Can you relate?

[Cino]

Yes, but the Scriptures state who killed Jesus. It was the Jews by way of the Romans.

You are reading something into the text with this "by way".

Sadly, this tradition of Christians blaming Jews for what the Romans did has a long and terrible history.

Since you are always quick to point out when other contributors here go one step beyond the literal meaning of the text, it comes across as a double standard, of not outright hypocrisy, when you indulge in it.

You know, the plank in your face, the speck of sawdust in your brothers', amd all that good stuff Jesus taught.

 

[Cino]

Sorry, you are confused about “Faith”. You equate it to works! My Faith is always increasing. Yet I go on sinning daily. “The flesh is weak”. But the “Spirit is willing”. I fight a battle daily to live the way God desires, but as long as I am in this sinful flesh, I will keep sinning.

Sounds like an excuse to me. I mean, it is good to feel accepted and loved, but that's not an achievement to brag about to others, rather, it is a solid position from which to go and do good by one's neighbor.

If someone's faith does not reflect in how they show up in real life, what good is it to the rest of us?

I'm happy for you that you found your faith which helped you be a more happy person. But that's not the whole picture, now is it?

The Buddhists, for example, have this teaching about the three parts of their path. There is Wisdom, Mental Training, and Ethics.

An analogy to Christianity might be that accepting Jesus and having Faith is "Wisdom", and a prayer life could be "Mental Training" - and that leaves the whole field of ethical behavior.

Didn't Jesus himself teach that he was tired of those who called him "Master, master" but did not do as he taught? Didn't Jesus get upset to the point of cursing it, about a tree not bearing fruit?

As a non-Christian, I vastly prefer it when Christians actually let their faith inform their actions.

Not Being A Dick is the never-ending spiritual practice which is really worthwhile to pursue, regardless of the details of one's faith or world-view.

 

[muhammad_isa]

..Think about the "last rites" deal that the Catholic Church offers..

I see nothing wrong in praying for the sick, and those destined for death.

 

[muhammad_isa]

The first is correct, the second part is where you are so misinformed. The thief on the cross has no "religious knowledge" and still was going to paradise..

..as I have already pointed out .. we all have different status in paradise.
A learned person is not equal to an ignorant one.
..but YES .. the most important thing is sincerity .. faith is based on sincerity.

 

[Tony Bristow-Stagg]

I see nothing wrong in praying for the sick, and those destined for death.

Matter of fact, it I a wonderful thing to be able to offer a parting soul.

Regards Tony

 

[muhammad_isa]

What is "righteousness"? You think you know or can know? "There is no one righteous, no not one".

The fact that we all fall short does not change the meaning of righteousness.
In secular law, it is our duty to know it .. we cannot claim that we didn't know that
we broke the law when driving, for example.
The same applies to G-d's law.

The Roman elite "adopted" Jesus into their system .. they oppressed "Jewish Christianity"
and supported "Gentile Christianity", that threw away Jewish Law for Roman law.
Jesus was a Jew, and he says:

Matthew 5:17 “Do not think that I have come to abolish Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.”

..but it is all about interpretation. Most people have preformed ideas, and claim that their interpretation [creed]
is the one and only truth.

 

[RJM]

Well, he was wrong, wasn't he? He was killed by the Romans. That's what it says in the text.

Romans hammered in the nails, but the Jews took Jesus to Pilate for trial, and when Pilate wanted to free Jesus, the Jews cried out 'crucify him' and demanded the release instead of Barabbas ...

 

[muhammad_isa]

Romans hammered in the nails, but the Jews took Jesus to Pilate for trial, when Pilate wanted to free Jesus, the Jews cried out 'crucify him' and demanded the release instead of Barabbas ...

Yes, it is true what you say .. except I would not say "the Jews" did it..
..but some among the Sanhedrin -- the elite.

 

[RJM]

Yes, it is true what you say .. except I would not say "the Jews" did it..
..but some among the Sanhedrin -- the eliete.

Yah

 

[Aupmanyav]

I see nothing wrong in praying for the sick, and those destined for death.

I do not think that is of any help, the sick still suffer and those who are to die will die.

..as I have already pointed out .. we all have different status in paradise.
A learned person is not equal to an ignorant one.

Oh, segregation even in heaven. The guard stops an ignorant person if he is intruding in the area that belongs to the learned person. Of course, the martyrs are in even grander mansions with 72 houris.

 

[Thinking required]

You are reading something into the text with this "by way".

Read Matthew chapters 26 and 27, chapter 15 of Mark, Chapters 22 and 23 of Luke, chapters 18 and 19 of John. Then try again to tell me that I am reading into the text.

Sadly, this tradition of Christians blaming Jews for what the Romans did has a long and terrible history.

The Romans would have never killed Jesus if it had not been for the conspiracy of the Jews. You need to do you homework.

Since you are always quick to point out when other contributors here go one step beyond the literal meaning of the text, it comes across as a double standard, of not outright hypocrisy, when you indulge in it.

