Belief and Mental Health

Snoopy said:
Show me an adult with no “irrational” fears, no anxieties, no neuroses, no phobias, no “delusions”, no unaccountable mood swings and no “irrational” beliefs and I’ll show you a liar (or at least someone with an appalling lack of self-awareness!:p).

s.
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LMAO :D:D:D wallah azeem, ana bahebek Snoopy. Thank you, you are now officially classed (in my grandmothers terms) as "a treasure".

Big Hug
Salaam
MW
 
Faithfulservant said:
She would just sit there and cry for days on end when she wasnt sleeping.
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Hi FS

Thank you for sharing. The above is perfectly normal, for someone with bipolar, but must have been so confusing and scary for a child to witness. The meds do cause awful memory problems and confusion.

Faithfulservant said:
We thought it would have been a relief if she would just die.. Please understand that we were all young and had no idea what was going on with her or what to do.. It shames me very deeply.
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Please try to let this feeling of shame go, there is nothing to be ashamed of. My parents adore me, yet they could never understand my illness, for years they kept saying "just pull yourself together". When they began to grasp what they were dealing with Mum explained that if it was a broken bone she could understand but the inner workings of a troubled mind was just beyond her. At one point she also wanted me to die, she deeply wanted my suffering and confusion to stop and to be honest, now I am much more balanced, I can see the depth of love required to have these feelings and I hope she feels no shame. If you did not love your Mother her condition would not have affected you this way, you would have just walked away and forgotten about her.

Faithfulservant said:
I asked her if we could pray and she said yes please.. and we prayed. Within minutes after that prayer she proceeded to tell me a story.. one that I hadnt heard since I was very young. Her voice was clear and strong and not thin and small.. I believe she was set free that day.
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G-d bless you for this FS. This is all it takes, a chink of light in the darkness and believe me I know of no darker place than trapped in your own mind.

Faithfulservant said:
They say its genetic.. Ive had my bouts of depression but I think they are normal day to day stress related depressions. I dont believe they are clinical.. my mom thinks they are.
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Perhaps she is just afraid of this? You would not wish this illness on your enemy let alone your child. No-one else in my family is known to have suffered from this (although my father suffers from depression).

Salaam
 
LeoSalinas22 said:
that is where you and i differ, my friend, i am a very flawed individual. i am not special nor unique. i am glad you have a high self esteem for yourself, something i sorely lack.
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Firstly sorry to everyone for 4 different posts but I don't know how to quote different people in the same post.

Hi Leo

This is only my personal opinion and I am very far from being educated in mental health. Bipolar causes really high highs and extremely low lows, so one week you are king of the world and the next you can't get out of bed, get dressed and just want to die. Anger has never been a part of the illness for myself or those I speak to in my support group. Perhaps you should go to see a doctor, if nothing else he/she may be able to get you into anger management classes?

Your above comments concern me, it seems that your anger is always focused on your 'perceived faults'. No-one is perfect and every person on the planet is unique and special, you just haven't found your special quality yet. Maybe you need to let go of some of this anger and self loathing before your special quality will show through? Have you ever thought that one of your children may grow up to find a cure for a disease, go to feed kids in Africa or just have amazing kids of their own - perhaps this is your special gift to the world?

Salaam
MW
 
LeoSalinas22 said:
hi everyone,
sorry to interrupt but i came across this thread and found it interesting because of the fact that faith in God can exist despite of mental flaws. anyways, i got to thinking that perhaps i have bi-polar and don't even know it? is that possible? my wife tells me so but i don't notice. i have a very bad temper and always shout alot, especially when i get angry. i always feel the need to want to beat someone's face in for no apparent reason. i am seldom happy, mostly depressed. when i laugh, everyone looks at me funny. perhaps because i laugh too loud? well, question being, is it possible to have a mental problem and not know it? i ask because, here in south texas alot of the hispanics have tempers and are very honest and aren't inhibited at all about their opinions. making it seem like bi-polar is normal? anyways, hope to hear from someone soon. thanks and God bless.
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Hi Leo,

Well anyone can “have” something but not know it; and no-one on a website like this can say if someone has or hasn’t got anything with certainty, and by and large we’re not “qualified” to. Bi-polar cannot, by definition I’d say be “normal”. The civilian population of Baghdad may all suffer from depression and anxiety but I wouldn’t therefore want to say that it was “normal”. Maybe you should try to do something about your feelings so that the day doesn’t come that you beat someone’s face in for no apparent reason. Do unto others as you would have them do unto you, yes? You are special and unique, like the 8 billion rest of us. You don’t have to be the President or Mick Jagger to be that. There’s no-one else quite like you, nor like me (thankfully!).:p

s.

