Salvation not restricted to Christains

[pattimax]

Of course that is difficult, however I will point out the folks at WAVA in Washington, who specifically declare "Of the 130,000,000 Chinese" who are Christian, 70,000,000 have no bible to speak of...so, it gives me pause to wonder: Out of 1.6 billion Chinese, only 130,000,000 are Christian?

Must not be doing much of a bang up job in a land that is populated with 20% of the earth's people.

No, Christians are not doing a good job of spreading the news, and in one Country, the evidence is paramount.

The fact is that Christians have become complacent...(let the media spread the word). We have LESS missionaries (by 50%), then we had ten years ago.

So, I disagree with your statement that Christians are doing a bang up job of spreading the news, and have the facts to back my thoughts up.

Christians are becoming "armchair warriors"...tough to swallow, but the truth.

v/r

Joshua

Okay. Christians are waking up. My saying that they are doing an excellent job of spreading the gospel was a little premature... we'll talk in a couple years.

You are wrong about China if you are going by government statistics... the government in China is usually the last to know. Is this where your facts come from?

It has been a long day, I will talk to you soon.

 

[pattimax]

Which cruelness do you speak? If one reads the bible literally G-d can be quite cruel...but I don't follow what you are referring to here.

I am referring to good people that have never heard the gospel.

 

[Quahom1]

Okay. Christians are waking up. My saying that they are doing an excellent job of spreading the gospel was a little premature... we'll talk in a couple years.

You are wrong about China if you are going by government statistics... the government in China is usually the last to know. Is this where your facts come from?

It has been a long day, I will talk to you soon.

Not the Government, but WAVA. You'll have to tell the likes of Janet Partial, your descrepancy concerns.

WAVA claims authority in knowing the number of Christians around the world...including China, Siberia, Africa, South America, the Aleutian chain...

v/r

Joshua

edit: I've spent years in the far east...and they do not know the word of God...but I was trying to be polite about the issue...

 

[Prober]

Christians are becoming "armchair warriors"...tough to swallow, but the truth.

v/r

Joshua

This is what I admire about the JWs. I don't agree with everything they say, but at least they get out there to spread the message.

 

[Faithfulservant]

Christians are becoming "armchair warriors"...tough to swallow, but the truth.

Now I see the insult..

I dont know whats worse that or the bit about needing to be leashed.

I wonder if you include yourself in that armchair warrior bit, Joshua.

 

[wil]

I wonder how people can think that God could be so cruel.

I am referring to good people that have never heard the gospel.

Yes, exactly why I agree with the title. Not just because currently a huge percentage of the population has heard the word, nor because most of the population in history has never heard the word...

But because as humans it takes us more than one touch to determine what is hot...and when to keep an umbrella or coat handy...we've all been caught in the rain...more than once...and wished we had a warmer jacket with us...more than once and been burnt....more than once...

So to me once...one lifetime...isn't always enough to understand what others are trying to say...and say the missionary isn't quite upto par...
doesn't quite no the language or lingo it takes to get through the people, doesn't have the tact or the ability to convey the message properly...and heaven knows plenty of missionaries with the best of intentions have been lured off course and left folks with a view of Christianity that is less than admirable in life....surely one wouldn't condemn those that didn't follow such folk...

I think a huge mistake some people are making is trying to equate not knowing about Jesus Christ ... with denying He exists or trying to make him equal to things lesser.

These are two totally different ball parks.

I put em in the same park, we are all works in progress, all doing the best with the knowledge we currently have. Now if they get to the next turnstyle and He is standing there saying 'Well I see you as on the fence...what is your decision about me now...'

 

[cyberpi]

Now I see the insult..

I dont know whats worse that or the bit about needing to be leashed.

I wonder if you include yourself in that armchair warrior bit, Joshua.

Would you stop picking on Joshua... it is like you are trying to divide and run every alleged Christian out.
A person would only be an armchair warrior if they were in the service of war.

 

[Faithfulservant]

Would you stop picking on Joshua... it is like you are trying to divide and run every alleged Christian out.
A person would only be an armchair warrior if they were in the service of war.

Christians get hurt feelings too.

 

[cyberpi]

Christians get hurt feelings too.

Sure, but I don't think you should. If God forgives a person then wouldn't that person want to forgive others? To forgive oneself?

Sorry if my remark seemed snide... I of course rekindled the thread where it was deemed that I was a spade trying to divide Christians, which kind of sounded like an armchair warrior, so I embellished. Same same? No? Ok, will you forgive me for being snide?

 

[Faithfulservant]

Sure, but I don't think you should. If God forgives a person then wouldn't that person want to forgive others? To forgive oneself?

Sorry if my remark seemed snide... I of course rekindled the thread where it was deemed that I was a spade trying to divide Christians, which kind of sounded like an armchair warrior, so I embellished. Same same? No? Ok, will you forgive me for being snide?

