God to You

[radarmark]

As far as the physiological reponse goes, you are probably right, EM. I take Oxycontin and I have the experience of the physical response. The question is more like "if one has the concept of G!d, why does this trigger the physilogical response". If one believes in only the material aspect of the Kosmos, like the logical positivists, this rephrasing is meaningless.



Panta Rhei!
(Everything Flows!)

 

[Etu Malku]

As far as the physiological reponse goes, you are probably right, EM. I take Oxycontin and I have the experience of the physical response. The question is more like "if one has the concept of G!d, why does this trigger the physilogical response". If one believes in only the material aspect of the Kosmos, like the logical positivists, this rephrasing is meaningless.



Panta Rhei!
(Everything Flows!)

Today's concept of god is much different than our perception 3-4000 yrs ago, today's Abrahamic god is not the same god archetype as, say the Egyptians!

 

[Persona]

Actually, I think Love is a neuro-chemical release in our brains as a built in survival mechanism.

I have to admit, reading your post made me laugh!
I just never have said, "When I think of you, I get a nero-chemical release in my brain as built in surival mechanism."

EtuMalku, What do you think about choice?
If you have a little time (- like 9 hours lol)... what do you think about...
"Bruce Lipton - The New Biology - Where Mind & Matter Meet"?

 

[Persona]

Love is about charity, generosity, hospitality and justice. It is about knowing the needs of others and meeting those needs.

I agree, Saltmeister.
The tricky thing about love is that it's circumstantial.
For one person in one circumstance, it may be "best" or "loving" to be generous, for another person in another circumstance, maybe it isn't.
I think we love best by harmonizing intellect (logic) & spirit (intuition) & also harmonizing loving ourselves & others.

 

[Persona]

Love is the gift of self to the other, without condition.

God bless,

Thomas

I agree, to an extent.
It's beautiful to give of yourself... in a creative, thoughtful way.
Yet, I don't believe we are capable of loving without condition.
Even the most giving people, give based on the condition that they get some kind of reward in return... even just the good feeling of doing good.

Consider a God who had no conditions... it would be chaos! Maybe some believe God to be the "nothingness" that exploded.
More personally, imagine parents who had no conditions for their kids... they let them do whatever they wanted unconditionally. Those kids would feel unsafe & probably would be out of control without any conditional structure, don't you think?

 

[Etu Malku]

I have to admit, reading your post made me laugh!
I just never have said, "When I think of you, I get a nero-chemical release in my brain as built in surival mechanism."

EtuMalku, What do you think about choice?
If you have a little time (- like 9 hours lol)... what do you think about...
"Bruce Lipton - The New Biology - Where Mind & Matter Meet"?

LOL . . . pretty cold - sounding isn't it!

Choice?
I'll have to look into Lipton's theory!

 

[Saltmeister]

As far as the physiological reponse goes, you are probably right, EM. I take Oxycontin and I have the experience of the physical response. The question is more like "if one has the concept of G!d, why does this trigger the physilogical response". If one believes in only the material aspect of the Kosmos, like the logical positivists, this rephrasing is meaningless.

I almost thought you said oxytocin, that relationship-building hormone.

Oxycontin seems to be a pain-reliever.

 

[Saltmeister]

For one person in one circumstance, it may be "best" or "loving" to be generous, for another person in another circumstance, maybe it isn't.

But what else could it be?

Would they rather ....... you slept with them, had sex with them? Kiss, hug them? That's what equates to love for lots of people these days.

Even so, it would still be a form of charity and generosity don't you think?

Unless you actually like and enjoy the experience yourself. In that case there'd be mutual benefit in so called "acts of love." It's the kind of thing a sex-starved spouse would want.

I think it would be funny actually, to think of love as about charity and generosity. Some guy would probably mistake that as motivation to go to some single mother living in poverty (a damsel in distress) and is too poor to date and go sleep with her.

 

[IowaGuy]

Yet, I don't believe we are capable of loving without condition.....More personally, imagine parents who had no conditions for their kids... they let them do whatever they wanted unconditionally. Those kids would feel unsafe & probably would be out of control without any conditional structure, don't you think?

But the love of a parent (at least for me, personally) is not based on conditions. I love my child regardless of whether he graduates from college, or whether she gets pregnant at 16, or whether he gets arrested, etc. No matter what that child does, no matter what mistakes he makes in life, no matter if we get in a fight and he tells me he hates me, I will always love him. That is unconditional love, "loving without condition".

 

[Etu Malku]

But the love of a parent (at least for me, personally) is not based on conditions. I love my child regardless of whether he graduates from college, or whether she gets pregnant at 16, or whether he gets arrested, etc. No matter what that child does, no matter what mistakes he makes in life, no matter if we get in a fight and he tells me he hates me, I will always love him. That is unconditional love, "loving without condition".

Again, unconditional love can be viewed as another survival mechanism towards rearing children and ensuring the next generation of You

 

[IowaGuy]

Again, unconditional love can be viewed as another survival mechanism towards rearing children and ensuring the next generation of You

Etu - is every human trait or action a survival mechanism?

Let's consider greed and altruism. Both survival mechanisms?