 
I've been reading Growing Within: The Psychology of Inner Development, a selection from the works of Sri Aurobindo and The Mother compiled with an introduction by A. S. Dalal. There's one passage I read last night that I wanted to share.

It's in the section on basic requisites for growth of consciousness, in a sub-section about aspiration. The Mother is answering a question about igniting the psychic fire within. First she says that it is lit by aspiration and speaks of people with strong will who, in changing their focus automatically light the psychic fire themselves. Then she says:

"And each defect one wants to cure or each progress one wants to make -- if all that is thrown into the fire, it burns with a new intensity. And this is not an image, it is a fact in the subtle physical... And when there is something in the nature which prevents one from advancing and one throws it into this fire, it begins to burn and the flame becomes more intense."

That's on page 34. Although Sri Aurobindo seems to view moral growth as distinct from inner growth, I've come across multiple references in reading to inner growth as something that gives one a greater ability to work on aspects of one's character and on the refinement of character as part of the path to inner growth. The Mother once even says that true sincerity, which most people never reach, is that when we commit ourselves to a certain action that it is our whole being doing so, and there is not a conflicting voice within us.

That sounds quite parallel to the chabad understanding of rasha (a wicked person) beinoni (someone in between) and tzadik (a rightous person or, in the case of hasidism, a rebbe.) The beinoni is considered the greatest most people can achieve, which is to be in a state where there may be inner conflict, there may be times one feels tempted to do things that are wrong, but one's actions are in line with what is right.

And although the rebbe is considered a tzadik, when asked Reb Schneur Zalman of Liadi, the alter rebbe of chabad, quoted someone from the gemara and said, "I'm a beinoni."

Dauer
 
Perhaps she is just afraid of this? You would not wish this illness on your enemy let alone your child. No-one else in my family is known to have suffered from this (although my father suffers from depression).
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I think you are right.. I think shes afraid that I may have it.. she and I are very much alike in every way.. its almost scary. But I am 34 years old and I have never felt what I think she felt.
 
Faithfulservant said:
I think you are right.. I think shes afraid that I may have it.. she and I are very much alike in every way.. its almost scary. But I am 34 years old and I have never felt what I think she felt.
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To be honest if I had a biological child every time they were very happy or sad I would be whisking them off to the doctor but this would just be my own fear that they would go through the same thing. :eek:
 
I thought this was interesting. It takes its inspiration from the famous Rosenhan experiment “On being sane in insane places.”

On Being Sane In Insane Places

Ten volunteers have volunteered to stay in a residential setting. They will be given a series of tasks to perform (to “test” various things) such as having to do stand up comedy, paint-balling, problem solving etc. The group is led by a psychologist.

They are being watched on CCTV by a psychiatrist, a clinical psychologist and a psychiatric nurse who are looking to “assess” the ten individuals. Five are “normal” and five have been diagnosed with varying mental health conditions such as OCD and bipolar disorder. It is the professionals task to determine who is who. Only the individuals themselves know the “truth.”


Like the original Rosenhan experiment it raises various issues of course, such as:

What is normal? What is abnormal? Is there such a thing as normal? How much depends on the circumstances and the situation?

How much trust can be put in the hands of the “professionals”, however well meaning?

At the end of the first part, the professionals had to select two individuals, one of whom they felt was a mental health service user and one of whom they felt was not. They got one right and one wrong…

UK folk can watch it on BBC iPlayer. (Part 1 of 2)...Part 2 next Tuesday...


BBC iPlayer - Horizon: How Mad Are You?: How Mad Are You? Part 1



s.
 
Snoopy said:
I know, don't know if it's technical or copyright or what...:eek:

s.
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Copyright and product protection. Much of BBC output is sold abroad and the programs they do not show are often bought in. So its a two fold protectionism.

tao
 
Tao_Equus said:
Copyright and product protection. Much of BBC output is sold abroad and the programs they do not show are often bought in. So its a two fold protectionism.
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oh ok...............................

s.
 
re: how mad are you?

yes, I'm watching this programme myself- I laughed last week when the psychiatrists only got one out of two right...

for those of you who don't know, of the ten volunteers, we're looking for-
1 someone with OCD (obsessive-compulsive disorder),
2 a person with bi-polar disorder,
3 someone with a diagnosis of schizophrenia,
4 a depressive,
5 a person with social anxiety, and
6 an anorexic...

I've diagnosed them as follows...