Always I have my snide moments as well

 

[Quahom1]

Now I see the insult..

I dont know whats worse that or the bit about needing to be leashed.

I wonder if you include yourself in that armchair warrior bit, Joshua.

You do not know me from Adam, madam...watch the tongue, it might get you into trouble.

 

[Faithfulservant]

You dont know me either.. period.

 

[Quahom1]

You dont know me either.. period.

I know you didn't do well in English grammar. I know you have a big heart. I know you've been around the block a time or two (just like me). I know you are tough, but don't want to be. I know your heart is in the right place. I know your husband is alot like my dad, and you drive him sometimes. And I know you tend to get yourself into hot water, and then expect him to bail you out...

I know he hates that with a passion, but loves you more.

How am I doing so far?

v/r

Joshua

 

[Faithfulservant]

I know you didn't do well in English grammar. I know you have a big heart. I know you've been around the block a time or two (just like me). I know you are tough, but don't want to be. I know your heart is in the right place. I know your husband is alot like my dad, and you drive him sometimes. And I know you tend to get yourself into hot water, and then expect him to bail you out...

I know he hates that with a passion, but loves you more.

How am I doing so far?

v/r

Joshua

The majority of that post wouldnt have bothered me...and I might have agreed to SOME of it.. except you started it with an insult. why?

 

[Quahom1]

The majority of that post wouldnt have bothered me...and I might have agreed to SOME of it.. except you started it with an insult. why?

No I did not. I stated a fact.

Your grammar is in need of refinement. But do not take my word for it...review your own posts...

I was simply noting, what I "know" about you.

The perceived "insult" is in your own mind, not in mine.

v/r

Joshua

BTW: I believe that is called "Changing the subject".

 

[pattimax]

Not the Government, but WAVA. You'll have to tell the likes of Janet Partial, your descrepancy concerns.

WAVA claims authority in knowing the number of Christians around the world...including China, Siberia, Africa, South America, the Aleutian chain...

v/r

Joshua

edit: I've spent years in the far east...and they do not know the word of God...but I was trying to be polite about the issue...

You politeness is appreciated. I am guilty of being over zealous for my Lord. I have this thing about being thought of as warm spit.

Nonetheless, the facts are not there and I AM sorry.

Sincerely, Karen

 

[pattimax]

...I put em in the same park, we are all works in progress, all doing the best with the knowledge we currently have. Now if they get to the next turnstyle and He is standing there saying 'Well I see you as on the fence...what is your decision about me now...'

There is quite a bit of info out there. Face it, a good debater can prove anything.

The Lord Knows your heart.(capital K) You snap decision will matter not.

 

[Quahom1]

You politeness is appreciated. I am guilty of being over zealous for my Lord. I have this thing about being thought of as warm spit.

Nonetheless, the facts are not there and I AM sorry.

Sincerely, Karen

I have no idea what you are talking about. And no one accused anyone else of lack of or an over abundance of "zeal".

Here are some facts:

Religions of the world: numbers of adherents; growth rates

Christians by Country:

Christianity by country - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The bottom line is Christianity is falling, and is being out paced, and is splitting into splinter groups. It is also not known world wide.

You made a point that perhaps 10 years ago missionaries might not have been doing a good job of getting the news out, but today it's much better.

In China alone, (3-5% Christian) the missionaries have not caused any real growth since 1925.

Africa has a 48% Christian populace (and that is stretching the numbers).

India, the largest Democracy in the world ... 2% Christian.

We are not doing a bangup job of getting the word out. In fact we were doing a better job 100 years ago, than today.

v/r

Joshua

 

[juantoo3]

Kindest Regards, all!

We are not doing a bangup job of getting the word out. In fact we were doing a better job 100 years ago, than today.

If I may chime in briefly?

Would this not be towards the end of the colonial era, and nominal conversions be due to the last vestiges of same?

I might point out, it is effectively illegal to be Christian in China...missionaries there literally put their lives on the line to smuggle Chinese language Bibles into the country. So I would think 3-5% quite generous and inflated.

 

[Quahom1]

Kindest Regards, all!

If I may chime in briefly?

Would this not be towards the end of the colonial era, and nominal conversions be due to the last vestiges of same?

I might point out, it is effectively illegal to be Christian in China...missionaries there literally put their lives on the line to smuggle Chinese language Bibles into the country. So I would think 3-5% quite generous and inflated.

I agree Juan. The point I was/am making is that Christians are not getting out there in the real world in the numbers and strength as previously suggested. And there are vast areas of this planet that have not heard the word of "God" as a result.

BTW, WAVA is sponsoring a goal to send 30,000 bibles into China, as I write...CONAIR anyone?