Can you relate?

It is not just a matter of being "born again", and a person can do what they like with no consequence.
There is always a consequence when it comes to sin. But if one is "born again", there sins are forgiven past, present and future. Spend some time in the book of Romans and this becomes clear. foot note: There is a issue here, I a person just sins because they believe they can, then they are not born again. A born again person has the Holy Spirit residing in them and will not want to sin, does not mean that we won't, it just means that we will not want to. Like I have said, there are those who call themselves Christians and then there are Christians.
 
How do you know you're not a scribe, pharisee, or hypocrite to Jesus?
Read the Bible and it will explain this very clearly. The Scribes and Pharisees rejected Jesus, I have accepted Jesus because He offers the free gift to anyone who honestly believes that God sent Jesus as the Lamb to be sacrificed for the sins of the world. Meaning only those who accept Him, not everyone.
 
How do you know you're not a scribe, pharisee, or hypocrite to Jesus?
That is indeed a quandary. I personally think the ible offers we should be more concerned with our own shortcomings

This I the type of guidance I attempt to use on this, I personally have no time, my faults keep me busy.

"Whenever you recognize the fault of another, think of yourself! What are my imperfections? -- and try to remove them. Do this whenever you are tried through the words or deeds of others. Thus you will grow, become more perfect. You will overcome self, you will not even have time to think of the faults of others..." ‘Abdu’l-Bahá, Star of the West', Volume 8, No. 10, p 138

Regards Tony
 
Teachings of the prophets are answers given in the time they lived in.
I am assuming that you have never read through the major and minor prophets of the Jewish scriptures. They don't speak about the Law, they condemn Israel for their adultery and rejecting God. They don't teach "laws" Moses is considered the "law giver". The "Law was given only to show us our sin" No one can keep the Law, no one. This is very clear all through Scripture.
 
No. Not unless a person knows that Islam is authentic, but ignores it.
..but that would not be sincere.
Sura 48:17 You have to obey Muhammad in order to get into the "garden with rivers flowing under it"! Muhammad becomes a partner to Allah in the teachings of the Quran. Allah and Muhammad are always connected to the "garden", along with good works.
 
Maybe spiritual law seems sometimes to oppose natural law, but in my opinion, it rather brings us in harmony with nature, although our world is different from the world human instinct has been built for.
I am inclined to beleive that the natural laws are reflection of the Spiritual. That they are all evidence of an intelligent design.

Much like magnetisim, opposites attract. Consider all creation is built upon opposing forces.
Like Love and the lack of love is hate

Love is oneness, bonding, life
Hate is dissolution, decay, death

Light and lack of light darkness, etc.

(Male, females 🤣)

Regards Tony
 
13 “But woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites..."
He was not very kind to Pharisees. I suppose he was kind only to people who considered him the 'anointed son of God'.
Or he was part of another sect, maybe the Essenes some think, but some doubt that. He is very critical of Pharisees and Sadducees and there was an inter-sect rivalry then. So he may just have been spouting off the norm for his sect, and that is what was recorded, curated, preserved.
 
Maybe spiritual law seems sometimes to oppose natural law, but in my opinion, it rather brings us in harmony with nature, although our world is different from the world human instinct has been built for.
The first law of nature is self survival of the fittest, and the second is procreation. Nature requires propagation of the species. There's security in numbers. Fish shoal together. Tribal mores against murder theft and adultery are to protect and strengthen the tribe. The strongest gorilla leads and mates with the females, until a younger gorilla beats him in a fight and takes over. Tribes protect their members, but people from another tribe are not considered to be people.

That is Christ's parable of the good Samaritan -- taking it beyond the tribe, to all humanity?

The laws of Spirit are different from the time and space laws of 'nature red in tooth and claw'. The law of Spirit is love, in the sense that all is one and returns to the One. The ways of the spirit are gentleness, sacrifice, humility, consideration of others, and so on.

It's why there'll never be a perfect world, imo
 
Last edited:
Read the Bible and it will explain this very clearly. The Scribes and Pharisees rejected Jesus, I have accepted Jesus because He offers the free gift to anyone who honestly believes that God sent Jesus as the Lamb to be sacrificed for the sins of the world. Meaning only those who accept Him, not everyone.
Scribes and pharisees rejected Jesus' claims, but on different grounds, I assume?