Like I have said, read the Chapters I posted for you and tell me honestly that the Jews did not set this death of Jesus up. I simply read the text, there is no "double standard".

2 The chief priests and the scribes were seeking how they might put Him to death; for they were afraid of the people.
New American Standard Bible: 1995 Update (La Habra, CA: The Lockman Foundation, 1995), Lk 22:2.
53 So from that day on they planned together to kill Him.
New American Standard Bible: 1995 Update (La Habra, CA: The Lockman Foundation, 1995), Jn 11:53.
3 Then the chief priests and the elders of the people were gathered together in the court of the high priest, named Caiaphas;
4 and they plotted together to seize Jesus by stealth and kill Him.
New American Standard Bible: 1995 Update (La Habra, CA: The Lockman Foundation, 1995), Mt 26:3–4.
50 nor do you take into account that it is expedient for you that one man die for the people, and that the whole nation not perish.”
New American Standard Bible: 1995 Update (La Habra, CA: The Lockman Foundation, 1995), Jn 11:50.

The Jews plotted to kill Jesus, the Romans were simply the instrument used.

You know, the plank in your face, the speck of sawdust in your brothers', amd all that good stuff Jesus taught.

It's "take the log or plank out of your own eye before" The text is clear for anyone wanting to honestly read it without their own twist being put on it. It's letters arranged into words and then words into sentences. Just normal grammar.

Sounds like an excuse to me. I mean, it is good to feel accepted and loved, but that's not an achievement to brag about to others, rather, it is a solid position from which to go and do good by one's neighbor.

I realize that what I said was too deep for all of you here. If you want to understand better, read Romans chapters 5-8. stupid me! You still will not understand. You are a woman, don't think that you understand the struggles of a man, you can't and don't. No excuses, I just realize that I will never be perfect as long as I am in this sinful body. You know that you sin daily, what's the difference, a sin is a sin.

I'm happy for you that you found your faith which helped you be a more happy person. But that's not the whole picture, now is it?

Your right, I just can't stand people who live in deceit and lies. And yes, I here your reply already, what makes you think that you are not living in deceit and lies. Lies are never hard to figure out, there is just too much evidence in the world. When a person makes a statement, it easy to research the statement and find the truth, you should try it sometime. Just like you don't believe that the Jews should be blamed for killing Jesus!

29 “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you build the tombs of the prophets and adorn the monuments of the righteous,
30 and say, ‘If we had been living in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partners with them in shedding the blood of the prophets.’
31 “So you testify against yourselves, that you are sons of those who murdered the prophets.

New American Standard Bible: 1995 Update (La Habra, CA: The Lockman Foundation, 1995), Mt 23:29–31.

Not Being A Dick

Can't help it, it's just part of my body. God gave it to me. Not sure why you seem so upset with me unless I hit a nerve. So did you go from being a Christian to a Jew.

Not Being A Dick

I was just in the kitchen thinking and realized that I could not pass up an opportunity for a little lesson here. Your statement: "This statement can be interpreted different ways depending on who is reading it. I know what you meant because you are using "dick" in a slang sense. But what if someone does not understand the slang usage of a word, they will be confused. It all comes down to understanding the meaning of words and terms in everything that we read.

(Several individual posts moved here by moderator to consolidate)

 

[Thinking required]

I see nothing wrong in praying for the sick, and those destined for death.

Do you think that it will change where they go after death?

The fact that we all fall short does not change the meaning of righteousness.

The point being, that you missed is, no one is righteous or can be righteous with God doing the work in a person's heart.

Yes, it is true what you say .. except I would not say "the Jews" did it..

Who do you think was in the crowd who was yelling, "crucify Him". I will give you a hint, Jews, not the Religious type, but everyday Jewish people.

..as I have already pointed out .. we all have different status in paradise.

Yes, some get the garden with the Virgins. I believe you can find that in Sura 55.

 

[RJM]

Who do you think was in the crowd who was yelling, "crucify Him". I will give you a hint, Jews, not the Religious type, but everyday Jewish people.

Why do you need to attack Jews and Muslims all the time to justify your own Christian beliefs? You may disagree with what others believe, but this forum is about inter-religious discussion and communication, not proselytizing. The point @Cino was making is how the idea of 'the Jews' was turned by Hitler and others to violence against a whole race of people.

Your persistent anti Jew and Muslim comments are against the ethos of our interfaith forums. We are a community and we have our own standards here. As I said before, we are not always perfect, but we try.

 

[Cino]

Romans hammered in the nails, but the Jews took Jesus to Pilate for trial, and when Pilate wanted to free Jesus, the Jews cried out 'crucify him' and demanded the release instead of Barabbas ...

The Romans letting their hands be forced by the Jews?

Not in my history book.

 

[Cino]

Can't help it, it's just part of my body. God gave it to me. Not sure why you seem so upset with me unless I hit a nerve.

So you really are using your faith as an excuse to behave without respect or consideration of this place and your fellow participants here.

