed to have seen Him.. just a bright light.

Acts 9:3-9
As he was traveling, it happened that he was approaching Damascus, and suddenly a light from heaven flashed around him; and he fell to the ground and heard a voice saying to him, “Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting Me?” And he said, “Who are You, Lord?” And He said, “I am Jesus whom you are persecuting, but get up and enter the city, and it will be told you what you must do.” The men who traveled with him stood speechless, hearing the voice but seeing no one. Saul got up from the ground, and though his eyes were open, he could see nothing; and leading him by the hand, they brought him into Damascus. And he was three days without sight, and neither ate nor drank.
 
restored&adopted said:
All Truth comes through the Ruach and there is One Word (but multiple Bibles?) If one try to prove the legitamacy of a Bible (which are all translations) to the Word of Elohim you need to learn Hebrew as you will have to throw all of them out.
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If you are counting the New Testament, you would also have to learn Ancient Greek.
 
In my own observation of others, over the years, I've seen there be next to no correlation between religious faith/practice, and morality. Morality of course covers a lot of territory -- maybe that should be a separate thread, or maybe that's the way this thread should drift-- what behaviors count as moral or immoral, and why?
 
Faithfulservant said:
Paul never actually saw Jesus though and never claimed to have seen Him.. just a bright light.

Acts 9:3-9
As he was traveling, it happened that he was approaching Damascus, and suddenly a light from heaven flashed around him; and he fell to the ground and heard a voice saying to him, “Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting Me?” And he said, “Who are You, Lord?” And He said, “I am Jesus whom you are persecuting, but get up and enter the city, and it will be told you what you must do.” The men who traveled with him stood speechless, hearing the voice but seeing no one. Saul got up from the ground, and though his eyes were open, he could see nothing; and leading him by the hand, they brought him into Damascus. And he was three days without sight, and neither ate nor drank.
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That is but one of his contradicting stories of what happened. Constantin-us saw the same light and in it the Chi and now millions of people are in Sardis.
Whether or not the light was too bright to make out an image who knows. But Paul himself says he was commanded to be a follower of "Chi Rho" but Masciach said that The Shepherd calls His sheep and they who hear His voice follows Him.
 
restored&adopted said:
For now
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Uh... what do you mean?
I only mean the New Testament, to my knowledge, was written in Greek.
You had made an earlier comment about needing Biblical Hebrew to read the original bible and I was just pointing out you would also need Greek if you meant the entire Christian bible.
 
TheLightWithin said:
Uh... what do you mean?
I only mean the New Testament, to my knowledge, was written in Greek.
You had made an earlier comment about needing Biblical Hebrew to read the original bible and I was just pointing out you would also need Greek if you meant the entire Christian bible.
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"Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani" He also said this in Aramaic .. definitely referred to God in something other than Hebrew.

Edit to add that He referred to His Father as Abba which is also Aramaic.
 
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restored&adopted said:
Like I said before if you are looking for a perfect translation to build your faith upon you will build your house on sand. My brother you can accuse me all you want it wont have an effect. I also used to do that when I followed a religion instead of a Saviour. That was the first thing He showed me to notice the beam in my eye and He is the only one that can set us free from that.

Paul did not write Yochanan 3:16
Paul on the other hand himself speaks of his gospell and him being the father and the believers his children and commands people to imitate him and "put on" "Christ". The Word on the other hand says we need to be renewed from inside.....That is the whole purpose of sending us the Set-Apart Ruach
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I didn't say Paul wrote John 3:16. I was referencing the idea that adding extra conditions to salvation is a false gospel.

As far as witnesses to Jesus being a condition of truth I would ask why is that not a condition to John the beloved on the island of Patmos for the Revelation of Jesus Christ. Even though in the telling of Paul's visitation in the book of Acts it was witnessed by those traveling with him.

It just seems to me the same idea that if something doesn't agree then it must be false using whatever reason conjured. I cannot agree with this as I hold the bible inerrant in its current condition and in doing so I can stand on my faith unshaken.
 
Without error king James translations. The original meaning and message from God through all of His prophets to all the apostles from Genesis through Revelation. I guess I should expand since there's a lot of extra biblical books added recently. Lol
 
Faithfulservant said:
The bible says the law is written on our hearts.

Romans 2:14 (Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law. 15 They show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts sometimes accusing them and at other times even defending them.)
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Emphasis mine.

With due respect...

In context, this is not about Christians or Jews. This is specifically about people of other faiths, particularly "common" pagans. In context. Paul was speaking to and about Jews (people of the Law) in Rome at the time.
 
Faithfulservant said:
Without error king James translations. The original meaning and message from God through all of His prophets to all the apostles from Genesis through Revelation. I guess I should expand since there's a lot of extra biblical books added recently. Lol
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What is your take on Bel and the Dragon? Or the Song of Suzanna? Or Ecclesiasticus? Or the First and Second Books of Maccabees?

These are all in the original 1611 King James Version, and were never removed "officially," by any Church authority...only publisher's whim. These are not recent additions.
 
juantoo3 said:
Emphasis mine.

With due respect...

In context, this is not about Christians or Jews. This is specifically about people of other faiths, particularly "common" pagans. In context. Paul was speaking to and about Jews (people of the Law) in Rome at the time.
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Which was the response to why non believers have a moral compass apart from the Law.
 
juantoo3 said:
What is your take on Bel and the Dragon? Or the Song of Suzanna? Or Ecclesiasticus? Or the First and Second Books of Maccabees?

These are all in the original 1611 King James Version, and were never removed "officially," by any Church authority...only publisher's whim. These are not recent additions.
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Even though my bible doesn't specifically have these books I don't believe they change the original message and purpose of God's will provided in His Word. I have not felt the lack in my walk not having these books but I would not hold them similar to additions like the Watchtower rewritings or the Mormons additions. This is my opinion obviously
 
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