What about the hypocrites? Did they reject Jesus?
 
There is always a consequence when it comes to sin. But if one is "born again", there sins are forgiven past, present and future
No .. their PAST sins are forgiven.
What you are saying makes no sense .. a person who is "born again", effectively repents for their past sins,
but it does not mean that a person cannot fall back into a state of carelessness.

..a person just sins because they believe they can, then they are not born again. A born again person has the Holy Spirit residing in them and will not want to sin, does not mean that we won't, it just means that we will not want to. Like I have said, there are those who call themselves Christians and then there are Christians.
Of course a person who is "born again" will not want to sin..
..but over time, we cannot maintain our faith at a constant level .. it rises and falls.
..and it also helps if you know what is a sin and what is not .. but you seem to think that "works"
do not count, so how would you know what is a sin??
 
Sura 48:17 You have to obey Muhammad in order to get into the "garden with rivers flowing under it"! ..
Paradise does not consist of a bunch of communists ;)
There are many "stations" in paradise.
A person who attains paradise might be a King .. or they might be a pauper.
Not one person will complain in paradise .. even if they are the lowest caste, and a mere servant!

The more we struggle to please G-d, the higher our status becomes.
Easier said than done, though .. the devil is a clear enemy .. mankind are weak.
 
Scribes and pharisees rejected Jesus' claims, but on different grounds, I assume?
You have missed it here. I don’t know when it was that you read the Bible, maybe that is why you assume incorrectly.
They rejected Jesus because He was “making Himself God”. I.e. forgiving sines. Each Sabbath He went into synagogues and taught from the Scriptures (OT). The claims from people were, “no one has ever taught as this man”. “He speaks with authority”. Jesus knew from the beginning that He was going to be killed by the Jews, just as they killed all the prophets who spoke against their legalistic system.
 
What about the hypocrites? Did they reject Jesus?
Hypocrites are just hypocrites, they say one thing and live differently from what they say. The Scribes and Pharisees were both hypocrites. That is why Jesus told the people “listen and obey what they say” but don’t do as they do. They were considered by Jesus to be the ”blind leading the blind” they had the truth but rejected it. Men in power don’t follow the law, they think that they are above it.
 
Of course .. G-d is able to do all things. :)
Wishful thinking, not that God can’t do anything. Do you also write Allah as A-h? Why are people in hell? It certainly is not to work off their sin. There is no getting out, people die and then there is judgement. Eternal judgement. Catholics believed bin Purgtory, where people could be prayed out of hell and into heaven, another money making scheme for the Catholics. Once a person rejects God they are doomed forever. Of course your Quran talks about Allah changing his mind all the time according to how you live, this week you are ok, next week - who knows.
No .. their PAST sins are forgiven.
What you are saying makes no sense .. a person who is "born again", effectively repents for their past sins,
but it does not mean that a person cannot fall back into a state of carelessness.
Listen, I understand you do not know what the Bible says or you simply don’t believe what it says when it does not agree with Muhammad. It makes perfect sense. Do you think that Abraham did not sin, or Moses, or David, or Solomon. The sins that they would commit were forgiven. Yes, we need to acknowledge the sin and repent, but once God has Justified us as His gift to us, the flesh is considered dead in Christ. No one is speaking about a “careless state”. Haven’t you been listening. A person will never stop sinning!!!!!!!! Never. If you want to understand Christianity, then spend some time in the Book of Romans, especially chapters 6 through 10. God makes His children Righteous, that never suggests that we go on sinning because we have a “free ticket to heaven”. That would only prove that we don’t know God, have never been ”born again”, and have not died to the sinful flesh.

Romans 6:1–4 (NASB95): What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin so that grace may increase?
2 May it never be! How shall we who died to sin still live in it?
3 Or do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus have been baptized into His death?
4 Therefore we have been buried with Him through baptism into death, so that as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, so we too might walk in newness of life.

Romans 6:12–15 (NASB95): 12 Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its lusts,
13 and do not go on presenting the members of your body to sin as instruments of unrighteousness; but present yourselves to God as those alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness to God.
14 For sin shall not be master over you, for you are not under law but under grace.
15 What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? May it never be!