Mod Hat On

You will abide by our Code of Conduct from now on, or have your account banned.

Mod Hat Off

So did you go from being a Christian to a Jew.

I'm atheist, as it says right next to my profile picture.

 

[Thinking required]

Why do you need to attack Jews and Muslims all the time to justify your own Christian beliefs?

I am stating a fact as per the Bible. I am not attacking anyone, just stating historical evidence. Why do people have a problem with the truth. I love the Jewish people, they are God's chosen people and will always be. I as a Christian am "grafted" into the tree, a Jewish tree. And please correct me here, who is it that wants to remove Israel from the face of this planet? What people group chants, death to Israel? And what religion is this people group? Why is it, when someone belongs to a certain group of people, they never want to acknowledge that the faults associated with the group. why did people follow Hit ler? Why did people follow Stalin? Why does any group of people follow killers?

to justify your own Christian beliefs?

I don't have to "justify anything, it's all there in black and white, or on the computer screen in most cases these days.

he point @Cino was making is how the idea of 'the Jews' was turned by Hitler and others to violence against a whole race of people.

I am glad that your clarified what Cino said, since I did not get that from what she said unless I missed a post.

Your persistent anti Jew and Muslim comments are against the ethos of our interfaith forums.

"anti Jew"?????? Have you missed what I have said? I simply stated from the texts for the Bible. Just read what God has to say about the Nation of Israel in their own Scriptures. What is wrong with you people! It's all there is black and white and you accuse me of hate for the Jews. People act like I am the only one here who makes comments about other religions. You have just stated a lie about me with this post, shouldn't I be totally offended from you hateful comment? All you have to do is go back to any of my comments about the Jewish nation and you will see how much I care about the Jewish people.

 

[Cino]

I am stating a fact as per the Bible. I am not attacking anyone, just stating historical evidence.

Just abide by the Code of Conduct.

If you don't, you can't post here.

 

[Thinking required]

The Romans letting their hands be forced by the Jews?

Then you need to find a different book, yes, they were forced. That word can have a few different meaning applied to it.
It stares you right in the face and yet you deny it. Verses 22-24 Why didn't Pilate release Him????? Verse 22 Who was in charge????? Why would Pilate kill an innocent man?????


13 Pilate summoned the chief priests and the rulers and the people,
14 and said to them, “You brought this man to me as one who incites the people to rebellion, and behold, having examined Him before you, I have found no guilt in this man regarding the charges which you make against Him.
15 “No, nor has Herod, for he sent Him back to us; and behold, nothing deserving death has been done by Him.
16 “Therefore I will punish Him and release Him.”
17 [Now he was obliged to release to them at the feast one prisoner.]
18 But they cried out all together, saying, “Away with this man, and release for us Barabbas!”
19 (He was one who had been thrown into prison for an insurrection made in the city, and for murder.)
20 Pilate, wanting to release Jesus, addressed them again,
21 but they kept on calling out, saying, “Crucify, crucify Him!”
22 And he said to them the third time, “Why, what evil has this man done? I have found in Him no guilt demanding death; therefore I will punish Him and release Him.”
23 But they were insistent, with loud voices asking that He be crucified. And their voices began to prevail.
24 And Pilate pronounced sentence that their demand be granted.
25 And he released the man they were asking for who had been thrown into prison for insurrection and murder, but he delivered Jesus to their will.
New American Standard Bible: 1995 Update (La Habra, CA: The Lockman Foundation, 1995), Lk 23:13–25.

So you really are using your faith as an excuse to behave without respect or consideration of this place and your fellow participants here.

Another lie coming from you "good" people. I have been more than CLEAR about my purpose here. Maybe you need to look in the mirror.

I'm atheist, as it says right next to my profile picture.

So what are you doing here? "atheist" is not a Faith based religion. It means that you believe in nothing except yourself. After all, the forum is called "interfaith"

 

[RJM]

I have been more than CLEAR about my purpose here.

Would you like to clarify again?

I hope you are not here to teach everybody else?

You can put that thought right out the window. Nobody is looking for a teacher here. We are a discussion forum

 

[RJM]

"anti Jew"?????? Have you missed what I have said? I simply stated from the texts for the Bible. Just read what God has to say about the Nation of Israel in their own Scriptures. What is wrong with you people! It's all there is black and white and you accuse me of hate for the Jews. People act like I am the only one here who makes comments about other religions. You have just stated a lie about me with this post, shouldn't I be totally offended from you hateful comment? All you have to do is go back to any of my comments about the Jewish nation and you will see how much I care about the Jewish people.

Then why make a comment like this at all? You immediately bracket the entire Jewish race?

Who do you think was in the crowd who was yelling, "crucify Him". I will give you a hint, Jews, not the Religious type, but everyday Jewish people.

As you bracket all Muslims as hating Jews:

What people group chants, death to Israel? And what religion is this people group? Why is it, when someone belongs to a certain group of people, they never want to acknowledge that the faults associated with the group.

By their fruits they are known ...