1) it was pretty obvious that the OCD guy was the OCD guy- or maybe that was just me... they stuck him in a cow shed cleaning up ****e... he wanted to go home and wash properly... he didn't feel clean, and was uncomfortable with it more than the others... as one of the most usual features of OCD is obsession with germs and cleanliness, it was obviously going to effect this person more than the rest... I think this task was unfair. Far too obvious...

2) the person who they thought was sane (and they got it wrong), a spanish looking woman with short-ish hair, I have scored as bi-polar... as we know the doctors got this one very wrong, so it's "pick a diagnosis from the ones you have left", but this was my belief before the reveal, and I'm sticking with it... I am basing my diagnosis here soley on appearance- I have met a lot of ppl with bi-polar, and she reminded me of most of them...

3) the person I would diagnose as schizophrenic is the big-eyed white blonde haired guy (not the travelling kid)... I base this diagnosis again, soley on appearance... he reminds me of other schizophrenics I have met...

4) the person I would say had been diagnosed as suffering with depression is the short black/asian looking guy... this is not based on appearance, just a guess... if he is not the depressive, which he may not be, then I think the person with social anxiety is also the depressive- see 5) below...

5) the person with socal anxiety is the older, long dark haired woman... I base this on the fact that she was late to arrive at the meeting, which I read as a sign she was anxious about arriving... she may also have depression- I base this on the facts- namely, both disorders go hand in hand, and knowing that, originally, the experiment was to place "5 non-diagnosed with 5 diagnosed in the past" people... if there is 6 disorders, then there must be one person who has two... if this is the case, then this woman has depression and social anxiety, and the black guy has no dignosis.

6) I think the sweet looking ginger girl- the teacher- is the past anorexic...the doctors seem convinced she's a depressive, but I think they've got it wrong... she says she failed university, and it's about the right time for an anorexic to need treatment, at that time in history (anorexics are getting younger today, of course)...

this was my scores after the first episode... will be interesting to see if I want to change my mind as the show goes on... next episode is... tuesday...I will report back then...

my reasoning, I should add, is based soley on... snap descisions, the physical appearance of others, and a few small snippets of wisdom based on what's known about various disorders...

I am here making the assumption that, like the doctors, I will get half of my diagnoses wrong...

anyone else watching the show? It would be interesting to see if you too, like me, have made some snap decisions about who has what...
 
Francis king said:
1) it was pretty obvious that the OCD guy was the OCD guy- or maybe that was just me... they stuck him in a cow shed cleaning up ****e... he wanted to go home and wash properly... he didn't feel clean, and was uncomfortable with it more than the others... as one of the most usual features of OCD is obsession with germs and cleanliness, it was obviously going to effect this person more than the rest... I think this task was unfair. Far too obvious...
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I think I may have refused the task, then barfed :p

And I do not have OCD!

2) the person who they thought was sane (and they got it wrong), a spanish looking woman with short-ish hair, I have scored as bi-polar... as we know the doctors got this one very wrong, so it's "pick a diagnosis from the ones you have left", but this was my belief before the reveal, and I'm sticking with it... I am basing my diagnosis here soley on appearance- I have met a lot of ppl with bi-polar, and she reminded me of most of them...
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What an appalling basis for your diagnosis! I thought the same too. :eek:

3) the person I would diagnose as schizophrenic is the big-eyed white blonde haired guy (not the travelling kid)... I base this diagnosis again, soley on appearance... he reminds me of other schizophrenics I have met...
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Same again. :eek:

I was expecting the programme to be rubbish (I think the title is) because these days programmes like Horizon seem to spin out 5 minutes of "meat" into 60 minutes of visuals, music, summaries, conjecture, waffle, theorising over theories that are then discounted, only for the programme which was called "The Real Reason Why Continents Drift" to end with "so after all this research we still aren't sure of the real reasons why continents drift".

This however was informative and dealt with the issues well I thought, in a neutral, non-sensationalist manner. (Great location too)

Glad I'm not the only one watching it Francis. See you after Tuesday. :)

s.
 
I been watching too.

I think the "Spanish looking" woman to be the schizophrenic, pure hunch mostly based on the strength of her relief at not being spotted last week and the occasional look she had.

I think the anorexic to be the "late" one from Edinburgh. Arriving late on a scheduled flight from Edinburgh is a very valid excuse as I can attest. But her physical appearance shows the ravage many years of anorexia caused malnutrition can cause.

The others Im not sure about.

Will be interesting to see it when I get back.


tao
 
well Francis!

and humbling for the professionals too.


10 volunteers, 5 with "mental health problems."

Identified by the professionals correctly: 2.

Lots to read here:

BBC - Headroom

s.
 
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