Romans 8:1–10 (NASB95): 1 Therefore there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus.
2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has set you free from the law of sin and of death.
3 For what the Law could not do, weak as it was through the flesh, God did: sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and as an offering for sin, He condemned sin in the flesh,
4 so that the requirement of the Law might be fulfilled in us, who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.
5 For those who are according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who are according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit.
6 For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the Spirit is life and peace,
7 because the mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God; for it does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able to do so,
8 and those who are in the flesh cannot please God.
9 However, you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him.
10 If Christ is in you, though the body is dead because of sin, yet the spirit is alive because of righteousness.
but over time, we cannot maintain our faith at a constant level .. it rises and falls.
Sorry, you are confused about “Faith”. You equate it to works! My Faith is always increasing. Yet I go on sinning daily. “The flesh is weak”. But the “Spirit is willing”. I fight a battle daily to live the way God desires, but as long as I am in this sinful flesh, I will keep sinning.
and it also helps if you know what is a sin and what is not
This is simple, there does not need to be written out. If I do anything against my neighbor or do not love God, then I sin.
but you seem to think that "works"
“Works“ do not count when it comes to Salvation. Works do count when it comes to judgement from God when we stand before Him at the day of death. But Salvation and Justification are a gift of God.

Eph. 2:8-10 and Titus 3:5-7

Ephesians 2:8–10 (NASB95): 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God;
9 not as a result of works, So that no one can boast.
10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.

Titus 3:5–7 (NASB95): 5 He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit,
6 whom He poured out upon us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior,
7 so that being justified by His Grace we would be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.
The more we struggle to please G-d
That is not unconditional love, it’s just “works”. God desires us to love Him, not on conditions. If someone gives you a gift and you try to pay for it, then you don’t understand what a “gift” is. God gave us a “gift” in His Son, Jesus and you keep trying to pay for it. Muhammad simply fell into the same mess that the Jews did, trying to live a legalistic life, thinking that that was what God desired from His creation. God simply wants His creation to love Him. That is just too simple for most people to understand. Go back to Ephesians chapter 2, “so that no one can boast”. Saying: “Look at how good I am”

There is no one good, no not one”. “Your works are as filthy rags”. Just read the Bible and ask God to show you the truth.
Easier said than done, though .. the devil is a clear enemy .. mankind are weak.
Paul says it very simply, “my conscience is clear”. “I am content”. I feel for people who have to live in a struggle every day of their life wondering ”if I am doing enough good”. that is not freedom, that is slavery.

(several individual posts moved here by moderator to consolidate)
 
Last edited by a moderator:
That is Christ's parable of the good Samaritan -- taking it beyond the tribe, to all humanity?
And then Christianity became another tribe. That is the misfortune of the world.
That is why my pet saying in Hindi is "Guru ko maro goli" (Shoot the one who claims to be a teacher).
They have given nothing other than strife to the world.
And that is why my label - "Be your own Guru".
 
Last edited:
There is no getting out, people die and then there is judgement. Eternal judgement.
Right .. and you just happen not to be going to hell?
..but I am?

Catholics believed bin Purgtory..
They still do, as far as I know..

..where people could be prayed out of hell and into heaven, another money making scheme for the Catholics.
No .. one cannot buy their way out of hell .. we all rely on G-d's mercy.
..and G-d is more merciful than a mother to her child.

Some people will remain in hell forever .. they are the ones who willfully follow satan.

Once a person rejects God they are doomed forever..
..in the same way that a person who accepts G-d can't put a foot wrong?
..too simplistic .. you make G-d out to be a tyrant, who does not accept repentance.
 
They have given nothing other than strife to the world.
Nothing else?

JB.png
https://www.johnbradburne.com/
 
That is not unconditional love, it’s just “works”. God desires us to love Him, not on conditions. If someone gives you a gift and you try to pay for it, then you don’t understand what a “gift” is.
The "gift" is faith .. faith and accurate religious knowledge, that saves from the fire of hell.

God gave us a “gift” in His Son, Jesus and you keep trying to pay for it.
That is meaningless dogma. I think Saul of Tarsus [Paul] is so often quoted, and misunderstood.
Paul was not Jesus' disciple nor a prophet, in any case.

God simply wants His creation to love Him..
Of course .. but what sort of love is it, if we ignore his guidance?
Do not attend communal worship? Not study the meaning of righteousness?
 
Back
Top