Geo
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Corbet, if what I have shared here does not inspire you to greater faith in the Truth, then perhaps you are not paying attention.
Can you attest to what is the Truth?
Matrixism - A religion based on The Matrix
- Thread starter DynoMight
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Corbet, if what I have shared here does not inspire you to greater faith in the Truth, then perhaps you are not paying attention.
Can you attest to what is the Truth?
While the existing Gnostic texts do not spell it out like this, consider how the ancient Gnostics might have understood the material world: Being so remote from the divine fullness (Pleroma), it might have been understood as Empty and unreal.
Just my speculation.
From your response I gather that you don't think Matrixism is a Gnostic faith. What do you think of the parallels I mentioned?
This is a common misconception, and not limited to Christianity, it's there in misreading Christian and Hebrew texts, it's there in misreading Greek philosophy – Plato's Cave – and it's prevalent in erroneous assumptions about Buddhism and the Hindu religions.
If time and space are not real, then as Wil points out, nothing is real, and this whole show is void. It's a fantasia, and then The Matrix is just a fantasia within a fantasia, and again as my old friend has often said, 'it's turtles all the way down'.
The critical and critical and crucial distinction is between any given reality – this and other states of being – and its ontological source and origin.
So even the 'wonderland' of The Matrix, realised by Neo when he took the red pill, is no more real than the world of the blue pill (and the idea that enlightenment can be brought about by the simple device of popping a pill is close to the Gnostic idea that by knowing certain secret keys of knowledge that are in the possession of the Gnostic pneumatic (Morpheus) is itself a fantasia – enlightenment comes about by spiritual formation, it's a way of being, not a way of knowing – but that's a whole other discourse, a better movie perhaps, a different movie, certainly, no chases, no shoot-outs, no men-in-black. I'd call it 'Chop Wood, Carry Water'.
Each state of being is real unto itself, and more real than the one 'below' and less real than the one above.
The Greeks, and the Gnostics dependent on them, imagined a hierarchy of states, as a series of emanations. Very much a Transcendent universe. The Abrahamics, and the Hindus, hold a more holistic vision of Transcendence and Immanence as cohering.
Thus each state is real in as much as it possesses its own 'is-ness', but it is dependent, ultimately, on the One, however that is defined.
Thus Christ said to Catherine of Sienna: "I am He Who Is, you are she who is not" – and that's the whole shebang, right there.
Actually, the movie depicts the process of getting accustomed to a new mind state pretty well, I think. When first accessed, whether by chemicals or by meditation, it is bewildering and alien. One has to train the metaphorical muscles, and let the eyes get used to the brightness, so to speak. That is my experience, and it is shared by friends with whom I've discussed it.
The trouble with "chop wood, carry water" is that it describes the goal, not the path, in my opinion. On the path, there are plenty of fierce opponents, and also the occasional Buddha, to kill. The action movie aesthetic of awakening is not bad in itself, I feel.
Oh, agreed that realisation or enlightenment, to whatever degree, can be shocking. As I have said before, the 'Dark Night of the Soul' is not for everyone, and not a journey to be undertaken lightly.
My point was rather against a Gnostic notion that it's not who you are that matters, nor even what you do, but what you know. This may well be a pejorative reading of the texts, but it is fair to assume that some Gnostic teachers believed that once pneumatised, as it were, they were no longer bound by moral norms. Again, this is true to a degree, although open to abuse (sexual abuse of those below being the most common and, tragically, universal). On the other hand, Christ seemed to transgress the religious norns of his day, and Zen texts are replete with outrageous acts, so it's all a matter of context.
And manage the temptations that go with it.
Oh, I'm not so sure. As I understand it, the message is about being mindful in where you are at, rather than wishing for some distant goal – the work is here, now. Outwardly, nothing changes before or after. Inwardly, everything has.
I can see that ...
... I suppose my leanings are coloured by the idea of 'don't go looking for trouble, it will find you'! Also, by the notion (hopefully defunct now) of 'prayer warriors', and the idea of combatting satan. A very unwise move, as he's a cunning b•gg•r! The so inclined are wise to think of Peter at the arrest of Christ, ready to take on all comers, only to crumble later, warming his hands over a fire.
Geo
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Well if you've studied the out of body accounts you do hear of a person leaving their bodies in these situations.
Meanwhile though, for our sakes Christ needed to suffer for us.
Then He rose again bodily, and is promised to return, as the faithful believe.
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Geo
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The Gnostics were errant in calling the God of the Bible evil, because of the violence they perceived.
With respect to His preserving a nation, which was founded upon Him.
There is violence on earth, mainly having to do with this situation which the devil instigated, and with regarding to, "the survival instinct."
Which is something that the Lord defied, as well as the faithful disciples.
Which can be read in the Book, "Foxes Book of Martyrs", also.
Which tells about the martyrs for the faith, through history.
With respect to His preserving a nation, which was founded upon Him.
There is violence on earth, mainly having to do with this situation which the devil instigated, and with regarding to, "the survival instinct."
Which is something that the Lord defied, as well as the faithful disciples.
Which can be read in the Book, "Foxes Book of Martyrs", also.
Which tells about the martyrs for the faith, through history.
If I thought Matrixism offered anything new, or original, or insightful, then I'd be interested, but I'd rather drink from the same waters the Wachowski sisters drank from, and find other commentaries more luminous, inspired and insightful.
The idea of the Matrix seems to hang on a paradox: if we're the program, and programmed to the illusion, then is not 'the rabbit hole' as much the program as everything else, and as much an illusion?
The idea of the Matrix seems to hang on a paradox: if we're the program, and programmed to the illusion, then is not 'the rabbit hole' as much the program as everything else, and as much an illusion?
That same paradox is present in many religions, I think. Often the solution is to realize that the illusion is not what one really is, but instead one's true nature is the divine spark, or the immortal soul, or emptiness, or Brahman, whatever term is used to refer to the True Self.
It does offer something original, at least the first movie does, and that is the character of Agent Smith. He's the true hero, in my opinion, because of his unerring will to be done with all this madness and get out. All the other characters aren't really serious about leaving the matrix, not even Morpheus, and least of all Neo. They all keep getting entangled and drawn back in. Only Smith is uncompromising in his desire to get off that ride. That is an innovative twist on the figure of a Gnostic Archon.
Also, I think Trinity is a wonderfully badass Sophia / Mary Magdalene.
The movie, or the religion?
The movie. Maybe @Geo will share what Smith's role is in Matrixism?
IMO The difficulty isn't the concept of Satan as the power in this world -- whatever Satan is taken to be -- but with the concept that this physical incarnation in this dimension of nature is an irrelevant illusion that comes to nothing in the long run, imo?
Am still trying to sort out how @Geo's Matrixism differs from basic Christianity? Does it knit equally with other faiths? Buddhism and Baha'i seem acceptable to Matrixism? Does it knit equally with Islam, for example -- which emphasises a very real hell in the afterlife?
Am still trying to sort out how @Geo's Matrixism differs from basic Christianity? Does it knit equally with other faiths? Buddhism and Baha'i seem acceptable to Matrixism? Does it knit equally with Islam, for example -- which emphasises a very real hell in the afterlife?
Ditto.
Again, ditto.
It seems Baha'i writings mention 'the matrix', so why not pro-Baha'i?
@Geo does seem to be pro Baha'i, for the exact reason