When a soldier jumps on a grenade to save the others in his troop, how is that ensuring the propogation of his genes?

 

[Etu Malku]

Etu - is every human trait or action a survival mechanism?

Let's consider greed and altruism. Both survival mechanisms?

When a soldier jumps on a grenade to save the others in his troop, how is that ensuring the propogation of his genes?

Your 2nd two questions are only relevant if indeed I said that every human trait or action was a survival mechanism, which of course I never said.

As we know the first order of business for even the simplest micro-organism is to survive, the next order is to propagate.

The simple neuro-chemical releases that govern emotions such as love in this case, cannot be denied as a survival mechanism towards the security of a Self-Conscious species as ourselves.

When we examine the progression of Love in mentally stable human beings we find there to be "falling in Love" which includes sexual attraction, possession, and domination. Once bearing child this Love transforms into a loving and caring for, if not protective type of Love, again securing the propagation of species, after birth the Love again transforms into a rearing form of Love meant to keep the roaming male attached to the family unit.

Of course this is only one aspect of a certain form of Love.

 

[seattlegal]

Your 2nd two questions are only relevant if indeed I said that every human trait or action was a survival mechanism, which of course I never said.

As we know the first order of business for even the simplest micro-organism is to survive, the next order is to propagate.

The simple neuro-chemical releases that govern emotions such as love in this case, cannot be denied as a survival mechanism towards the security of a Self-Conscious species as ourselves.

When we examine the progression of Love in mentally stable human beings we find there to be "falling in Love" which includes sexual attraction, possession, and domination. Once bearing child this Love transforms into a loving and caring for, if not protective type of Love, again securing the propagation of species, after birth the Love again transforms into a rearing form of Love meant to keep the roaming male attached to the family unit.

Of course this is only one aspect of a certain form of Love.

Ahh, and when you click from the back part of the brain forward into the prefrontal lobes, you get empathy.

 

[Bhaktajan II]

To me, God is LOVE.

So love arrises from Persona(s) toward other Persona(s) ---yes?

So we are Persona(s) ---yes?

So God is a singular absolute Persona ---Correct?

 

[Saltmeister]

When a soldier jumps on a grenade to save the others in his troop, how is that ensuring the propogation of his genes?

It's not a survival mechanism for his own genes, but a survival mechanism for the rest of his species, clan, tribe or family. For example, he wouldn't try to save a monkey, wombat or extraterrestrial. He would try to save his brother or fellow countrymen.

 

[Etu Malku]

It's not a survival mechanism for his own genes, but a survival mechanism for the rest of his species, clan, tribe or family. For example, he wouldn't try to save a monkey, wombat or extraterrestrial. He would try to save his brother or fellow countrymen.

Or child, or spouse!

 

[IowaGuy]

For example, he wouldn't try to save a monkey, wombat or extraterrestrial. He would try to save his brother or fellow countrymen.

Well, actually some humans do try to save animals. Let's consider vegetarianism/veganism, by those who choose not to eat meat for the "love" of animals. Is veganism a survival mechanism for the human species?

And in the soldier example, why would he exterminate his own chance of reproduction just to let other humans reproduce in his absence? Are you implying that this "survival mechanism for the rest of his species" somehow developed via evolution?

Perhaps I'm naive, but I like to think that we humans have are not bound to our primitave urges for survival, and instead take actions such as not eating meat and sacrificing our own life to save the life of others, not out of "survival" but out of something greater.

 

[IowaGuy]

Your 2nd two questions are only relevant if indeed I said that every human trait or action was a survival mechanism, which of course I never said.

Can you give examples of any human traits or actions that you think are NOT some sort of survival mechanisms?

 

[Persona]

But the love of a parent (at least for me, personally) is not based on conditions. I love my child regardless of whether he graduates from college, or whether she gets pregnant at 16, or whether he gets arrested, etc. No matter what that child does, no matter what mistakes he makes in life, no matter if we get in a fight and he tells me he hates me, I will always love him. That is unconditional love, "loving without condition".

As a mother, I admit that as much as I love my children, I am not capable of unconditional love, for the simple fact that my awareness for what is best for them is limited/conditional.

 

[Persona]

So love arrises from Persona(s) toward other Persona(s) ---yes?

Yes, but not only that way.
Love is wanting what's best for whoever or whatever (yourself, others, plants, the world etc.). This wanting what's best is based on an appreciation & hope that whatever is best will be somehow rewarding for the one loving.

So we are Persona(s) ---yes?

"Persona" is defined as: "The aspect of someone's character that is presented to or perceived by others." Online, you have no idea what I look like, what I hope/fear, how I spend my time, what I eat... etc. All you see is a tiny little part... symbols (letters) on a screen motivated by my thoughts & feelings & decisions. So, no, we are not personas, but personas may apear to be what we are.

So God is a singular absolute Persona ---Correct?

To some, yes. But to me, no. I believe God to be that which is GoOD - or more specifically resonating with that which is good, even that which we don't understand completely (which is mostly the case). The many forces that are at work toward loving/striving for what's best (from the itty bitty microbes, to enormous suns in our universe) - are summarized by the name "God."